TPMS Replacement

[Diamond]

Looking to get an idea of what the TPMS replacement cost would be? Are both the front and the back sensors the same part number 21176-0748? I figure a bike shop would be pretty expensive even if I bring them the tires.

[maxtog]

Looking to get an idea of what the TPMS replacement cost would be? Are both the front and the back sensors the same part number 21176-0748? I figure a bike shop would be pretty expensive even if I bring them the tires.

I have never had to pay for it, because I have had them replaced only under extended warranty.  But they are not cheap.  I think a dealer will charge over well over $213 per sensor, just for the parts (which is the online list price). I hope those who have paid will post some recent numbers.  Front and rear are the same part.

The dealer will also charge labor for unmounting the wheels and tires and balancing both, in addition to the sensor swap and programming.  So it makes sense to hold on sensor replacement until you need new tires mounted.  The dealer SHOULD NOT charge you TWICE for that, so discuss with the service manager in advance if you are ALSO mounting new tires!  Actually installing and programming the sensors I would guess shouldn't be more than 15 min if they know what they are doing and this is on top of the mount/unmount/etc of wheels/tires.

It is unlikely a non-dealer bike repair shop will have the computer/software/equipment to program/activate the sensors.

The old style (non-sealed) sensors typically last about 3 to 4 years, depending on how often the bike is ridden.  My first set only lasted 3 and were replaced, under warranty with the newer (sealed) type.  The newer type is "supposed" to last "much longer", but we don't have enough data to really know that yet.  One of those two newer ones I had failed (no reading, front) after 5 years and was replaced under warranty (10/2019), right before my last possible extended warranty expired.  That problem wasn't low battery, just intermittently not working at all.

[jwh20]

Looking to get an idea of what the TPMS replacement cost would be? Are both the front and the back sensors the same part number 21176-0748? I figure a bike shop would be pretty expensive even if I bring them the tires.

First of all, there is no point in trying to save money by taking the wheels to the dealer.  After the TPMS modules are replaced the the bike's KiPass ECU must be programmed to recognize the new modules.  Doing this requires a KDS3 unit and software.  Without this, the bike will not read the new sensors.  You'll have the same problem if you just buy the modules from an online Kawasaki parts dealer, there is still the problem of programming.  Note, however, that there are some forum members who own a KDS3, so ask around in your area if there is an active COG group where you live/ride.

If your TPMS modules are of the "old" style, then my recommendation is to have someone replace the batteries with new ones.  It's easy to do if you are handy with a soldering iron or there are a number of forum members who will do it for you for a reasonable fee.  Note: The old-style have a round "nut" below the valve stem vs. a hex "nut" on the new style, so they are easy to tell apart.

If your modules are of the "new" style, they are basically cast-in-stone and replacing the batteries is nearly impossible.  If your bike is still under a Kawasaki Warranty, original or extended, the replacement of the modules as well as the programming should be covered at no cost to you.  But I'd only do this with the new style of module.

Note that there are some TPMS modules that are advertised to be C14 compatible on auction sites.  These may or may not be compatible and you still must get bike programmed to read them.  I don't recommend these as you don't really know for sure if they will work until after you buy, install, and pay the dealer to try to do the programming.

Update: Attached is a photo of the new vs. old TPMS modules.  Old style is in hand, new style is in the wheel.

[PH14]

I got tired of the low battery warning hijacking the dash, so I decided to let mine die. My front had been giving me the warning for a long time. I could have had them replaced shortly before the last of my nine years of warranty expired, but I was traveling a lot, and decided to simply let it die. I have had four replaced over the years, two for low battery, and two because idiot mechanics broke them when installing a tire, so mine were the new models. If they didn't require the computer to program, and standard sensors could be used, I would probably keep them on the bike. The badly designed system isn't worth the high cost of replacement to me though.

I have yet to have any TPMS system let me know I had a tire problem, before I already caught the tire problem. I have had them tell me the TPMS system had a problem.  I had a nail in a tire on my C14 and noticed the lower pressure before the TPMS did.

I was in heaven when the front sensor finally died, and the warning stopped...and now, the rear sensor is giving the warning. If history repeats itself, in about two years it will finally die and the warning will go away. 

[maxtog]

>"I have yet to have any TPMS system let me know I had a tire problem, before I already caught the tire problem. "

There is more to it than push notifications of major events.  I check the pressures when leaving, every time.  That way I can maintain the proper pressure at all times, which I believe greatly extends tire life (and I have some incredible tire life numbers).  If I had to manually check them, I wouldn't do it very often because I am far too lazy.  Mine also gave me warning when I had a nail, which was very helpful.

I agree with you that the system is poorly designed in at least three ways:

1) The battery should be replaceable and/or rechargeable.
2) The battery should be much larger and last much longer.
3) The battery low indicator should be less irritating and a permanent "dismiss" option available.

And the sensors are much, much too expensive (which is not a design problem, per-se).  However, for many, the system has a lot of utility, purpose, and advantage.

What I really wish for would be a replacement EXTERNAL version (not inside the wheel, but outside) that is fully compatible with the C14, with replaceable/chargeable batteries.  Thus, it would operate the same and yet solve all the design problems.  That would even be worth paying $220+ per wheel, because it would likely be a one-time expense and never involve any dealer, programming, labor, or full replacement just because the battery is dead.

[PH14]

>"I have yet to have any TPMS system let me know I had a tire problem, before I already caught the tire problem. "

There is more to it than push notifications of major events.  I check the pressures when leaving, every time.  That way I can maintain the proper pressure at all times, which I believe greatly extends tire life (and I have some incredible tire life numbers).  If I had to manually check them, I wouldn't do it very often because I am far too lazy.  Mine also gave me warning when I had a nail, which was very helpful.

I agree with you that the system is poorly designed in at least three ways:

1) The battery should be replaceable and/or rechargeable.
2) The battery should be much larger and last much longer.
3) The battery low indicator should be less irritating and a permanent "dismiss" option available.

And the sensors are much, much too expensive (which is not a design problem, per-se).  However, for many, the system has a lot of utility, purpose, and advantage.

What I really wish for would be a replacement EXTERNAL version (not inside the wheel, but outside) that is fully compatible with the C14, with replaceable/chargeable batteries.  Thus, it would operate the same and yet solve all the design problems.  That would even be worth paying $220+ per wheel, because it would likely be a one-time expense and never involve any dealer, programming, labor, or full replacement just because the battery is dead.

I manually check my pressure most every time I ride. It only takes a minute or two. On trips, I check the tires every morning. The only time I don't, is if I am taking a short trip in town to run errands, and if the bike hasn't been ridden for a while, I check the pressure even for a short ride in town. As I said, on every vehicle I own, I have always noticed the tire problem before the sensors did. By the time the sensor would catch it, they are already quite low in my experience. I don't let them get that low. On a car, I notice the difference in the way the car handles before they get that low.

 I already get great tire mileage so I must be doing alright. I got 10,200 miles out of the stock rear tire and 8,200 out of the front, and about the same from my PR4s as well. I didn't get as much out of the Angels.

As I said before, if the C14 used standard sensors, and didn't need programed with specialized software, I would probably keep the system working. As it is, their "benefit" is not worth the cost for me.

[maxtog]

I manually check my pressure most every time I ride. It only takes a minute or two.

Well, like I said, I am ultra-lazy

[l.u.v]

Hi!
For me does not worth it to keep oem sensors.
I just replaced them with a very good aftermarket option, see details below.

http://www.zggtr.org/index.php?topic=24489.0

[maxtog]

For me does not worth it to keep oem sensors.
I just replaced them with a very good aftermarket option, see details below.

https://my-fobo.com/Product/FOBOBike
https://www.amazon.com/FOBO-Pressure-Monitoring-Systems-Black/dp/B07PWX4Z9T

That is certainly the best alternative I have seen yet.  Since I use my phone as a GPS/Music anyway, it is already there and doesn't require wiring some type of clunky display somewhere.  And the batteries are standard CR type.  And it matches wheel color (silver or black).    And is only $100!

Wow, thanks for sharing!  Seems almost too good to be true.  This should be great news for many C14 owners.

[PH14]

Well, like I said, I am ultra-lazy

 

[l.u.v]

That is certainly the best alternative I have seen yet. 

Wow, thanks for sharing!  Seems almost too good to be true.  This should be great news for many C14 owners.

Glad to hear that!
They have everything you need, as you see on a screenshot that I made it today after a short walk.
Another important fact is that the producer offers all the support when you have a technical problem.
I own a Huawei who seems that they have some issue when you install the application. The seller was very fast to send emails in Malaysia, the answer was received quickly and issue was very fast resolved!
And worth it every cent, believe me..

[VirginiaJim]

That certainly won't work over here, we run the English system of measurements...

[l.u.v]

It's a matter of choyce actually.. 

[maxtog]

Leave it to Mr. Negative Maxtog....  after researching the system, my concerns with the FOBO 2 are as follows:

1) It looks like it might be enough weight that it might require rebalancing the tires with it attached.  Claim is 7.6 grams or something (which is pretty freaking light).  But that doesn't include the weight of the T valve, which probably weighs much, much more than the sensor...

2) I have had mixed results with bluetooth auto-pairing.  On some devices it works well and I never have to think about it.  On others, I have to manually connect them every time.  If it were the latter, that would be very annoying.  If you have to "connect" and then find and launch an app, then it is losing some of its advantage over just manually checking pressures.

3) It doesn't look like it will support Android Auto, which is the app that (I assume) most everyone would use on the motorcycle.  So I assume checking pressure will require doing it before launching Auto, which is annoying and far less useful, since there would be no continuous, on screen (small) display somewhere.  And if in Auto, I am not sure if an alert would come through (I suspect it would, though).  This is a major disadvantage over the factory system, which can show pressures while riding, instantly.

4) Some users complain it requires Location services/permissions "on", which should not be required and is concerning.  It is a battery-drainer and major privacy concern.

5) It is using Bluetooth 5.  This is good from a range and power standpoint, but I am not sure if it will or will not work with Bluetooth 4 phones (my phone, for example, is a Moto G5 Plus, which doesn't have BT 5).

6) It appears to use cloud data and login credentials.  This, for many, is a no-no.  It means that if the company goes under or decided to not support your device anymore, you have a brick.  It also means it consumes data on your plan, and introduces even more security and privacy concerns.

7) I also have to make a correction, there is no "T" valve assembly included.  Without it, the sensors have to be removed, every time, to inflate the tire or manually check pressures.  And since there is a physical security feature, not having a "T" would make it a royal pain to fill the tires.  (I am correcting previous posting).  The "T" is available as a separate accessory for $12 each for a screw-on type.  But when you do use a screw-on "T", you lose the physical security features, making it much more theftable.

[VirginiaJim]

I know a guy who knows a guy that uses it on his Indian without any issues at all. 

[l.u.v]

1. Maybe or maybe not. Anyway, if you need to rebalance the wheels, where is the problem?
2. I have a Huawei P20 with 4.2 bluetooth, pairing is instantly. I tried with Iphone of a friend, also great
3. You can send an email directly to producer, they use to answer quickly. I did a test and deflated the tire, the alarm sounded instantly and is louder
4. Personally I don't care about this - personal data etc. I know very well that I'm not alone and I have some eyes on me day and night and sleep well with this 
5. Same as 2nd point
6. Same as 4th point. It’s a big Malaysian company with more than 1000 workers, not a small boutique on a street corner
7. You don't lose anything. The anti theft small pieces works pefectly also on T valve. I use mine on the both wheels

[maxtog]

2. I have a Huawei P20 with 4.2 bluetooth,

Cool, I figured it was probably backwards-compatible.

7. You don't lose anything. The anti theft small pieces works pefectly also on T valve. I use mine on the both wheels

I believe one can just unscrew the T where it connects to the factory valve- unless it comes with 4 anti-theft nuts.  Of course, even the anti-theft nuts are just a deterrent.

I learned over my life that user interface and process is often the key factor in how useful technology is/will be.  So now I apply that principle to everything new I encounter.  That is my major concerns with 2) and 3), which are probably the most important in the list (at this point).

[kzz1king]

So I am not to tech so bear with me. I currently have my phone and radar detector plugged into a blue tooth transmitter.  Could My phone still receive from the P20 and then if it did I assume I would get the voice alerts through my Bluetooth earpiece.

[maxtog]

So I am not to tech so bear with me. I currently have my phone and radar detector plugged into a blue tooth transmitter.  Could My phone still receive from the P20 and then if it did I assume I would get the voice alerts through my Bluetooth earpiece.

I think you are asking if you can use your radar detector with a BT transmitter at the same time as being connected to the FOBO.  The answer is "yes."  Bluetooth allows simultaneous devices to be connected at the same time.

Voice alerts depends on your phone settings and on the FOBO software.  If you have your phone speaking all your Android alerts, and the FOBO spits out standard alerts, then yes, you will see/hear them.  But this means the FOBO app will have to be running... either in the background or foreground, and actively paired to the FOBO sensors.

My complaint is that many would want to be able to see/check pressures (not just get critical alerts) while in Android Auto.  I don't think that is possible because FOBO doesn't have an Android Auto plugin.  To me, that is  bizarre, since the whole point of the FOBO system is to be used on transportation devices.... which is exactly when one would be using Android Auto.

Note that getting an alert is great.  But when you hop on the bike and go and don't get an alert, without ever manually checking the app/sensors, you don't really know if things are working or "OK."  Perhaps the tires are low, but not low enough to trigger an alert.  Perhaps you are not connected to the sensors.  Perhaps the app isn't actually running at the time.  Perhaps the OS is in a bad state.  Lots of possibilities.

[l.u.v]

Sure, you must check if the FoBo is running and I do it myself every time when I need to ride.
I don't know what is Android Auto, I have android 9 on my Phone, I also tryied with an IPhone, works perfectly.