Author Topic: Trackday on the ZG1400  (Read 5372 times)

Offline sportytoes

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Trackday on the ZG1400
« on: May 28, 2017, 08:34:40 AM »
Hi team,
I am going through the logistics of doing a trackday on my Connie. Why?  I usually do trackdays trailering my track only SV650S. Been doing this for years. The SV is a floggable hoot at the track and I am a solid "B" group rider, having ridden streetbikes for 26 years. I want to take a 700lb, 150 HP 2008 bike to the track for the simple task of learning how my skills are best applied to this platform. My SV does not have ABS shaft drive or anywhere near this much mass. This is analogous to taking a defensive pistol to the gun range. Then finding yourself in a real world defensive situation holding a shotgun.

Any of yall doing trackdays on a Connie? Looking for tips on the logistics. Anybody with their own lessons learned doing this, I am interested in your experience. Here are some of my current considerations:

1. Trailering is out because connie does not load into my small trailer.
2. Arriving at the track I only get 30 minutes to sign in , prep the bike and get through tech. Efficiency is critical here. Any tips?
3. All the lights, mirrors and license plate must be taped. I would rather remove the mirrors but concened I won't have time. Can it be done? Never tried removal so no frame of reference. Saddle bags would be removed logically.
4. Should I pull the center stand? Does it present a ground clearance issue?
5. I have a pilot road 2 on the front and a PR3 on the back. Nearly new. Running 37 psi on both. Any pressure recommendations? Will check with Michelin otherwise.
6. There is always suspension setup support at the track. Will invest in this service.
7. Any other tips to shed some weight from the bike? I'd love to remove the aluminum rack on the back in general. At best I only do very light weight touring. I just not have found a solution for mounting a tail light.

Thanks for sharing your experience with me.

PS: To those that ask, "what if you crash". Same as a street ride.




Crashed before, will crash again. Hopefully in a soft spot at a trackday.

Offline gPink

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Re: Trackday on the ZG1400
« Reply #1 on: May 28, 2017, 08:53:58 AM »
There is a thread over on the COG forum on a track day held at a track in FL. Sounds like they had a good time.

Offline maxtog

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Re: Trackday on the ZG1400
« Reply #2 on: May 28, 2017, 09:52:58 AM »
3. All the lights, mirrors and license plate must be taped. I would rather remove the mirrors but concened I won't have time.

I wouldn't remove them, just tape and fold them in

Quote
4. Should I pull the center stand? Does it present a ground clearance issue?

No (Not that I am aware of)

Quote
6. There is always suspension setup support at the track. Will invest in this service.

That would be a good investment.  But if it is for normal riding later, make sure to have bags on during it (although it is not like they weigh THAT much)

Quote
I just not have found a solution for mounting a tail light.

Admore?  http://www.zggtr.org/index.php?topic=2505.0

Quote
PS: To those that ask, "what if you crash". Same as a street ride.

ATGATT :)  Good time to add the crash bars....  http://www.zggtr.org/index.php?topic=7593.0

PS- if you haven't flashed the ECU yet, now it is the time....  http://www.zggtr.org/index.php?topic=20462.0
Shoodaben (was Guhl) Mountain Runner ECU flash, Canyon Cages front/rear, Helibars risers, Phil's wedges, Grip Puppies, Sargent World seat-low & heated & pod, Muzzy lowering links, Soupy's stand, Nautilus air horn, Admore lightbar, Ronnie's highway pegs, front running lights, all LED, helmet locks, RAM Xgrip, Sena SMH10, Throttle Tamer, MRA X-Creen, BearingUp Shifter, PR4-GT, Scorpion EXO-T1200,etc

Offline lather

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Re: Trackday on the ZG1400
« Reply #3 on: May 28, 2017, 10:29:29 AM »
I did the COG/MSTA track day in February at Jennings GP in FL. I trailered from Baton Rouge since my trailer is big enough and I  did not want to worry about a hurried prep. However, several COGGERs rode in the day before and camped. Most track I have ridden track days allow camping. My home track is NOLA Motorsports and I just bring my R3 in my cargo van. Before NOLA I would do the same with my 02 SV650 to Circuit Grand Bayou which was even closer to home.

The tape job can be done very quickly if you don't need it to be pretty. The mirror removal is pretty quick and easy  as well. Once you get the black plastic cockpit cover out of the way there are three 10 mm hex nuts to remove from each mirror. The forward lower nut is awkward to get to, a racheting box end will speed it up. You might want to have a short 10 mm bolt with washer to put in one of the empty holes in the  fairing to keep it from flapping at speed.

No problem with center stand. I did scrape the pegs.

I ran Shinko Ravens. Our rider coach suggested starting at our 1 or 2 psi below normal street pressure (42) If you are running 37 on the street I would stick with that.

The good news that I can report is that the C14 (mine is an 08) felt amazingly competent on the track and I had no issues going as fast as I dared to go, I'm just not real brave. Of course that all depends on the track. Jennings is fast and flowing with only a couple of tricky/tight turns. On a tighter track it would not fair as well, I am sure..

Here is a link to some photos from the COG/MSTA track day
http://ridemsta.com/srblog/cogmsta-joint-track-day/
Nothing worse than having your balls go missing.

Offline orangewingnut

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Re: Trackday on the ZG1400
« Reply #4 on: May 30, 2017, 12:54:54 PM »
I have done 5 track days with my 2011 concours. prep was simple enough but check with the outfit that is running the track day. Some require draining the coolant and using water only. Most require safety wire on the oil filter and drain plug. I took off the bags and the rear MCE enterprises guards after the 1st trackday as I was told by other riders that the rear bars came very close to touching down on the curves.
Not being able to see using the side mirrors (I taped them up) was unsettling and took a few laps to get used to. Also I was warned by other riders NOT to look over my shoulder as this was an indication that I was going to move over. Having bikes come up from behind and not seeing them until they were beside you was a challenge as well.
Remember you are not racing and ride within your comfort zone and I'm sure you'll have a great time.
Bill

Offline sportytoes

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Re: Trackday on the ZG1400
« Reply #5 on: May 31, 2017, 09:08:04 PM »
Wow, thanks for the feedback guys!
I had not thought of using the license plate to mount a light. Appreciate that Max!
The camping option is interesting too as it would help buy time for Bike prep. All in all yalls words are encouraging that this is doable. I have been to 4 different tracks in texas and Nola is calling to me. The distance to there though makes the connie a financially better alternative. The truck and trailer is a huge gas suck.
Crashed before, will crash again. Hopefully in a soft spot at a trackday.

Offline sportytoes

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Re: Trackday on the ZG1400
« Reply #6 on: June 28, 2017, 09:43:44 PM »
Signed up for a track day on 7/8/2017. Will ride to the track and run the prep drill once I arrive. Will practice this this weekend to make sure I have it down and have all the necessary tools. Riding the bike should save me 15min over driving the truck and trailer.

I am looking forward to having Roger at ONroad/offroad setup the suspension at the track. I have not done a thing with suspension since I bought the bike so this is overdue and a good time to tackle that chore.

Planning to ride in the novice group to start. I get caught up in the red mist easily so stepping down to that group on a 700lb bike is probably a good idea. At least as a starting point. This will be my first go at the track on a bike that can readily spin the tire under power. New territory for me. I have a brand new leather suit which is baiting the crash gods I'm sure. The end goal is to learn, have fun and ride home with everything still shiny.
Crashed before, will crash again. Hopefully in a soft spot at a trackday.

Offline Goat

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Re: Trackday on the ZG1400
« Reply #7 on: June 29, 2017, 10:33:54 AM »
Roger set up my suspension and it really works great now.  I'm not brave enough for a track day but in the TX Hill Country it is very competent feeling.

Offline deepseamdv

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Re: Trackday on the ZG1400
« Reply #8 on: June 30, 2017, 10:02:48 PM »
What I've found at both track days and California Superbike School on my 09 C14 is that the single biggest difference with a 700 lb bike is it's a lot more work. I run Dunlop Q3+ tires front and rear at 35psi, Ohlins forks and rear shock. The tires are good for two track days but no more. I typically get 6000 road miles from them. It is possible to lean far enough to scrape the lower black cowling. I've also raised the back end 40mm with shorter links. The front is a stock height.


This bike can be a lot of fun on the track but you'll work for it. Ride hard, be safe, have fun.
BSA Gold Star, Norton Commando, Moto Guzzi V-7 Sport, Norton Commando, John Player Norton, BMW R90S, Kawasaki Z-1, Honda CB-650, 09C-14
El Mirage Record Holder A-BG 3000cc 11/83 184.049 mph

Offline sportytoes

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Re: Trackday on the ZG1400
« Reply #9 on: July 04, 2017, 03:40:33 PM »
Interetsing comment on the tire choice. I just finished putting new Q3 tires on both my suzuki SVs. On the SV1000 i am replacing a 120/60-17 slick on the front with a 120/70/17 Q3 to see if my headshake problems can be cured with a different tire. Fingers crossed..
I have been running the same tires (literally) on the 650 for a year and a half. About 8 track days at least (I lost count). So your comment of getting two track days out of tires on the connie gives me pause about considering those. Was wear the deciding factor in replacing them or was cooking the tires and loss of grip the deciding factor? I have been in love with the performance of the Q3s on the little 650.
Crashed before, will crash again. Hopefully in a soft spot at a trackday.

Offline sportytoes

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Re: Trackday on the ZG1400
« Reply #10 on: July 04, 2017, 03:52:16 PM »
The mirror removal is pretty quick and easy  as well. Once you get the black plastic cockpit cover out of the way there are three 10 mm hex nuts to remove from each mirror. The forward lower nut is awkward to get to, a racheting box end will speed it up. You might want to have a short 10 mm bolt with washer to put in one of the empty holes in the  fairing to keep it from flapping at speed.

Here is a link to some photos from the COG/MSTA track day
http://ridemsta.com/srblog/cogmsta-joint-track-day/

I was happy to learn that my aged 2008 model does have one advantage over the 2010+ models: the mirrors come off with 3 screws each, easily accessed from under the mirror bracket. Uses torx bits but they come off in 90 sec. Just the ticket for doing prep at the track.

I hate taping so I'll remove rather than tape wherever possible. I need to remind myself to put the license plate back on before I leave the track. Ending the track day with red and blue flashing lights in my mirrors on the way home would suck. Especially after a track day where 90 mph on the freeway feels like a walking pace. I don't need any extra complications baiting the constabulary.

Crashed before, will crash again. Hopefully in a soft spot at a trackday.

Offline sportytoes

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Re: Trackday on the ZG1400
« Reply #11 on: July 09, 2017, 01:29:28 PM »
Bike and myself left the track at the end of the day just as pretty (more or less) as at the beginning.
Unfortunately the mirrors had to stay on for the day as I brought the wrong torxs bit driver with me.

One of my weaknesses at the track is not dropping my head enough in turns. Those with 2008/2009 connies know the mirrors on those bikes is MUCH lower than later models. The "kiss the mirror" riding approach actually worked great. The mirrors down there was great reminder for me to get my head down. I look forward to the pictures from the track to see if it actually helped me to do so.

Scrape, scrape, scrape:
I hated the carousel turn at Texas world. This bike has ground clearance problems. Roger did the best he could with the stock suspension at 22k miles. But even with my scrawney 155 lb body he could not get enough preload into the back. He thinks the hydraulic preload adjuster has leaked over the years to the point he was out of available preload. As a result I just could not keep the pegs off the tarmac. I had to adjust a lot to get my knee down first. Otherwise every time i get a peg scrape i would hold the throttle enstead of rolling on. It did not make for smooth cornering. I should have taken the feelers off! They are way too long. Lessons for next time.

Time to look for a low mileage shock on ebay. Anyone have other low cost options for a shock?
Crashed before, will crash again. Hopefully in a soft spot at a trackday.

Offline deepseamdv

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Re: Trackday on the ZG1400
« Reply #12 on: July 10, 2017, 12:05:11 AM »
Sportytoes,
Sorry for the long delay. The Q3's generally run out of rubber on the sidewalls after two track days. At 35psi the tire casing is being flexed very hard. I ride this thing like it a S1000. I know they would last a lot longer at 40 psi but at 35 it's like being glued to rails on the track. I'm willing to give up longer tire life in exchange for the feeling of being absolutely planted and being able to come off corners at WFO without wallowing or sliding. You might be surprised at just how hard this bike can be ridden. As for lean clearance after the feelers are gone the next thing to touch down is the lower flat black cowl. At around 51 degrees it will begin scraping.



BSA Gold Star, Norton Commando, Moto Guzzi V-7 Sport, Norton Commando, John Player Norton, BMW R90S, Kawasaki Z-1, Honda CB-650, 09C-14
El Mirage Record Holder A-BG 3000cc 11/83 184.049 mph

Offline sportytoes

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Re: Trackday on the ZG1400
« Reply #13 on: July 10, 2017, 08:33:56 PM »
Thanks for the feedback on the tires. I love my Q3s. I was concernd I might be getting the Pilot roads too hot but looking at the tread they looked like un worn street tires. You could hardly see any wear. I often was worried they would overheat from the load and get greasy. I had the back all out of shape at one point  but in reflection it was just eager throttle application.

Still bummed that the shock can't get enough preload with my 155 lb butt on board. After some googling I can't justify an ohlins expenditure. Hopefully Roger can rehab the stocker. He suggested adding a mechanical spacer shim to get it where it is needed. Glad the bike has a centerstand to help with the next chore.
Crashed before, will crash again. Hopefully in a soft spot at a trackday.

Offline sportytoes

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Re: Trackday on the ZG1400
« Reply #14 on: July 12, 2017, 09:38:42 PM »
Before NOLA I would do the same with my 02 SV650 to Circuit Grand Bayou which was even closer to home.

Have not heard of his track before. Do they still do motorcycle track days? I'm interested even though it looks like some serious travel to get there from Houston.
Crashed before, will crash again. Hopefully in a soft spot at a trackday.

Offline roy826

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Re: Trackday on the ZG1400
« Reply #15 on: July 13, 2017, 08:46:25 AM »
I have been riding\racing on tracks in the southeast for 17 years. Honestly I have never seen a Concours out there. Seen plenty of Busa's, ZX14s and even a few big BMWs. Not saying it is not possible but I find with the linked braking on my 2012 to be terrible for any fast corner type riding. Worst braking system I have ever had the opportunity to ride on. It's so bad it has literally slowed me to a crawl on a spirited street ride and I have not even took it to the N. GA mountains yet. :-\ I am seriously looking into de-linking mine over the winter. I have been researching the procedure.
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Offline connie_rider

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Re: Trackday on the ZG1400
« Reply #16 on: July 13, 2017, 09:32:12 AM »
I'm following tis discussion.
I'm interested in a Trackday but haven't talked myself into it yet.
My plan was; If COG does their Ride Smart event again next year, I'd probably try to make that one.

My biggest concern is tearing up my C-14.
I still have my C-10, and thinking of using that.
Bad idea??

Ride safe, Ted


Offline tweeter55

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Re: Trackday on the ZG1400
« Reply #17 on: July 13, 2017, 11:47:52 AM »
I'm following tis discussion.
I'm interested in a Trackday but haven't talked myself into it yet.
My plan was; If COG does their Ride Smart event again next year, I'd probably try to make that one.

My biggest concern is tearing up my C-14.
I still have my C-10, and thinking of using that.
Bad idea??

Ride safe, Ted


I don't think that would be such a bad idea. My way of thinking, you won't have the seat of the pants  acceleration and straightaway speed but the cornering experience would still exist.  That's where I would get the majority of my adrenaline rush of a track day.
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1972 Suzuki T350R  1979 BMW R100RT
1987 Honda Helix.    2006 Kawasaki Concours