Author Topic: Clutch pull  (Read 3418 times)

Offline SmokinRZ

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Clutch pull
« on: October 13, 2019, 10:00:13 PM »
Does anyone lease find the clutch pull a little hard?  When taking multi-day trips I've started having problems with my fingers getting sore.  I kinda cup them around the clutch and pull my arm back for relief.  I have flushed all systems a couple of years ago and I don't think any thing is wrong with the bike, just seems a little harder than my old C10.  I might try some of those knock off levers on ebay.     
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Offline maxtog

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Re: Clutch pull
« Reply #1 on: October 14, 2019, 12:23:32 AM »
Hmm, it is a bit heavy... but it is also a huge engine.  I don't use the clutch for most upshifting, mostly downshifting.  At lights I almost always wait in neutral.
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Offline connie_rider

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Re: Clutch pull
« Reply #2 on: October 14, 2019, 06:20:50 AM »
In the last Concourier there is an article titled Ease the Squeeze.
It sez most riders don't ever remove the pivot pin to clean and lubricate it.
Have you tried that?

Ride safe, Ted

Offline MAN OF BLUES

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Re: Clutch pull
« Reply #3 on: October 14, 2019, 05:48:43 PM »
Sounds like you never pulled a clutch lever on a cable actuated clutch bike...   ::) ::) ::) ::)

lube the pivot pin.

and exercise your hand a bit.



just ride more.

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Offline SmokinRZ

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Re: Clutch pull
« Reply #4 on: October 15, 2019, 06:46:03 AM »
I will pull the pivot bolt and lube that.  I think the clamping force required for a 1400 is the issue and me getting older.  It is only an issue after several hours on back roads, just seems harder than my C10 which wasn't exactly easy.  When maintained properly, a cable actuated clutch can be quit nice.  But yeah I get it, most are not maintained.   
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Offline maxtog

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Re: Clutch pull
« Reply #5 on: October 15, 2019, 03:37:51 PM »
When maintained properly, a cable actuated clutch can be quit nice.  But yeah I get it, most are not maintained.

You would probably be unhappy with a cable-driven clutch on the C14.  A large, powerful engine also requires a large, powerful clutch/spring, and it is a good distance to travel, meaning more friction... hydraulics are better for such a situation.  A cable would likely be harder to pull and would require a lot of travel, and lots of regular adjustment (and more difficult maintenance).  I think Kawasaki made the right choice.
Shoodaben (was Guhl) Mountain Runner ECU flash, Canyon Cages front/rear, Helibars risers, Phil's wedges, Grip Puppies, Sargent World seat-low & heated & pod, Muzzy lowering links, Soupy's stand, Nautilus air horn, Admore lightbar, Ronnie's highway pegs, front running lights, all LED, helmet locks, RAM Xgrip, Sena SMH10, Throttle Tamer, MRA X-Creen, BearingUp Shifter, PR4-GT, Scorpion EXO-T1200,etc

Offline VirginiaJim

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Re: Clutch pull
« Reply #6 on: October 22, 2019, 01:01:59 PM »
My clutch cable pull on the Indian (much larger bike than the C14) is about the same...
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Offline jimmymac

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Re: Clutch pull
« Reply #7 on: October 22, 2019, 01:08:10 PM »
Nobody cares about your farm implement Indian.
We're talking performance bikes here, not hit and miss engines from the teens. ::)
The grass isn't always greener.

Offline VirginiaJim

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Re: Clutch pull
« Reply #8 on: October 22, 2019, 01:41:09 PM »
 :rotflmao: :rotflmao: :rotflmao: :rotflmao:
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Offline tweeter55

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Re: Clutch pull
« Reply #9 on: October 22, 2019, 04:14:05 PM »
My old RT had one of these & it worked like a dream. Doesn't seem like it should disengage/engage properly but it did. It was stop & go across the bridge into Canada & saved my left hand from falling off.
http://www.benchmarkworks.com/articles/howto/clutch.html
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Offline maxtog

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Re: Clutch pull
« Reply #10 on: October 22, 2019, 04:24:16 PM »
My old RT had one of these & it worked like a dream. Doesn't seem like it should disengage/engage properly but it did. It was stop & go across the bridge into Canada & saved my left hand from falling off.
http://www.benchmarkworks.com/articles/howto/clutch.html

"Add the "Easy Clutch" to your classic and vintage BMW and it lessens the force required to pull the clutch lever. The effort required to operate the clutch is less than half of the stock setup!"


Physics :)  Their statement is not actually fully accurate (by wording and by omission).  The amount of effort (work) is the same before and after the modification.  The work is pressure/force over distance.  What they are doing is exactly what any pulley does- it reduces the amount of force, but you have to apply that force over more distance.  So what this means is to halve the amount of force of the clutch, you must pull it twice as far each time.  A good comparison is lifting a 10 pound weight 10 times is the same amount of effort as lifting a 20 pound weight 5 times.
Shoodaben (was Guhl) Mountain Runner ECU flash, Canyon Cages front/rear, Helibars risers, Phil's wedges, Grip Puppies, Sargent World seat-low & heated & pod, Muzzy lowering links, Soupy's stand, Nautilus air horn, Admore lightbar, Ronnie's highway pegs, front running lights, all LED, helmet locks, RAM Xgrip, Sena SMH10, Throttle Tamer, MRA X-Creen, BearingUp Shifter, PR4-GT, Scorpion EXO-T1200,etc

Offline MAN OF BLUES

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Re: Clutch pull
« Reply #11 on: October 22, 2019, 05:24:22 PM »
silly stuff...
I don't really think that effort "explanation" really is right either...

I guess that's why I use small glasses when I drink beer.. reduces my "lift effort"..
anyways, a "single pully does not reduce effort.. just changes the direction of the pull...  E=W
in order to "reduce" effort"  a second pully must be added into the equation, and there in lies the "reduction", but again, some effort is lost due to friction on the pullies..

https://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/pulleys-d_1297.html


what is being seen in that BMW farkle, is not really due to the directional change, as much as because of the "lever" principle, based on the actual "diameter" of said chain gear ;  which does give specific advantage of the "lever" due to it's "distance from the rotational axis"

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Offline maxtog

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Re: Clutch pull
« Reply #12 on: October 22, 2019, 05:38:37 PM »
a "single pully does not reduce effort.. just changes the direction of the pull... 

True, I should have said "pulley system"
Shoodaben (was Guhl) Mountain Runner ECU flash, Canyon Cages front/rear, Helibars risers, Phil's wedges, Grip Puppies, Sargent World seat-low & heated & pod, Muzzy lowering links, Soupy's stand, Nautilus air horn, Admore lightbar, Ronnie's highway pegs, front running lights, all LED, helmet locks, RAM Xgrip, Sena SMH10, Throttle Tamer, MRA X-Creen, BearingUp Shifter, PR4-GT, Scorpion EXO-T1200,etc

Offline MAN OF BLUES

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Re: Clutch pull
« Reply #13 on: October 22, 2019, 05:52:32 PM »
also, on this same lever thing, and owning an old KZ, with a cable clutch, I'll note that the "actuator" on that bike does this exact thing....
The cable end terminates on a sort of "disk", about 2" in diameter, and when the cable is pulled, the disk rotates; the disk is attached to a "helical" (i.e. thread type, here again, a "thread" is just an adaptation of an "inclined plane", wrapped around a central axis) and when the disk rotates, the thread causes a change in direction along "IT's" axis, turning rotation force, into linear force, pushing on the rod to press the spring loaded clutch disc.

soooo.. the larger the actual "pully" diameter you have, given friction free movement, the less effort needs to be applied to the lever (that imaginary line from the center of the pully, to it's outer diameter), and less pull distance as a result, with a greater outcome of "work performed" by the "effort".

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Offline maxtog

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Re: Clutch pull
« Reply #14 on: October 22, 2019, 06:00:12 PM »
soooo.. the larger the actual "pully" diameter you have, given friction free movement, the less effort needs to be applied to the lever (that imaginary line from the center of the pully, to it's outer diameter), and less pull distance as a result, with a greater outcome of "work performed" by the "effort".

Unless I just misread what you wrote, that is impossible.  It violates physics.  The amount of work/energy required to activate the clutch is a constant.  If it requires X newton meters, then that is the work.  You can't change total work needed with pullies, discs, cables, levers, gears, anything.  You can change the distance/motion, which will inversely affect the effort, or vice versa.
Shoodaben (was Guhl) Mountain Runner ECU flash, Canyon Cages front/rear, Helibars risers, Phil's wedges, Grip Puppies, Sargent World seat-low & heated & pod, Muzzy lowering links, Soupy's stand, Nautilus air horn, Admore lightbar, Ronnie's highway pegs, front running lights, all LED, helmet locks, RAM Xgrip, Sena SMH10, Throttle Tamer, MRA X-Creen, BearingUp Shifter, PR4-GT, Scorpion EXO-T1200,etc

Offline connie_rider

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Re: Clutch pull
« Reply #15 on: October 23, 2019, 08:18:55 AM »
Ya'll 2 bulls are just butting heads, and getting way to deep.
The system makes it easier to pull in the clutch lever.
         E'nuf sed..  :thumbs:

Ride safe, Ted

Offline SmokinRZ

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Re: Clutch pull
« Reply #16 on: October 26, 2019, 06:04:06 PM »
My old RT had one of these & it worked like a dream. Doesn't seem like it should disengage/engage properly but it did. It was stop & go across the bridge into Canada & saved my left hand from falling off.
http://www.benchmarkworks.com/articles/howto/clutch.html


 ;D I just replaced the cable operated clutch on my R1100GS and it is smooth as butter with easy pull.  The last big Japanese bike I had with a cable was a CBR1000RR and it seemed easier.  It is really only noticeable on long days.     
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Offline SmokinRZ

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Re: Clutch pull
« Reply #17 on: November 19, 2019, 06:06:48 AM »
Update: I took the lever off and cleaned and greased all the pivot points.  I moved the master cylinder as far inboard in the handlebar as much as possible so that I was reaching the end of the lever.   Then I installed those cheap Ebay pazzo knock off levers.  It is noticeably better now.       
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Offline chap

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Re: Clutch pull
« Reply #18 on: November 19, 2019, 09:44:13 AM »
You could try learning how to do clutchless shifting. I do that all the time, There are many videos on utube to show you how. The connie does it very well. I use it mostly upshifting.
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Offline gPink

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Re: Clutch pull
« Reply #19 on: November 19, 2019, 03:52:10 PM »
Why?