Kawasaki Concours Forum
Mish mash => Open Forum => Topic started by: B.D.F. on March 15, 2018, 04:26:52 PM
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https://www.yahoo.com/news/first-undocumented-immigrant-appointed-state-122408144.html (https://www.yahoo.com/news/first-undocumented-immigrant-appointed-state-122408144.html)
I honestly have no idea what in the hell is going on in some parts of my country. An illegal alien has been appointed to a state post? ?? ?? ?? Of course it is in California, which is not a 'real' state but still, do we have absolutely NO standards? What is next, some Manson family members working in the CA A.G.'s office?
We really should either force ALL of our states to meet some minimum behavioral and legal standards, such as NOT HIRING ILLEGAL ALIENS for gov't jobs, or re- visit the idea of states succeeding from the union and do it from the Union's point of view (rather than 'we want out', it could be 'get out').
This will probably end up in the arena where I will no longer see it but hey, I had to say something.....
Brian
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Oh the irony ;)
"Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me,
I lift my lamp beside the golden door!"
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Oh the irony ;)
"Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me,
I lift my lamp beside the golden door!"
That dog don't hunt no more.
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Also love the fact that via a "due" process known as prosecutorial discretion you can apply to legally stay illegal;)
Still on the bright side this particular individual isn't a criminal or convicted felon and is actively involved in the community, is contributing to the local economy and is presumably paying her taxes.
That said she can't legally own a gun though ;)
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You're wrong on this mikey. This particular individual is a criminal by the very act of being in this country ILLEGALLY.
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Yes, via the golden door. Not under the lead fence, in the middle of the night, breaking US laws with the very act of stepping onto US soil.
Nothing ironic about it Mike- my father- in- law was not born in the US but he came in through the proverbial front door, registered as a resident alien, then learned enough English and US law (which is not very much) and applied and passed the test for citizenship. He was a citizen of the US before I was, and I got my citizenship the easy way :-)
You may try and twist it any way you wish but my post and this thread is not about immigrants, it is about ILLEGAL immigrants. Perhaps you do not have such silly notions in the U.K. and I could come there and live, work or just 'mooch' at my pleasure? I sincerely doubt it though.
I welcome ALL immigrants to the US using any / all of the available channels. I resist Illegal Immigrants in toto but I <especially> resist them VOTING, WORKING, holding any OFFICE, being EDUCATED in public schools and everything else reserved for those who follow the rules.
If you have a passport, take a look and see if it does not say "Subject". Mine says "Citizen", and being a proud member of 'We The People' and a citizen in good standing, I withhold that status for those who have walked in the proverbial front door, not slipped in through the bathroom window.... after hours.....
Brian
Oh the irony ;)
"Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me,
I lift my lamp beside the golden door!"
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Your very post words are incorrect: note the word "illegal" in 'illegal alien'. This person is committing a crime, and is a criminal (currently) just by being here. There is no need to look further or into other facets of her existence: the first word says it all: illegal'. Holding office should not be an issue because she should be in some other country in the first place.
This is like bringing a stolen car in for warranty service. Sheesh!
Brian
Also love the fact that via a "due" process known as prosecutorial discretion you can apply to legally stay illegal;)
Still on the bright side this particular individual isn't a criminal or convicted felon and is actively involved in the community, is contributing to the local economy and is presumably paying her taxes.
That said she can't legally own a gun though ;)
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Still on the bright side this particular individual isn't a criminal or convicted felon and is actively involved in the community, is contributing to the local economy and is presumably paying her taxes.
Yeah, "presumably". I find it unlikely that most illegal immigrants are paying State and Federal income taxes, property taxes, registration and other taxes. Perhaps just sales and consumer taxes, which is not much.
An illegal immigrant is (by definition) a criminal. He/she should not be appointed to anything, vote, be allowed to work, or get any Socialism benefits. He/she should be booted out of the country.
A legal immigrant (often referred to as a "resident") should be able to work (except in most government jobs), must pay taxes, and will be allowed certain benefits. But he/she is not a citizen, should not be appointed to or elected to anything government and should not be able to vote nor get a passport.
Seems simple and fair to me.
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Oh, by the way, I love how the "left" media calls them "undocumented immigrants" instead of the correct term, which is "illegal immigrants". Isn't "undocumented" a wonderful new term they invented to make it sound so much better? Like they belong here but just lost their paperwork or something... right.
"First Undocumented Immigrant Appointed to State Post in California"
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Calling an 'illegal alien' and 'undocumented immigrant' is like calling a 'drug dealer' an 'unlicensed pharmacist'. [that would be chemist for our friends across the pond I believe] No matter the package or how pretty the bow, a box of dog---- is still dog---- when you come down to it. Call it lavender petals if you want, but I stepped in something like that once and had to scrape it off of my shoe. :-(
I really have not been a hard- case on this issue before but I have to say, the excesses in protecting / not ejecting / helping the illegal immigrants is pushing me more and more to the hard- line side of this issue.
Brian (second generation American from LEGAL immigrants)
Oh, by the way, I love how the "left" media calls them "undocumented immigrants" instead of the correct term, which is "illegal immigrants". Isn't "undocumented" a wonderful new term they invented to make it sound so much better? Like they belong here but just lost their paperwork or something... right.
"First Undocumented Immigrant Appointed to State Post in California"
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More like 'undocumented democrats'.
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Oh the irony ;)
"Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me,
I lift my lamp beside the golden door!"
For legal immigration, sure.
And they came, and almost all became citizens, were proud of it, and most all assimilated. They learned English, they got jobs, they voted, cultures merged and spread, they were American. It was good. Not perfect (never was, never well be) but good.
The poem worked out quite well when people wanted to create a great nation. When if you didn't work, you generally went hungry. When if you didn't play well, you were punished. When we didn't tax the hell out of those who do work to give the money to others who don't. When we didn't live in an ever-expanding nanny state that destroys work ethic and rewards. When we didn't pass mass amnesty MULTIPLE TIMES, each with a broken promise to never do it again and a broken promise to secure the borders so we don't went up in the same situation again.
There is a legal way to immigrate, and I (and suspect most people) still welcome immigrants who follow that path. If we want to talk about or criticize the LEGAL path to immigration, that would be a great and interesting discussion. But illegal immigration is a whole other issue. The "left" loves to combine and confuse the two, as if they are the same thing. They are not.
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Those who appointed her should be prosecuted, just like a company hiring an illegal immigrant.
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There is no such thing as an "illegal immigrant".
If you enter the country legally, then you are in immigrant.
If you enter the country illegally, then you are an INVADER, plain and simple. Doesn't matter if you come crashing across the border in a tank or walk through the foothills in worn tennis shoes, you are still an INVADER.
This country in under a state of seige, and we don't recognize it because it is happenning so slowly.
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Oh we have plenty of immigrants both legal & illegal and even the latter can sponge off the welfare state ;)
We also have the concept of Discretionary Right To Stay (effectively your PD) where , as in this case, the person in question was originally brought in as a child by their parents/have been born here after their parents have entered illegally although PD also can be applied for by any illegal immigrant which if granted effectively legalises their illegality
https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=prosecutorial+discretion+usa&oq=prosecutorial+discretion+usa (https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=prosecutorial+discretion+usa&oq=prosecutorial+discretion+usa)
Your very post words are incorrect: note the word "illegal" in 'illegal alien'. This person is committing a crime, and is a criminal (currently) just by being here. There is no need to look further or into other facets of her existence: the first word says it all: illegal'. Holding office should not be an issue because she should be in some other country in the first place.
This is like bringing a stolen car in for warranty service. Sheesh!
Brian
Yes, via the golden door. Not under the lead fence, in the middle of the night, breaking US laws with the very act of stepping onto US soil.
Nothing ironic about it Mike- my father- in- law was not born in the US but he came in through the proverbial front door, registered as a resident alien, then learned enough English and US law (which is not very much) and applied and passed the test for citizenship. He was a citizen of the US before I was, and I got my citizenship the easy way :-)
You may try and twist it any way you wish but my post and this thread is not about immigrants, it is about ILLEGAL immigrants. Perhaps you do not have such silly notions in the U.K. and I could come there and live, work or just 'mooch' at my pleasure? I sincerely doubt it though.
I welcome ALL immigrants to the US using any / all of the available channels. I resist Illegal Immigrants in toto but I <especially> resist them VOTING, WORKING, holding any OFFICE, being EDUCATED in public schools and everything else reserved for those who follow the rules.
If you have a passport, take a look and see if it does not say "Subject". Mine says "Citizen", and being a proud member of 'We The People' and a citizen in good standing, I withhold that status for those who have walked in the proverbial front door, not slipped in through the bathroom window.... after hours.....
Brian
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here's a related question.
Should a child be punished for their parents criminal actions?
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here's a related question.
Should a child be punished for their parents criminal actions?
The law breaking parents should be removed and take their family with them.
By the way how's that EU open borders thing working out for you guys. I read where Londonistan and other formally English cities are not so friendly to the natives anymore. So how would it be if we try to take care of our problem and you'all enjoy your 'immigrants'.
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The law breaking parents should be removed and take their family with them.
By the way how's that EU open borders thing working out for you guys. I read where Londonistan and other formally English cities are not so friendly to the natives anymore. So how would it be if we try to take care of our problem and you'all enjoy your 'immigrants'.
London's a shithole anyways, can't see for the life of me why anyone would want to live there :)
So your answer is "yes , children should be punished for their parents criminal activity"
Correct ?
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The law breaking parents should be removed and take their family with them.
By the way how's that EU open borders thing working out for you guys. I read where Londonistan and other formally English cities are not so friendly to the natives anymore. So how would it be if we try to take care of our problem and you'all enjoy your 'immigrants'.
Well that was an interesting exercise.
Numbers for illegal immigrants in the UK vary between 300,000 & 600,000. If we double that upper figure to 1.2 million (just to give a reasonable overestimate) then based on a population size of 65 million that represents 1.9% of the UK population are here illegally,
I believe the figure for the USA is around 3.4% so yes you do have a bigger problem than us if you view it that way and we appear to be doing a better job already thank you ;)
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ICE should wait for her at her office and just deport her a$$ when she shows up.
https://yescalifornia.org
Give generously.
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London's a shithole anyways, can't see for the life of me why anyone would want to live there :)
So your answer is "yes , children should be punished for their parents criminal activity"
Correct ?
Where's the punishment? Parents are supposed to care for their offspring. We wouldn't want to break up the family unit now would we.
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Well that was an interesting exercise.
Numbers for illegal immigrants in the UK vary between 300,000 & 600,000. If we double that upper figure to 1.2 million (just to give a reasonable overestimate) then based on a population size of 65 million that represents 1.9% of the UK population are here illegally,
I believe the figure for the USA is around 3.4% so yes you do have a bigger problem than us if you view it that way and we appear to be doing a better job already thank you ;)
Yep, good job.
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/islamist-extremists-uk-highest-number-europe-25000-terror-threat-eu-official-isis-islam-britain-a7923966.html (http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/islamist-extremists-uk-highest-number-europe-25000-terror-threat-eu-official-isis-islam-britain-a7923966.html)
NewsUKHome News
UK home to up to 25,000 Islamist extremists who could pose threat, EU official warns
Number is the highest known figure in Europe, amid concern over 'known' extremists launching recent attacks
Lizzie Dearden Home Affairs Correspondent
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here's a related question.
Should a child be punished for their parents criminal actions?
Children are punished all the time for their parents crimes. Kids are separated from their parents every time a criminal that is also a parent goes to jail.
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Yep, good job.
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/islamist-extremists-uk-highest-number-europe-25000-terror-threat-eu-official-isis-islam-britain-a7923966.html (http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/islamist-extremists-uk-highest-number-europe-25000-terror-threat-eu-official-isis-islam-britain-a7923966.html)
NewsUKHome News
UK home to up to 25,000 Islamist extremists who could pose threat, EU official warns
Number is the highest known figure in Europe, amid concern over 'known' extremists launching recent attacks
Lizzie Dearden Home Affairs Correspondent
Not all illegal immigrants are Islamist Extremists (or to put it another way, some of those nutters will be British born/naturalised)
2 seperate issues
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Children are punished all the time for their parents crimes. Kids are separated from their parents every time a criminal that is also a parent goes to jail.
True, will think of a better way of wording it but meanwhile being more specific:
This particular young lady sounds like a big positive vote for democracy and the system in the USA.
First person in her family ever to graduate from College and being so high profile I would imagine she has followed due process and applied for PD to allow her to stay regardless of her parents transgressions in the past .
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although it's also equally likely her appointment is nothing more than cocking a snoot at the opposition ;)
(would be nice to think she had just got it on merit though)
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This particular young lady sounds like a big positive vote for democracy and the system in the USA.
First person in her family ever to graduate from College and being so high profile I would imagine she has followed due process and applied for PD to allow her to stay regardless of her parents transgressions in the past .
This particular young lady is a slap in the face to every legal immigrant who has come to this country and applied for citizenship the legal way.
If she's so wonderful why hasn't she applied for, and become a legal citizen? Seems like she's been here long enough, and she should know the law, one would think, after all, she is a lawyer. Her illegal parents, and her illegal a$$ should be deported for breaking our laws! >:(
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Not all illegal immigrants are Islamist Extremists (or to put it another way, some of those nutters will be British born/naturalised)
2 seperate issues
So all these people and their ancestors are native born Islanders and just happened to convert to radical islam. Got it.
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So all these people and their ancestors are native born Islanders and just happened to convert to radical islam. Got it.
I never said all ;)
But yes there have been examples of both multi generation Brits & naturalised Brits converting
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Interesting view Mike- I actually look at this as a total failure of our democracy.
Our system (as I believe is yours) is based on citizens voting for what they want done. There are only two qualifications for an American to vote:
1) must be a citizen
2) Must have reached 'age of majority'
If people are voting who do not fall into both of these categories, then I would call it a failure of the system and therefore, a failure of democracy in the US. This is, IMO, a truly horrible situation.
The only thing that could happen to make it any worse would be to bring in 'ringers' to vote; not only those unqualified to vote in the first place but those who have a purpose, especially if that purpose supports a political agenda, in swinging a vote a certain way. Illegal Aliens vote a particular way in the US, and it is that party (faction, group, whatever you want to call it) that is pushing for them to be allowed to vote.... of course. If we are going to do that, why not just grab a dictator and be done with all the effort and mechanics of putting on a show that looks like democracy?
But then again, in a sane world, we would not even be discussing the incredibly absurd idea of non- citizens and especially illegal aliens voting because THEY WOULD BE IN BRACELETS (HANDCUFFS) ON THEIR WAY TO THE INTERNATIONAL LINE WHERE THEY WOULD BE GENTLY PRODDED THROUGH A ONE- WAY GATE.
I like other motorcycle riders / owners generally. Not wild about motorcycle thieves though. I feel the same way about immigrants and illegal aliens I guess.
Brian
True, will think of a better way of wording it but meanwhile being more specific:
This particular young lady sounds like a big positive vote for democracy and the system in the USA.
First person in her family ever to graduate from College and being so high profile I would imagine she has followed due process and applied for PD to allow her to stay regardless of her parents transgressions in the past .
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This particular young lady sounds like a big positive vote for democracy and the system in the USA.
Not to me. She's here illegally. She's a trespasser. If a group of 20 people break into your home and live there while you're on vacation, but they do a good job of keeping your house clean while you're away, is that OK? Can they keep living there when you get home?
On a different but similar note: So I'm sitting in a bar across from two very large women and I say, "Cool accents. Are you two from Scotland?" One yells back, "It's WALES YOU IDIOT!" I say, "OK so you are two whales from Scotland?"
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The U.S. contributes to our own problems with conflicting laws and regulations. Since non-citizens can serve in the military, it gives people room to argue that, if someone can fight and die for the U.S., then they should be able to do all other things that citizens can do. That's a question I don't have an answer for, but it does contribute to a "gray area" in immigrants' status.
https://www.thebalance.com/can-a-non-u-s-citizen-join-the-united-states-military-3354092 (https://www.thebalance.com/can-a-non-u-s-citizen-join-the-united-states-military-3354092)
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The U.S. contributes to our own problems with conflicting laws and regulations. Since non-citizens can serve in the military, it gives people room to argue that, if someone can fight and die for the U.S., then they should be able to do all other things that citizens can do. That's a question I don't have an answer for, but it does contribute to a "gray area" in immigrants' status.
https://www.thebalance.com/can-a-non-u-s-citizen-join-the-united-states-military-3354092 (https://www.thebalance.com/can-a-non-u-s-citizen-join-the-united-states-military-3354092)
Just to clarify, that's legal Immigrants on non Citizen status that can serve in some capacities.
Illegal immigrants ae still excluded (unless part of DACA which this young lady has had rejected initially)
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Again, not ILLEGAL aliens. Illegal aliens should not be doing anything here except looking for the nearest exit.
You are talking about legal aliens of one type or another, and that is fine with me, and I think, most Americans. A 'green' card, a visa, permanent resident status, diplomatic posting, a work visa.... there are many ways to be in the US legally while NOT being a citizen and no one I know is opposed to that.
Brian
The U.S. contributes to our own problems with conflicting laws and regulations. Since non-citizens can serve in the military, it gives people room to argue that, if someone can fight and die for the U.S., then they should be able to do all other things that citizens can do. That's a question I don't have an answer for, but it does contribute to a "gray area" in immigrants' status.
https://www.thebalance.com/can-a-non-u-s-citizen-join-the-united-states-military-3354092 (https://www.thebalance.com/can-a-non-u-s-citizen-join-the-united-states-military-3354092)
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The U.S. contributes to our own problems with conflicting laws and regulations. Since non-citizens can serve in the military, it gives people room to argue that, if someone can fight and die for the U.S., then they should be able to do all other things that citizens can do. That's a question I don't have an answer for, but it does contribute to a "gray area" in immigrants' status.
https://www.thebalance.com/can-a-non-u-s-citizen-join-the-united-states-military-3354092 (https://www.thebalance.com/can-a-non-u-s-citizen-join-the-united-states-military-3354092)
"Can" fight and die. Don't have to.
I don't actually know why our military would let non-citizens fight. How do we even know which side they're really on? (not that becoming a citizen guarantees a person is on our side, but it sure seems like a better indicator than somebody who isn't a citizen)
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I don't actually know why our military would let non-citizens fight.
It does seem rather bizarre to me, and I certainly don't support it, myself. Are they THAT desperate to have people enlist??
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It does seem rather bizarre to me, and I certainly don't support it, myself. Are they THAT desperate to have people enlist??
of the 195 countries in the world there's olya relatively small number that allow foreigners to serve in their Military
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_militaries_that_recruit_foreigners#Z
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I do not know why either but they do. In fact, military service as a LEGAL alien is a pathway to citizenship. My F-I-L gained US citizenship by serving 2 yrs. in the US Army and a non- US citizen (but legal resident!).
Brian
"Can" fight and die. Don't have to.
I don't actually know why our military would let non-citizens fight. How do we even know which side they're really on? (not that becoming a citizen guarantees a person is on our side, but it sure seems like a better indicator than somebody who isn't a citizen)
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but you have due process that allows varying methods of allowing illegal immigrants to legalise their status.
Whilst they are following those due processes they are allowed to stay and if State law allows even hold official positions.
All done by the Great American Rule Book ;)
Only once they have exhausted the relevant d process are they liable to deportation.
Similar sort of thing happens in a lot of countries
Side note:
The USA is more like the EU now that I think about it.
A ragtag collection of countries/states with their own legislations which may/may not be at odds with the higher level legislations.
Califormia (as I understand it) deliberately changed their laws to **** off Trump
Again, not ILLEGAL aliens. Illegal aliens should not be doing anything here except looking for the nearest exit.
You are talking about legal aliens of one type or another, and that is fine with me, and I think, most Americans. A 'green' card, a visa, permanent resident status, diplomatic posting, a work visa.... there are many ways to be in the US legally while NOT being a citizen and no one I know is opposed to that.
Brian
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but you have due process that allows varying methods of allowing illegal immigrants to legalise their status.
Whilst they are following those due processes they are allowed to stay and if State law allows even hold official positions.
All done by the Great American Rule Book ;)
Only once they have exhausted the relevant d process are they liable to deportation.
Similar sort of thing happens in a lot of countries
Side note:
The USA is more like the EU now that I think about it.
A ragtag collection of countries/states with their own legislations which may/may not be at odds with the higher level legislations.
Califormia (as I understand it) deliberately changed their laws to **** off Trump
Their laws are unconstitutional as immigration and border security are within the purview of the Fedgov.
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Their laws are unconstitutional as immigration and border security are within the purview of the Fedgov.
One of the few things that actually *is* supposed to be done by the Fed....
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Their laws are unconstitutional as immigration and border security are within the purview of the Fedgov.
Oddly enough it was CBP that stopped and initially detained her & 8 others when they rentered the USA in 2013 via Nogales which I believe is in Arizona.
Due process was then followed and she moved back to California.
All sounds pretty kosher & by the book to me by all concerned ;)
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On a different but similar note: So I'm sitting in a bar across from two very large women and I say, "Cool accents. Are you two from Scotland?" One yells back, "It's WALES YOU IDIOT!" I say, "OK so you are two whales from Scotland?"
lololol
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So she gets appointed as member in an advisory panel, probably non-paying job for which she is eminently qualified. You all are behaving as if she was appointed California AG. Without knowing her parent's background I would label her an American success story. I fully believe in US sovereignty and the need for border and immigration control, but you are not going to deport some 12 million illegal immigrants without some serious disruption to the economy and society. Sure, get rid of the felons and MS-13 gang members, but you cannot abandon compassion and humanity.
Unless you are 100% Native American, we are all frickin' immigrants or descended from immigrants. The display of xenophobia, islamophobia, allegations of voter fraud and irrelevant father-in-law stories makes me wonder if I stumbled into an alt-right convention.
This chick could very well become the Rosa Parks of immigration reform, unless Sessions finds a way to deport her ass back to Mexico as some of you wish. :)
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So what part of illegal don't you understand?
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Somehow you get the impression that I do not understand what illegal means?
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So she gets appointed as member in an advisory panel, probably non-paying job for which she is eminently qualified. You all are behaving as if she was appointed California AG.
If this is a PAID position, then we are rewarding an illegal alien with taxpayer money. Sorry, but I find that offensive.
Without knowing her parent's background I would label her an American success story.
If she were a LEGAL resident, I would also label her an American success story. But she is not. And the fact that she is a lawyer makes it all the more ironic to me.
The display of xenophobia, islamophobia, allegations of voter fraud and irrelevant father-in-law stories makes me wonder if I stumbled into an alt-right convention.
YOU are trying to make this about race, ethnicity, religion, whatever. I am certainly not. I expect most people are not (especially on this forum). I don't care what their backgrounds are, what country they came from, what the color of their skin is, or what religion or other beliefs they have. If they are here illegally, it is wrong. So, you see, that is the exact opposite of "xenophobia, islamophobia", etc.
This chick could very well become the Rosa Parks
Rosa Parks was a citizen.
of immigration reform
If by "reform" you mean just allowing anyone to come in illegally and do whatever they want, I would hardly call that "reform".
unless Sessions finds a way to deport her ass back to Mexico as some of you wish. :)
Is she Mexican? I don't even know... .and don't care.
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If this is a PAID position, then we are rewarding an illegal alien with taxpayer money. Sorry, but I find that offensive.
So the illegal alien doing your roof, landscaping, farm labor, etc. gets paid with non-taxpayer money and that is ok?
If she were a LEGAL resident, I would also label her an American success story. But she is not. And the fact that she is a lawyer makes it all the more ironic to me.
She had an illegal start in the US by being brought in at the age of 14. Still an admirable success story whether she became a lawyer, doctor, or engineer...
YOU are trying to make this about race, ethnicity, religion, whatever. I am certainly not. I expect most people are not (especially on this forum). I don't care what their backgrounds are, what country they came from, what the color of their skin is, or what religion or other beliefs they have. If they are here illegally, it is wrong. So, you see, that is the exact opposite of "xenophobia, islamophobia", etc.
Go back and read the thread to see if you can spot the xenophobia, islamophobia, etc. Kudos to you if you are truly non-discriminatory.
Rosa Parks was a citizen.
Apparently just barely a citizen, Remember having to ride in the back of the bus?
If by "reform" you mean just allowing anyone to come in illegally and do whatever they want, I would hardly call that "reform".
Nobody is denying border security and immigration control. Immigration reform pertains to people who have been here for several years and have been model residents.
Is she Mexican? I don't even know... .and don't care.
Agreed.
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'chick'? your sanctimony is slipping.
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My sanctimony is quite intact, thank you. OTOH, if I had called her a broad, skirt , toots,.......... ;D
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:rotflmao:
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So the illegal alien doing your roof, landscaping, farm labor, etc. gets paid with non-taxpayer money and that is ok?
No, it is not OK. They shouldn't be working. Not only is it illegal to be here without a visa, green card, or citizenship, it is also illegal to hire/pay illegal aliens.
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I know it does not work at my house; with my recent large scale renovations (six digits and climbing), I check I-9 forms, or other equally adequate proof of legal residence and ability to work for all persons working on my property. Most have been Americans but some have been from Central America but they ALL are living and working here legally.
Brian
No, it is not OK. They shouldn't be working. Not only is it illegal to be here without a visa, green card, or citizenship, it is also illegal to hire/pay illegal aliens.
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No, it is not OK. They shouldn't be working. Not only is it illegal to be here without a visa, green card, or citizenship, it is also illegal to hire/pay illegal aliens.
If there is strict enforcement of civil and/or criminal penalties on those employers, illegal immigration will grind to a halt. Problem is there are a lot of hard labor, low paying jobs which will either not get done or cost 2x without the shadow work force. And this is true not just in the southern border states.
(notice how I am unabashedly using the term "illegal aliens" instead of the gentler "undocumented immigrants". Unlike some people who insist on labeling the AR-15 a "modern sporting rifle" instead of the harsher "assault weapon". 8))
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If there is strict enforcement of civil and/or criminal penalties on those employers, illegal immigration will grind to a halt. Problem is there are a lot of hard labor, low paying jobs which will either not get done or cost 2x without the shadow work force. And this is true not just in the southern border states.
(notice how I am unabashedly using the term "illegal aliens" instead of the gentler "undocumented immigrants" democrats". Unlike some people who insist on labeling the AR-15 a "modern sporting rifle" instead of the harsher "assault weapon". 8))
Because an 'assault' weapon is a generic term for any item you assault someone with. Handgun, rifle, baseball bat, rubber chicken. Illegal alien is a specific description of the residential status of an individual person.
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Because an 'assault' weapon is a generic term for any item you assault someone with. Handgun, rifle, baseball bat, rubber chicken.
Oh, the same as gun violence is a generic term for any violence threatened or committed with a gun? Takes a perverse imagination to think of a baseball bat or a rubber chicken as an assault weapon.
Illegal alien is a specific description of the residential status of an individual person.
It is a distasteful description more suited for the Martian who lands in your backyard without your permission.
You know, most immigrants, undocumented or otherwise, are drawn to the fiscal conservatism, law & order and family values which were supposed to be the hallmarks of the Republican party. But those core principles have been abandoned sometime back and the flashes of bigotry that we now see are what is driving them to the Democrats. Even a moderate centrist Republican would do very well at the national and local levels.
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So she gets appointed as member in an advisory panel, probably non-paying job for which she is eminently qualified. You all are behaving as if she was appointed California AG. Without knowing her parent's background I would label her an American success story. I fully believe in US sovereignty and the need for border and immigration control, but you are not going to deport some 12 million illegal immigrants without some serious disruption to the economy and society. Sure, get rid of the felons and MS-13 gang members, but you cannot abandon compassion and humanity.
Unless you are 100% Native American, we are all frickin' immigrants or descended from immigrants. The display of xenophobia, islamophobia, allegations of voter fraud and irrelevant father-in-law stories makes me wonder if I stumbled into an alt-right convention.
This chick could very well become the Rosa Parks of immigration reform, unless Sessions finds a way to deport her ass back to Mexico as some of you wish. :)
Here is a American success story for you if you care to look him up... Moon Kook-jin
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Either the USA or any sovereign country has the right to control the border and who become citizens or they don't. If we do have the right to control the border then we have to make laws as to how people enter and how they become citizens. People that do not follow the laws for entry are illegally entering the country. Either she followed those laws or she didn't. If she didn't then she is here illegally and can be subjected to deportation. Which part of this don't you agree with?
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Either the USA or any sovereign country has the right to control the border and who become citizens or they don't. If we do have the right to control the border then we have to make laws as to how people enter and how they become citizens. People that do not follow the laws for entry are illegally entering the country. Either she followed those laws or she didn't. If she didn't then she is here illegally and can be subjected to deportation. Which part of this don't you agree with?
Assuming that this was addressed to me, I agree with all of it. (Will return later in the day to answer any more questions that you have.)
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Either the USA or any sovereign country has the right to control the border and who become citizens or they don't. If we do have the right to control the border then we have to make laws as to how people enter and how they become citizens. People that do not follow the laws for entry are illegally entering the country. Either she followed those laws or she didn't. If she didn't then she is here illegally and can be subjected to deportation. Which part of this don't you agree with?
She left the country
She then rentered via Arizona and was detained by CBP
She was then subsequently released to return to California
So does that make her semi legal ?
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Well, when you put it that way Mike..... no. :rotflmao:
No more than I am a 'semi- citizen' if I am wearing a blue shirt but a 'full citizen' when wearing a red shirt.
Brian
She left the country
She then rentered via Arizona and was detained by CBP
She was then subsequently released to return to California
So does that make her semi legal ?
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So does that make her semi legal ?
No. But she might be legal if she applied for and received a visa (H1B or otherwise) or green card. Based on the story I only assumed she is illegal. The story may be fake news and she may legal. The point is that federal, state and local government should not be hiring illegals. If they don't follow the law we have anarchy.
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mikey, if you want her to be legal so bad pay for her to come to your country and work it out. That would solve three problems. 1...it would remove an illegal alien from our country and 2...you can satisfy your obsession with this person and 3... we could all move on.
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Well, I do not know about 'solving' the problem. 'Cause after Mike deals with this one particular woman, we have another 9,999,999 left to go and I am thinking Mike will get sick of dealing with this issue before he gets past, oh, two million or so.
:rotflmao:
But now that you mention it Gary, it does give me a thought: The Queen is getting well along in years now, and the heir- apparent is none- too- popular by the looks, so maybe the UK could use someone else to take over the Monarchy. And clearly we have a woman here in the colonies who seems to like official positions and yet should not even be anywhere in the US. And at least one of the US subjects seems to like and support this woman holding office so....... methinks we might have the makins' of a deal that could make everyone happy. I can see the introduction now: "Presenting Her Majesty, Roseanne Roseannadanna"*...... it's always something! ;) ;D
* Old Saturday Night routine where Roseanne Roseannadanna (played by the late, great, Gilda Radner) goes on and on about something and ends it with 'it's always something'.
Brian
mikey, if you want her to be legal so bad pay for her to come to your country and work it out. That would solve three problems. 1...it would remove an illegal alien from our country and 2...you can satisfy your obsession with this person and 3... we could all move on.
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Well, I do not know about 'solving' the problem. 'Cause after Mike deals with this one particular woman, we have another 9,999,999 left to go and I am thinking Mike will get sick of dealing with this issue before he gets past, oh, two million or so.
Should be no problem ... He doesn't see them as issues :thumbs:
But now that you mention it Gary, it does give me a thought: The Queen is getting well along in years now, and the heir- apparent is none- too- popular by the looks, so maybe the UK could use someone else to take over the Monarchy. And clearly we have a woman here in the colonies who seems to like official positions and yet should not even be anywhere in the US. And at least one of the US subjects seems to like and support this woman holding office so....... methinks we might have the makins' of a deal that could make everyone happy. I can see the introduction now: "Presenting Her Majesty, Roseanne Roseannadanna"*...... it's always something! ;) ;D
* Old Saturday Night routine where Roseanne Roseannadanna (played by the late, great, Gilda Radner) goes on and on about something and ends it with 'it's always something'.
Brian
Hey, if you have to explain your joke ...
:rotflmao:
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All in favour of skipping Charles, in fact you're welcome to him , will trade for several undocumented immigrants :)
That said if anything was to happen to Will and his kids(which I hope doesn't) then it won't be too long before the token ginger of the family brings an American into the royal bloodlines.
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All in favour of skipping Charles, in fact you're welcome to him , will trade for several undocumented immigrants :)
Terrible deal for us. We definitely do not want Charles. And you do want undocumented immigrants. In fact, you like them in important, leadership positions.
:)
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Well, I have no idea if 40 year old SNL routines are common knowledge outside the US, and am trying to accommodate the 'wider area reader'. That, coupled with the ever- present threat that someone will jump in here screaming "Racist!!!!" because I mentioned an Hispanic (or is it Latino?) name.
Oy Vei! This is tough! In the olden' days offense was not so easily taken as it is today and I am too old to learn the 'correct' words. Why just the other day I used the word Oriental, only to have it be corrected to 'Asian'. Sheesh. No offense was meant.
Brian
Should be no problem ... He doesn't see them as issues :thumbs:
Hey, if you have to explain your joke ...
:rotflmao:
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Well, I have no idea if 40 year old SNL routines are common knowledge outside the US, and am trying to accommodate the 'wider area reader'. That, coupled with the ever- present threat that someone will jump in here screaming "Racist!!!!" because I mentioned an Hispanic (or is it Latino?) name.
Oy Vei! This is tough! In the olden' days offense was not so easily taken as it is today and I am too old to learn the 'correct' words. Why just the other day I used the word Oriental, only to have it be corrected to 'Asian'. Sheesh. No offense was meant.
Brian
Place that at the end of every post. That's probably about the best you can do.
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Some more chum for the frenzy:
"Mateo will not be a salaried employee, but California state policy entitles her to reimbursement for expenses - meaning that the state and taxpayers will be paying her although it is against federal law."
This from an approved source. http://insider.foxnews.com/2018/03/16/illegal-immigrant-lizbeth-mateo-appointed-statewide-government-post-california (http://insider.foxnews.com/2018/03/16/illegal-immigrant-lizbeth-mateo-appointed-statewide-government-post-california) ;D
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Wasn't it a bunch of democrats who refused to follow the Constitution and federal law that started a civil war a few years back?
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George Washington refused a salary as President of the United States out of the goodness of his heart. He then submitted expenses in the amount of six times the amount of the salary he was offered in the first place.
Life is complex. History and reality are not, at least as presented to us simple folk.
Given the ability, I would toss the illegal alien and as many others as I could reasonably round up. See? Reality presented in simple terms. ;) And I would have politely but firmly ignored George Washington's expense report presented and again offer him the original salary.
Brian
Some more chum for the frenzy:
"Mateo will not be a salaried employee, but California state policy entitles her to reimbursement for expenses - meaning that the state and taxpayers will be paying her although it is against federal law."
This from an approved source. http://insider.foxnews.com/2018/03/16/illegal-immigrant-lizbeth-mateo-appointed-statewide-government-post-california (http://insider.foxnews.com/2018/03/16/illegal-immigrant-lizbeth-mateo-appointed-statewide-government-post-california) ;D
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Wasn't it a bunch of democrats who refused to follow the Constitution and federal law that started a civil war a few years back?
lol. Let me get this straight. You are equating this kerfuffle to the southern states' defense of slavery and desire to secede from the Union.
I do find it ironic that the party of Lincoln is now the safe-harbor for prejudice and intolerance.
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lol. Let me get this straight. You are equating this kerfuffle to the southern states' defense of slavery and desire to secede from the Union.
I do find it ironic that the party of Lincoln is now the safe-harbor for prejudice and intolerance.
I find it sad that you think a migrant invasion is no big deal and that those concerned about the Constitution and rule of law are prejudicial and intolerant.
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I find it sad that you think a migrant invasion is no big deal and that those concerned about the Constitution and rule of law are prejudicial and intolerant.
+1
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+1
-3. I win!
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I find it sad that you think a migrant invasion is no big deal
A migrant invasion would be a big deal, except there is no migrant invasion. Illegal immigrant population peaked at 11.9 million in 2007 and has been declining even before the current administration. Total unlawful immigrant population is about 4% of the total population. I don't feel threatened by that.
.. those concerned about the Constitution and rule of law are prejudicial and intolerant.
That is your own interpretation. The following article is illustrative of my comment: https://thinkprogress.org/20000-illinois-republicans-voted-for-nazi-7bbeeb7631fd/amp/?__twitter_impression=true and it was in your neck of the woods, no?
The SAD you are experiencing may be due to the lingering winter. :)
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Not my woods.
Chicago area has had a nazi problem for along time.
https://youtu.be/_ctNdLZz4us
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Yeah, I remember that. But they were merely Nazis in their geo- political thinking, their ethnicity was American. So they were OK. Not like that pesky woman in CA.....
Brian
Not my woods.
Chicago area has had a nazi problem for along time.
https://youtu.be/_ctNdLZz4us
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Not my woods.
Chicago area has had a nazi problem for along time.
https://youtu.be/_ctNdLZz4us
An ongoing problem? I remember a case study with Nazis marching through Skokie because of the large Jewish population there, and the ACLU defending their 1A rights.
Blues Brothers and Blazing Saddles - two of my all-time favorites. :)
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.... and the ACLU defending their 1A rights.
Yep, that's what we do. Like the man* said, "No one is free until we are all free." That includes the least of us, like Nazis.
(*MLK)
Blues Brothers and Blazing Saddles - two of my all-time favorites. :)
:thumbs:
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Yes, either everyone has civil liberties or no one does.
The real test of the first Amendment is not when we agree with those speaking but when we do NOT agree with those speaking but still insist on their rights to free speech.
Brian
Yep, that's what we do. Like the man* said, "No one is free until we are all free." That includes the least of us, like Nazis.
(*MLK)
:thumbs:
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Yes, either everyone has civil liberties or no one does.
The real test of the first Amendment is not when we agree with those speaking but when we do NOT agree with those speaking but still insist on their rights to free speech.
Brian
Except illegal aliens who by virtue of their illegality are not entitled to the same Constitutional protections as citizens.