Author Topic: SOLVED!! Severe Bog & Surging on 08 Concours 14 Solved!!  (Read 9364 times)

Offline MAN OF BLUES

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Re: Severe Bog & Surging on 08 Concours 14
« Reply #20 on: July 28, 2019, 05:57:02 PM »
I did the TPS Reset/ Recalibration twice but no difference. I'm gonna replace the FPR or the whole  (ZX14) pump assembly when I get a chance in a couple of days & update you all.

Here's the Fuel Pressure Regulator; same for all bikes!
https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ebay.com%2Fulk%2Fitm%2F173748331444

I'm sorry if I again seem to be quite blunt about buying "stuff' off ebay, but if you actually looked, and I'm sure you didn't, you would find as I said, you can't buy that individual KAW OEM part...

the numbers they used on the website you linked, are for a complete pump assembly.. I don't think you are really getting this thing, about "real" vs "available" parts people sell..
I just did a complete fuel pump clean/filter/reinstall about 2 weeks ago.. i assure you you are gambling and tossing money to an E-bay vendor, that is falsly representing what he has in hand... it's your $$$$$.. and your bike, but man, be a bit more dilligent, run numbers, and check sources.

actually, when you go to the "source", and compare the fuel pump assembly, and this supposed regulator, they repeat the exact same numbers.. can you buy things online, from a source with little credibility, when they make such grave errors in the marketing, and part number's you expect?
https://www.fuelpumpfactory.com/collections/all/motorcycles---scooters-2008-kawasaki-concours-14--zg1400--efi-esr4669762


as for the TPS reset thing... we hashed this all out for a decade.. it's pure hogwash, with regard to the C14.. it will do nothing.. I did it many times, trying to believe it, but in the end, consorting with my long time mechanical cronies, we have found the ECU is what it is, you can't "re-set" anything, like the off-on-off throttle thing was touted to do.. this came directly as a result of BMW's systems, used on the GS series, and does not in any way shape, or form, even make a difference when attempted on a C14.
The ONLY thing, that will change throttle roll on roll off, is a flash. Whomever you choose to perform it, is up to you. I have a Mountain Runner Premium flash, a couple weeks old... my miles per gallon went from approx 40, to 53 even tho I was abusing the bike much harder, than ever before.. to test the flash.. I can't say enough about just HOW MUCH, it changed my '08.

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Offline maxtog

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Re: Severe Bog & Surging on 08 Concours 14
« Reply #21 on: July 28, 2019, 06:33:56 PM »
The ONLY thing, that will change throttle roll on roll off, is a flash.

Actually, a ThrottleTamer will do it, too.  That is what I used for many years before the recent Steve's reflash.  Guhl's flash does nothing for throttle taming, but Steve's does.... now I have TOO MUCH throttle taming :)  I suppose one day I need to remove the ThrottleTamer, but I like that it is metal and so smooth.  Anyway, so now the Tamer is redundant with a good flash.
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Offline ginzburg

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Re: Severe Bog & Surging on 08 Concours 14
« Reply #22 on: August 01, 2019, 01:50:12 AM »
If it turns out not to be the fuel, I saw another possibility on a ZX-14 that was described as a bogging issue and they described it as acting like a fueling issue. In that case it turned out to be the vehicle down sensor shorting out and cutting the fuel intermittantly. It seems pretty unlikely on the Concours that it would have as many problems with it as on the ZX-14 due to the different location and mounting though. It did not have an error code, but I do think it had the flashing temperature sensor.


Offline speedracersworld

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Re: Severe Bog & Surging on 08 Concours 14
« Reply #23 on: August 04, 2019, 09:35:33 PM »
OK!! Problem Solved!! I installed the ZX14 Fuel Pump Assembly and she ran like a Bat Outta Hell! The Fuel Pressure regulator was the one piece that I didn't think of changing in the Fuel Pump Assembly. So much for Insignificance. I still have the other "Aftermarket" Pump assembly and got the replacement Fuel Pressure Regulator that I will assemble & install later. It feels good to finally have solved the mystery. Thank You ALL For your Advice & Input!!!

What I figured was the FPR was Bypassing below the Normal Pressure. The bike had enough Fuel Pressure to start, idle and accelerate up to 4K rpms but after that there wasn't enough Fuel Pressure & Flow for the Demand so it was bogging down; like running lean. Now she accelerates strong and fast all the way up to redline in atleast the first 4 gears. Ran out of clear freeway after that ;)
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Offline connie_rider

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Re: SOLVED!! Severe Bog & Surging on 08 Concours 14 Solved!!
« Reply #24 on: August 05, 2019, 07:25:59 AM »
Speedracersworld, glad you solved the problem.
Can you post an image of the ZX14 Fuel Pump Assembly you installed and tell us where you purchased it?
I see where you bought an aftermarket pump and a ZX-14 throttle body, but don't see a link to what you installed?

Ride safe, Ted
« Last Edit: August 05, 2019, 02:17:24 PM by connie_rider »

Offline speedracersworld

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Re: SOLVED!! Severe Bog & Surging on 08 Concours 14 Solved!!
« Reply #25 on: August 05, 2019, 08:58:14 AM »
The used eBay ZX14 pump is same part number as the Concours 14. They were identical. I wanted to try a known good pump before tackling the TB's. I was running short on time but will post pics & video of the pump overhaul later. Took me about an hour total to drain, remove the tank & pump, reinstall & reassemble.
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Offline connie_rider

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Re: SOLVED!! Severe Bog & Surging on 08 Concours 14 Solved!!
« Reply #26 on: August 05, 2019, 02:19:50 PM »
Ok, thank you. Assuming you bought something like this?
https://www.ebay.com/itm/2014-12-17-Kawasaki-Ninja-ZX14R-ZX14-Fuel-Pump-Rear-Gas-Pickup-Petrol-2015/254307874526?hash=item3b35ee36de:g:ePMAAOSwQnFdN4Dd

Haven't been into mine and was hoping to see if the image showed the Fuel Pressure regulator in place.

Ride safe, Ted

Offline speedracersworld

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Re: SOLVED!! Severe Bog & Surging on 08 Concours 14 Solved!!
« Reply #27 on: August 05, 2019, 02:40:49 PM »
Yes, exactly. You see the metallic Disc looking Thingy (3rd Picture) towards the Top of the Pump Housing at the Split Seam (about the diameter of a Quarter) Is the Fuel Pressure Regulator. If you remove the 2 screws on top sides & pry apart the top section of the plastic Cover, You'll see the Fuel Pressure Regulator. Be Careful because the Rubber O-rings are holding it down pretty good. Mine went flying the first time!! ;D
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Offline connie_rider

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Re: SOLVED!! Severe Bog & Surging on 08 Concours 14 Solved!!
« Reply #28 on: August 05, 2019, 03:27:06 PM »
Yes, I see it now. Thanks.
I'm assuming you installed a new strainer?

Ride safe, Ted

Offline speedracersworld

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Re: SOLVED!! Severe Bog & Surging on 08 Concours 14 Solved!!
« Reply #29 on: August 05, 2019, 03:38:05 PM »
Yes, I see it now. Thanks.
I'm assuming you installed a new strainer?

Ride safe, Ted

No, mine was like New/ clean. I'll have a detailed disassembly & reassembly of the pump  posted hopefully by tomorrow if my schedule permits.

Adam
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Offline MAN OF BLUES

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Re: SOLVED!! Severe Bog & Surging on 08 Concours 14 Solved!!
« Reply #30 on: August 05, 2019, 05:12:00 PM »
I'm still not positive the metal thing is all encompassing, I think the actual regulator sits below it, and the metal part is basically a check valve, with a pressure regulating spring..(no part number associated with it in the picture) I dunno, didn't spend enough time when I had it all disassembled to really mess with the plastic part.. (item #3)

Mind you, this is a "generic" picture of a Kaw pump, actually the same pump, but the float level stuff is from the "Mule" ATV model.


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Offline speedracersworld

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Re: SOLVED!! Severe Bog & Surging on 08 Concours 14 Solved!!
« Reply #31 on: August 05, 2019, 06:16:08 PM »
I'm still not positive the metal thing is all encompassing, I think the actual regulator sits below it, and the metal part is basically a check valve, with a pressure regulating spring..(no part number associated with it in the picture) I dunno, didn't spend enough time when I had it all disassembled to really mess with the plastic part.. (item #3)

Mind you, this is a "generic" picture of a Kaw pump, actually the same pump, but the float level stuff is from the "Mule" ATV model.



It's the bottom unit of #9.
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Offline speedracersworld

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Re: SOLVED!! Severe Bog & Surging on 08 Concours 14 Solved!!
« Reply #32 on: August 05, 2019, 07:45:12 PM »
Man Of Blues; where did you get the diagram? Got a parts list?
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Offline MAN OF BLUES

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Re: Severe Bog & Surging on 08 Concours 14
« Reply #33 on: August 06, 2019, 01:01:16 PM »
HERE is a link to another aftermarket replacement pump, a couple guys on the other forum have actually purchased, and ran them, and had nothing bad to say about them at all..that same place sells the filter socks for 3 for $14

https://www.highflowfuel.com/i-23443610-quantum-t35-intank-fuel-pump-with-strainers-for-kawasaki-concours-14-zg1400-2008-2018.html

It's from the link I posted on page 2.

it does not break the parts down with actual "numbers"...
and unfortunately neither does Kaw on the OEM Microfiche.. so, it's tough to break out individual parts.

I'm pretty sure tho, a I have seen a photo of the OEM "filter rebuild kit", on a Kaw "parts" supplier website,(not the actual Kaw site) that each part comes in it's own bag,and is labeled, and is grouped together and supplied in a larger bag, as "the kit", meaning the o-rings, filter element, replacement screws.  I just replaced my filter, so I'm not going to spend the $70 for a kit to "supply individual numbers", maybe when someone buys one, they can post up what each part in that kit is marked as.

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Offline speedracersworld

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Re: SOLVED!! Severe Bog & Surging on 08 Concours 14 Solved!!
« Reply #34 on: August 07, 2019, 12:58:29 PM »
It's the bottom unit of #9.

The metal piece of item #9 is the fuel pressure regulator. It also acts as a check valve to prevent fuel from draining out of the line back into the tank. Any pressure above the regulated psi is relieved back into the housing. Item #3 is just a spacer passage from the pump motor to upper cap which is a pressurized chamber.
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Offline speedracersworld

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Re: SOLVED!! Severe Bog & Surging on 08 Concours 14 Solved!!
« Reply #35 on: August 08, 2019, 12:02:24 AM »
Here are pics of the fuel pump reassembly. Be careful during disassembly because the O-rings don't want to let go of the upper cap & parts my go airborne.. Pry on both sides evenly. I replaced the fuel pump motor, filter & pressure regulator. The stock pump is still good and I'll keep it as back up.
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Offline connie_rider

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Re: SOLVED!! Severe Bog & Surging on 08 Concours 14 Solved!!
« Reply #36 on: August 08, 2019, 09:41:20 AM »
speedracersworld, congrats on the successful repair.
I enjoyed talking with you.

Was surprising that your fuel pump regulator failed. Think that is the first one that I've heard of.
But your step by step finally found the solution. I are impressed...

Keep us posted when/if you check out the old pump/etc in the future.

Ride safe, Ted

Offline speedracersworld

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Re: SOLVED!! Severe Bog & Surging on 08 Concours 14 Solved!!
« Reply #37 on: August 08, 2019, 02:53:48 PM »
speedracersworld, congrats on the successful repair.
I enjoyed talking with you.



Was surprising that your fuel pump regulator failed. Think that is the first one that I've heard of.
But your step by step finally found the solution. I are impressed...

Keep us posted when/if you check out the old pump/etc in the future.

Ride safe, Ted

Good talking to you also. Will keep you all updated on the aftermarket fuel pump assembly swap. Just filled my tank last night and that'll last me a week or I may just drain & swap it this weekend. Wife's car blew a radiator hose so that's the priority then the bike.
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Offline 2talltim

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Re: SOLVED!! Severe Bog & Surging on 08 Concours 14 Solved!!
« Reply #38 on: August 13, 2019, 09:46:27 AM »
FYI for future reference these kits work as direct replacements for the C14 also. Comes with everything. Had to over night one to a hotel in Utah last year. Great pump and lifetime warranty too. You would be suprised how many different bikes and machines use these same exact pumps acrodd all brands.
 
 https://www.amazon.com/Replacement-4010-49040-0719-49040-0718-49019-0013/dp/B00S0I64ZE/ref=sr_1_4?keywords=HFP-386+brute+force&qid=1565710905&s=automotive&sr=1-4

Offline VirginiaJim

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Re: SOLVED!! Severe Bog & Surging on 08 Concours 14 Solved!!
« Reply #39 on: August 13, 2019, 11:34:04 AM »
Great information from everyone!  :finger_fing11:
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