Kawasaki Concours Forum
Mish mash => Open Forum => Topic started by: Conrad on April 11, 2015, 07:07:24 AM
-
Anyone here ever have a metal roof installed on their house? My wife and I installed the shingled roof we now have (that's right, just the two of us) and it's time for a new roof (unrelated to the recent storm) and we'll be having a standing seam (concealed fastener) system installed sometime in the next couple of months.
We're not doing the install this time as my wife refuses to get on the roof again, EVER.
https://www.pac-clad.com/metal-roofing/snap-clad/ (https://www.pac-clad.com/metal-roofing/snap-clad/)
-
Don't blame her. I did a shingle roof once... Never again.
-
Nope, I don't blame her one bit. It's a LOT of work for sure but it saves a ton of money doing it yourself. I've never done a metal roof so I'll leave that up to the experts.
Now if we can only agree on a color. She wants a dark color (med bronze) and I'd like a lighter color. There are 37 color choices. :o
-
No help here but it is something I've been interested in. Do you mind sharing some of the reasons you decided to go with the metal roof?
-
I built a gazebo with a standing seam hip metal roof. It does look really nice. I have traditional metal roof on the barn and hay shed.
I would say that if your house is two story it doesn't matter which one you choose because at a distance it is hard to see the screws.
It is probably good to let the pros install it. You need special cutters and brakes to bend the metal. If you use the wrong tools you can accelerate corrosion.
Are the going to strip the current roof down to the wood and put down a sound dampening material under the new roof?
What color are you going to choose?
-
Nope, I don't blame her one bit. It's a LOT of work for sure but it saves a ton of money doing it yourself. I've never done a metal roof so I'll leave that up to the experts.
Now if we can only agree on a color. She wants a dark color (med bronze) and I'd like a lighter color. There are 37 color choices. :o
I was writing while you posted this. A good company should be able to create in software an elevation of your house and swap out colors so you can get an idea how they will look with your architecture and wall colors.
-
No help here but it is something I've been interested in. Do you mind sharing some of the reasons you decided to go with the metal roof?
Durability and looks are the main reasons. We don't want to have to worry about the roof ever again. There's a house in our neighborhood that has the same roofing system that we're going to have installed and it looks fantastic.
-
I built a gazebo with a standing seam hip metal roof. It does look really nice. I have traditional metal roof on the barn and hay shed.
I would say that if your house is two story it doesn't matter which one you choose because at a distance it is hard to see the screws.
It is probably good to let the pros install it. You need special cutters and brakes to bend the metal. If you use the wrong tools you can accelerate corrosion.
Are the going to strip the current roof down to the wood and put down a sound dampening material under the new roof?
What color are you going to choose?
It would be hard to see the screws if we went with a traditional metal roof but as one of the reps from a company that gave us an estimate said, "I just can't see taking a perfectly good piece of metal roofing and making thousands of holes in it". I agree.
Yes, the old roof will be stripped off and a weather proof sound deadening material installed under the metal.
-
I was writing while you posted this. A good company should be able to create in software an elevation of your house and swap out colors so you can get an idea how they will look with your architecture and wall colors.
At the link above the company does have software that shows what your color choices will look like. They even let you upload a pic of your house and work the software magic on it to render your choices on the screen.
-
Don't have one, but sure like the look of them, and the weather advantages they give.
But that raises a question, would it be wise to install lightning rods, or is that not a
concern with metal roofs.. Oh, and ice cleats (I think that's the name?).
-
My parents had one installed a year or so ago. So far so good. It even withstood the tornado that eventually went near your house. They live in Clinton, IA. Storm wasn't THAT bad (tree & a few roofs damaged.. Not their roof, a bldg. a mile away.) until it jumped the river and seemed to gain a lot of strength.
-
Metal roofs are fairly popular out here, they don't catch on fire. Discount on homeowners insurance.
They 'sweat', need a real waterproof underlayment (15-30lb felt just don't cut it)
They sound neat when it rains. Real neat in a hail storm. Snow can be a minor(?) issue, especially when it cuts loose all at once :)
Roof penetrations (any penetration) can be leak points, and often are. Same for valleys. Composition shingles 'flex', the whole panel(s) move on metal.
Durability is generally longer than composition shingles, I wouldn't call them life time though.
They dent (big hail, big branches, 400 lb gorilla), they're real slippery when wet, the color fades over time. Roof repairs end up looking like a checkerboard.
Rick
-
Not inexpensive, but when installed by the right contractor they are very good.
http://decra.com/ (http://decra.com/)
-
If I ever need a roof replaced I will be going with this type of roof system. The roof is metal and looks like asphalt or slate shingles. They also have the flat warehouse looking metal roofs too. I like the slate look.
https://www.interlockroofing.com/metal-roofing/shingle/ (https://www.interlockroofing.com/metal-roofing/shingle/)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tLmn2oUhRq8 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tLmn2oUhRq8)
-
Don't have one, but sure like the look of them, and the weather advantages they give.
But that raises a question, would it be wise to install lightning rods, or is that not a
concern with metal roofs.. Oh, and ice cleats (I think that's the name?).
Yes, ice/snow cleats. According to the three companies that I had give me an estimate, they don't worry so much about this on residential installations.
-
Metal roofs are fairly popular out here, they don't catch on fire. Discount on homeowners insurance.
They 'sweat', need a real waterproof underlayment (15-30lb felt just don't cut it)
They sound neat when it rains. Real neat in a hail storm. Snow can be a minor(?) issue, especially when it cuts loose all at once :)
Roof penetrations (any penetration) can be leak points, and often are. Same for valleys. Composition shingles 'flex', the whole panel(s) move on metal.
Durability is generally longer than composition shingles, I wouldn't call them life time though.
They dent (big hail, big branches, 400 lb gorilla), they're real slippery when wet, the color fades over time. Roof repairs end up looking like a checkerboard.
Rick
The entire roof will be covered with a rubber ice/water shield first. They say that this offers some sound deadening too but I'm not really worried about that.
-
Not inexpensive, but when installed by the right contractor they are very good.
http://decra.com/ (http://decra.com/)
The 3 companies that gave me estimates did offer to install the Decra metal but it was WAY more money than we wanted to spend.
Here's the color chart, looks like we'll be going with Med Bronze.
https://www.pac-clad.com/color-availability-chart/ (https://www.pac-clad.com/color-availability-chart/)
-
Metal roofs are fairly popular out here, they don't catch on fire. Discount on homeowners insurance.
They 'sweat', need a real waterproof underlayment (15-30lb felt just don't cut it)
They sound neat when it rains. Real neat in a hail storm. Snow can be a minor(?) issue, especially when it cuts loose all at once :)
Roof penetrations (any penetration) can be leak points, and often are. Same for valleys. Composition shingles 'flex', the whole panel(s) move on metal.
Durability is generally longer than composition shingles, I wouldn't call them life time though.
They dent (big hail, big branches, 400 lb gorilla), they're real slippery when wet, the color fades over time. Roof repairs end up looking like a checkerboard.
Rick
Conrad will be up there applying the yearly polyglycoat. ::)
-
Conrad will be up there applying the yearly polyglycoat. ::)
And the gorilla repellant. ;)
One major benefit of a metal roof. It'll be way more difficult for 'them' to read my mind from orbit and I won't have to wear that silly tinfoil hat in the house any longer. :)
-
Can you actually 'walk' on a metal roof without damage to the panels?
-
I don't see why not. They are mounted directly to the roof. I would however wear soft soled shoes if it were me. Just don't walk on the ridges.
-
No experience with metal roofs but I have always found it interesting that they are a regional thing; virtually unknown in southern New England, they are the common roof material in northern New England. That is actually changing a bit lately with a few showing up here (southern N.E.) in the last few years.
I am right in the middle of the 'terror phase' with my roof- it needs a new roof also, but am not yet sure how far down. Worst case possible will be all the way down to the walls :-(
Brian
Anyone here ever have a metal roof installed on their house? My wife and I installed the shingled roof we now have (that's right, just the two of us) and it's time for a new roof (unrelated to the recent storm) and we'll be having a standing seam (concealed fastener) system installed sometime in the next couple of months.
We're not doing the install this time as my wife refuses to get on the roof again, EVER.
https://www.pac-clad.com/metal-roofing/snap-clad/ (https://www.pac-clad.com/metal-roofing/snap-clad/)
-
Can you actually 'walk' on a metal roof without damage to the panels?
I asked the same question and the answer is yes. But the panels can be VERY slippery when wet.
-
That is nothing really problematic though....
http://metro.co.uk/2014/05/22/x-men-fan-invents-magnetic-shoes-so-he-can-walk-on-ceilings-but-only-metal-ones-4737271/ (http://metro.co.uk/2014/05/22/x-men-fan-invents-magnetic-shoes-so-he-can-walk-on-ceilings-but-only-metal-ones-4737271/)
Brian
I asked the same question and the answer is yes. But the panels can be VERY slippery when wet.
-
I don't see why not. They are mounted directly to the roof. I would however wear soft soled shoes if it were me. Just don't walk on the ridges.
In some applications they will still put battens and attach the metal to the battens. That provides an air gap between the metal and the structure.
-
I agree there. You might ask the installer for info. I know I found this for one installer:
Protective heavy-duty gloves should be worn when handling metal panels and trim. Safety
goggles and hearing protection should be worn while cutting or drilling panels. Extreme
care should be used when walking, standing, sitting, or kneeling on a metal roof. They can
be extremely slippery when wet. When walking on the roof panels, walk only on the flats.
Traffic over the installed system must be kept to an absolute minimum. Installers should
wear rubber sole shoes to keep from scuffing material while walking on the roof.
-
Conrad,
I'm pretty familiar with them. Installed one on my parents house a while back.
If you live in an area that gets a lot of hail, I know it costs more, but everyone around Oklahoma recommends spending the extra $$ and going with the heavier guage sheet metal. Less prone to hail damage/dents.
Usually, once the liner material has been laid on the roof, there's 1"x4" planking that's nailed/screwed on before the metal goes on... but not always. Most metal companies want this, and affects warranty.
Walking on this type of installation becomes more tricky, to avoid denting, since it's raised.
But, I will say, it goes on fast, and lasts.
And, as someone else stated, helps to externally fireproof the roof. Now, it doesn't help if a fire is internally started... But say a neighbor's house nearby catches on fire, or a grassfire happens, or flying embers from a fireplace happens to land on your metal roof... It helps.
But, as mentioned... it's a lot slicker to get on! Roof pitch can really make a difference.
-
I've had one on my house for about eight years. Still looks great. As a matter of fact, if you want to see mine, it's on the Mueller website on the CF (concealed fastener) page.
http://www.muellerinc.com/metal-roofing/panel-types/cf-panel (http://www.muellerinc.com/metal-roofing/panel-types/cf-panel)
I've got some other pictures that Mueller took of my house that were taken from a cherry picker way up in the air, if anyone is interested. There are a couple more in their photo gallery.
http://www.muellerinc.com/gallery/roofing/photos/metal-roofing/cf-saddle-leather-brown-04/cf-saddle-leather-brown-1-216#joomimg (http://www.muellerinc.com/gallery/roofing/photos/metal-roofing/cf-saddle-leather-brown-04/cf-saddle-leather-brown-1-216#joomimg)
You can get a pretty hefty discount on your homeowner insurance as long as you sign a cosmetic waiver that they only have to repair when it leaks, not just dented. I can tell you that I've had some pretty good Texas hail storms and you can't see any dents at all. If you think about it, the steel is pretty much laying directly on the decking, so there's not much flex to cause a dent when something hits it. I've always been told that you just have to wait for a really hot day (not unusual down here) for any dents to pop out.
They're expensive, but in my case it has almost paid for itself in my reduced insurance cost. I think my original calculations were that it would take eight or nine years to pay for the difference between a metal roof and a standard shingle roof. Quite a few of my neighbors have them.
Mueller offers a 20 or 30 year paint warranty. I don't know if that includes fading, but I'm pretty sure mine hasn't changed much in spite of the Texas sun/heat.
They're slick to walk on, even when dry. You get a fine layer of dust on them and they're like a ski slope. Get them wet and I wouldn't even think about going up there.
-
We did our family's house when I was a teenager (a long time ago) and the best thing I remember using was the gloves with the little rubber nubs on the palms and fingers - sometimes hard to get a good grip on a sheet, especially the longer (heavier) ones... Rubberized kneepads were helpful too...
Jamie
-
Anyplace else wearing rubber helps when doing this kind of work?
:popcorn: :censored:
Brian
We did our family's house when I was a teenager (a long time ago) and the best thing I remember using was the gloves with the little rubber nubs on the palms and fingers - sometimes hard to get a good grip on a sheet, especially the longer (heavier) ones... Rubberized kneepads were helpful too...
Jamie
-
Conrad,
I'm pretty familiar with them. Installed one on my parents house a while back.
If you live in an area that gets a lot of hail, I know it costs more, but everyone around Oklahoma recommends spending the extra $$ and going with the heavier guage sheet metal. Less prone to hail damage/dents.
Usually, once the liner material has been laid on the roof, there's 1"x4" planking that's nailed/screwed on before the metal goes on... but not always. Most metal companies want this, and affects warranty.
Walking on this type of installation becomes more tricky, to avoid denting, since it's raised.
But, I will say, it goes on fast, and lasts.
And, as someone else stated, helps to externally fireproof the roof. Now, it doesn't help if a fire is internally started... But say a neighbor's house nearby catches on fire, or a grassfire happens, or flying embers from a fireplace happens to land on your metal roof... It helps.
But, as mentioned... it's a lot slicker to get on! Roof pitch can really make a difference.
The metal that's going on my roof will be 24 gauge and this system is designed to go right over top of the decking, with the rubber membrane in between of course. Two of the other quotes that I got had the spacers under the metal along with the plastic battens as well. Those two quotes were ~30% higher than the quotes without the spacers and battens. I did question this and double checked with the warranty requirements on the system that will be used on my house. As I said, this system is designed to be used without the spacers and battens. It also has a 20 year fade warranty.
-
I've had one on my house for about eight years. Still looks great. As a matter of fact, if you want to see mine, it's on the Mueller website on the CF (concealed fastener) page.
http://www.muellerinc.com/metal-roofing/panel-types/cf-panel (http://www.muellerinc.com/metal-roofing/panel-types/cf-panel)
I've got some other pictures that Mueller took of my house that were taken from a cherry picker way up in the air, if anyone is interested. There are a couple more in their photo gallery.
http://www.muellerinc.com/gallery/roofing/photos/metal-roofing/cf-saddle-leather-brown-04/cf-saddle-leather-brown-1-216#joomimg (http://www.muellerinc.com/gallery/roofing/photos/metal-roofing/cf-saddle-leather-brown-04/cf-saddle-leather-brown-1-216#joomimg)
You can get a pretty hefty discount on your homeowner insurance as long as you sign a cosmetic waiver that they only have to repair when it leaks, not just dented. I can tell you that I've had some pretty good Texas hail storms and you can't see any dents at all. If you think about it, the steel is pretty much laying directly on the decking, so there's not much flex to cause a dent when something hits it. I've always been told that you just have to wait for a really hot day (not unusual down here) for any dents to pop out.
They're expensive, but in my case it has almost paid for itself in my reduced insurance cost. I think my original calculations were that it would take eight or nine years to pay for the difference between a metal roof and a standard shingle roof. Quite a few of my neighbors have them.
Mueller offers a 20 or 30 year paint warranty. I don't know if that includes fading, but I'm pretty sure mine hasn't changed much in spite of the Texas sun/heat.
They're slick to walk on, even when dry. You get a fine layer of dust on them and they're like a ski slope. Get them wet and I wouldn't even think about going up there.
Thanks for the info and the pics Wally, your house looks great! What color is that?
-
Thanks for the info and the pics Wally, your house looks great! What color is that?
It's called Saddle Leather Brown. I think mine has a 20 year paint warranty. The 30 year warranty is only available on a limited number of colors and my color is the one that SWMBO wanted.
-
It's called Saddle Leather Brown. I think mine has a 20 year paint warranty. The 30 year warranty is only available on a limited number of colors and my color is the one that SWMBO wanted.
Yeah, I know how that goes with SWMBO. Happy wife happy life.
I'd like a lighter more reflective color but she would like a dark color. It's not that big a deal to me so she can have her dark color. Besides, the med bronze is one of the company's 'cool colors'. Meaning that it's been treated with a reflective coating of some kind and it stays cooler in the sun than it would otherwise be.
-
My metal roofing job was started on 7/24. The tear off crew showed up that Friday and did their thing in less than 5 hours. Tore off the old roofing materials, replaced any decking that needed it, and then covered the entire roof with a ice/water membrane. The did a crappy job and I had to go up on the roof after they left and the pull nails out that were left sticking through the membrane and then patch the holes. 90 holes on one side of the roof!
On 7/25 the metal guys showed up, only two men! >:(
A job that was supposed to take two days is now going on it's second week!!! WTF!!!
If that wasn't bad enough, the :censored: guy who was supposed to know what he's doing, doesn't. I am SO :censored: mad over this!!! Plus it looks like they didn't order enough metal to finish the job, they are short two 20 foot pieces. I'll be calling the owner of the company today and demand that he come and look at the poor job that his man has done. I have a bad feeling that I'll be calling my lawyer over this. I paid half of the cost of the roof up front with the remainder due at completion.
Anyone ever been in a situation like this?
-
What a hassle, C. You been taking pictures?
-
When you discovered the fasteners thru the membrane they should have been back replacing it all.
Unfortunately, it seems the salesmanship of contracting has gotten to be more of a "skill" than those employed to do the work. Not much in the form of craftsmanship in the trades anymore from what I see. A skilled installer or craftsman is getting to be a thing of the past, and its too bad.
-
Did you go through the manufacturer to get an installer, or did you go through an installer that uses that brand of roofing? Just curious.
I would have been calling the manager when I had the first problem with the nails.
-
Yeah, I have lots of pics and I documented everything.
I spoke with the owner this morning and he was aware that the job is short two long sections of metal. He claims that the metal will be here on Wednesday. How it got ordered and done in time to be here on Wednesday I don't know. They must have known of the shortage from the start.
I went through my list of concerns with him over the phone and he's coming by on Wednesday so that I can show him exactly what I'm talking about. He tells me that the guy who did the estimate is partly to blame for the shortage and for the job taking WAY longer than it should have. He says that's no excuse but there it is. The estimator not only screwed up the amount of materials needed but also how long the job should take. The owner says that the job was estimated to take 42 hours for a two man team (after the tear off) and is now at 58 hours and counting. He says that he's loosing money on this job but when it's done I'll be 100% satisfied. I doubt that...
I've come to find out that the guy leading the two man team that's doing the install is actually working this job as a side job and he has a full time day job that he works during the day and that's why he can't work on my roof full time, he only works on it during the evenings and the weekends. WTF?
-
Did you go through the manufacturer to get an installer, or did you go through an installer that uses that brand of roofing? Just curious.
I would have been calling the manager when I had the first problem with the nails.
I checked with several people that I know that had roofs installed and asked for their recommendations. My wife did the same and from there I selected three companies with high ratings to come and give me an estimate. As it turns out, the company that I initially liked the best, and had the best rating, ended up having the lowest bid. No brainer right? Wrong.
Here's another thing that should have been a red flag for me. It turns out that the estimator showed me the wrong metal product for our roof. Not wrong really but it was a heaver gauge (24 instead of 26) commercial roofing product. This was written into the contract but I was charged for a 26 gauge residential metal. The owner told me of this goof up a while back and that his company would have to eat at least $2k because of this mistake. Things that make you go hmmmm.
-
Wow, really sorry to hear this Conrad. I hope it all works out for you in the end but even if it does, this will be an unpleasant memory and emotional loss forever. :( These situations are always extremely stressful on the people trying to get the project done.
Brian
My metal roofing job was started on 7/24. The tear off crew showed up that Friday and did their thing in less than 5 hours. Tore off the old roofing materials, replaced any decking that needed it, and then covered the entire roof with a ice/water membrane. The did a crappy job and I had to go up on the roof after they left and the pull nails out that were left sticking through the membrane and then patch the holes. 90 holes on one side of the roof!
On 7/25 the metal guys showed up, only two men! >:(
A job that was supposed to take two days is now going on it's second week!!! WTF!!!
If that wasn't bad enough, the :censored: guy who was supposed to know what he's doing, doesn't. I am SO :censored: mad over this!!! Plus it looks like they didn't order enough metal to finish the job, they are short two 20 foot pieces. I'll be calling the owner of the company today and demand that he come and look at the poor job that his man has done. I have a bad feeling that I'll be calling my lawyer over this. I paid half of the cost of the roof up front with the remainder due at completion.
Anyone ever been in a situation like this?
-
Wow, really sorry to hear this Conrad. I hope it all works out for you in the end but even if it does, this will be an unpleasant memory and emotional loss forever. :( These situations are always extremely stressful on the people trying to get the project done.
Brian
Stressful is the right word Brian! Thanks for your condolences. We'll get it sorted out, eventually.
-
So the owner and one of his guys came by on Wednesday as I said above. They took a lot of their own pics and addressed all of my concerns, saying all the right things at the time. They admitted that several things were not done correctly and that they would all be fixed and that I would be 100% satisfied once they were done. I told him that unless he could turn back time that there's no way in hell that I'll be 100% satisfied with the work done.
As we were up on the roof I noticed that three of the panels on one side of the roof are too short and the top edges of these three do not go under the ridge cap as they should, short by at least two inches. I pointed these out to the guy and he stated that he knew about these and that new panels have been ordered. WTF?
The two panels that were supposed to be coming in on that Wednesday did not come in, surprise!
The :censored: owner keeps telling me that he'll call me and let me know what's going on. Does he? Hell no! Another surprise. >:(
-
Were these guys in the BBB database or even Angie's List?
-
Is he guaranteeing perfect color match between 3(?) different metal orders? ::)
-
Yeah, you hit that on the head alright.. Unless it comes out of the same batch it won't be identical and will stand out like a sore thumb.
-
Sort of turning into a bit of a train wreck.
Is the short metal all on one side of the roof?
-
I hope it works out for you. I had a metal roof installed on my house 10 or 12 years ago. I am very happy, the guy did great work. It still looks as good as it did day one. He did say we might want to consider painting it in 30 or 40 years.
-
Were these guys in the BBB database or even Angie's List?
I don't know about Angie's List but this company has a A+ rating on the BBB website. They won't after I'm done. I'll tell y'all the name of the company after this all shakes out.
-
Is he guaranteeing perfect color match between 3(?) different metal orders? ::)
That's a laugh right there! I'm finding out that it doesn't matter what he says, if the guys lips are moving he's lying.
-
Sort of turning into a bit of a train wreck.
Is the short metal all on one side of the roof?
A train wreck is right. >:(
Yes, the three panels that are too short are all on one side and these three are the last three on that end. Meaning that they can be replaced without having to remove any other panels. The metal ridge cap will have to be removed though.
At least those three shorties are covering the roof, mostly. I still have two 20' panels that didn't get ordered and the roof in that section is only covered by the water/ice membrane. Those two missing panels are at the end of the roof but on the other side from the shorties.
-
After still not hearing from the owner yesterday I called his cell in the afternoon. Surprise, he didn't pick up the call and it went to voice mail. His mailbox was full and I couldn't leave a message. I called his office, knowing that I wouldn't get to talk to anyone but I left a message.
Since I had his cell number I decided that I would text him. He replied to that, telling me that they had to re-order the metal and that it was going to be 2 to 3 MORE weeks!!! :o
So a :censored: 2 to 3 day job is turning into a 6 week or more job. Oh but the owner tells me not to worry because the roof is water proof.
Unbelievable. This is a big reputable roofing company in our area too. Holy ****.
-
when he sticks his hand out for the final pay off, look him square in the eye and tell him...
"oh, damn, I just ran outta checks.... it'll be about 2 or 3 weeks till they get here, don't worry though, its all good, unlike the rubber membrane covering my roof, they shouldn't bounce...."
-
Well, for whatever this is worth, and really it is not worth anything to you Conrad, but I have embarked on a housing adventure that started off kind of 'stingie' and continues to get worse. My roof was structurally damaged this last winter by our record snowfall and needs to be replaced.... and by 'roof', I mean the rafters and of course the entire sheathing (paper or snow and ice barrier, shingles, etc.). This resulted in a contest with the insurance company along with some truly shocking estimates as well as the level of repair necessary; basically the second floor needs a new second floor.
I do not want to get into a lot of detail as this is an on- going situation (read: 'contest') but I will say that before the first stick is removed, we have been blown off by multiple contractors, multiple structural engineers and multiple pest control companies (discovered a bat infestation upon gaining access to the attic, which has been sealed and un-enterable by humans since 1948).... usually with the 'I will get back to you with an [estimate, plan, time table, whatever] and never hearing from them again. And this goes all the way to my ins. company, which when I call them I get voice mail (of course) but the voice mails are full and so I cannot even leave a message. And this situation was multiple times with multiple parties- I was eventually told that everyone's voice mails is "full" and so I cannot contact them.
We have now moved completely out of the second floor, have had movers move our 'stuff' (in the George Carlin version of "stuff" and "$#it" routine) out of the house and have had the bats evicted (the bat sheriff comes along and puts up a little poster which says "you have 30 days to vacate the premises, after which period".... and so forth) and have the bat clean- up crew coming this week. After that, we can begin the De-construction (more difficult and expensive than demolition) of the second floor, come up with a scheme of rebuilding (the house is post and beam construction and will take a custom mechanical design to put a new roof on it that will meet current code), and begin that process. I hope to have a new structural roof on the house before snow flies (Nov- Dec at the latest) but the inside, including partition walls and floors, and the outside covering as well as trim, gutters, etc., etc. will probably not be gotten at until next spring.
So take heart, at least your difficulties are limited to the outside of your home; it could be a lot worse. My wife is not taking this well at all and it is proving to be a pretty big strain in every way imaginable, starting with emotionally, moving through financially, and finally on to the sheer size of this project, which will end up all the way to the ground as the house will have to be re-sided and very probably, re- windowed.
UGH.
And I do wish you the very best successes with your new roof- it does sound like it still has at least the possibility of coming out OK for you in the end, and you have not yet involved the legal system.
Brian
A train wreck is right. >:(
Yes, the three panels that are too short are all on one side and these three are the last three on that end. Meaning that they can be replaced without having to remove any other panels. The metal ridge cap will have to be removed though.
At least those three shorties are covering the roof, mostly. I still have two 20' panels that didn't get ordered and the roof in that section is only covered by the water/ice membrane. Those two missing panels are at the end of the roof but on the other side from the shorties.
-
Damn, Brian....
http://youtu.be/_Xh-VWn-VFY (http://youtu.be/_Xh-VWn-VFY)
-
Holy **** Brian!!!
Now that's some stress that no one needs in their life! I'm so sorry that this is happening to you and I hope that it gets resolved soon!
Something similar happened to my wife's father recently. I'll try to make the long story short.
My father-in-law's house was a 150 year old farm house out in the country. He had a chimney fire that did some damage to the roof, not really too bad but bad enough that the insurance company was involved. It turns out that the house was so badly out of current building codes that it was cheaper to demolish the whole thing rather than try to rebuild it and bring it up to code. But it took the insurance company a year to make the decision. They couldn't live in the house so the insurance company put them up in a local motel while they decided what needs to be done. Yes, this took an entire year and the stress almost ended his marriage.
Sorry, maybe you don't want to hear that story and perhaps you don't want to mention this to your poor wife. In the end my father-in-law got a brand new house though so take heart. :)
-
That is not all that unlike my situation; we are talking about updating the electrical service and there is some question about the foundation / footings as well. I do not <think> it will come to that but at this time there is no clear limit to where the cut- off of new construction will be due to code and what we find in the walls regarding original building techniques and wood member sizes (Easy Boys!).
My situation with the insurance co. is a bit different though- they accepted the claim and were trying to come up with a price.... and when they did, they denied the claim. So my 'tussle' with them will be through the legal system. In the meantime, all repairs will be out- of- pocket as this structure needs to stiffened (Boys!) for the coming winter; the current roof is not structurally able to support any reasonable snow load IMO.
Thanks for the well- wishes but no need for sympathy- hey, stuff happens and this can and will be dealt with. My only real emotional response is with the ins. co., which I feel failed to act in anything even approaching a 'good faith' manner. Otherwise, we will forge ahead and as you said, there will be some things to come out of this on our end too.... finally going to get rid of that creek on the fourth stair tread (yep, staircase has to go to). :o ::) ;D
And still, best of luck with your own roof- I did not mean to de-rail your thread.
Brian
Holy **** Brian!!!
Now that's some stress that no one needs in their life! I'm so sorry that this is happening to you and I hope that it gets resolved soon!
Something similar happened to my wife's father recently. I'll try to make the long story short.
My father-in-law's house was a 150 year old farm house out in the country. He had a chimney fire that did some damage to the roof, not really too bad but bad enough that the insurance company was involved. It turns out that the house was so badly out of current building codes that it was cheaper to demolish the whole thing rather than try to rebuild it and bring it up to code. But it took the insurance company a year to make the decision. They couldn't live in the house so the insurance company put them up in a local motel while they decided what needs to be done. Yes, this took an entire year and the stress almost ended his marriage.
Sorry, maybe you don't want to hear that story and perhaps you don't want to mention this to your poor wife. In the end my father-in-law got a brand new house though so take heart. :)
-
So how is it going on that there roof Conrad? Any progress? Regress? Holding at neutral?
Brian
-
Brian,
Still holding in neutral (see post #51). It'll be two weeks this Friday so I'm hoping that the metal comes in next week and the roof gets completed then. I'm not holding my breath though. If the metal doesn't come in next week I'll be contacting my lawyer and then we'll see what he can do for me. I'm not sure that he can do anything at all. The contract doesn't specify how long the job may take. I was told by two different employees of this roofing company that the job would take no more than 3 days after the tear off, but that wasn't in writing.
What's going on with your house project?
-
Here's your chance to be famous....http://catchacontractor.com/#application (http://catchacontractor.com/#application)
Have you been screwed over by a bad contractor?
Know someone who has?
Did you pay a contractor to work on your home or yard only to have him screw up the job and abandon it?
Adam Carolla and the “Catch a Contractor” team want to help fix your construction nightmare.
“Catch a Contractor” aims to turn the table on general contractors who have done their clients wrong and help homeowners regain their dignity and their humble abodes from the clutches of crooked contractors.
If your contractor left you with sparking electrical outlets, clogged pipes, tiles popping, walls that aren’t plumb, floors that aren’t level, a leaky roof, cracking concrete, or a falling fence, and you want justice then APPLY NOW.
-
Here's your chance to be famous....http://catchacontractor.com/#application (http://catchacontractor.com/#application)
Have you been screwed over by a bad contractor?
Know someone who has?
Did you pay a contractor to work on your home or yard only to have him screw up the job and abandon it?
Adam Carolla and the “Catch a Contractor” team want to help fix your construction nightmare.
“Catch a Contractor” aims to turn the table on general contractors who have done their clients wrong and help homeowners regain their dignity and their humble abodes from the clutches of crooked contractors.
If your contractor left you with sparking electrical outlets, clogged pipes, tiles popping, walls that aren’t plumb, floors that aren’t level, a leaky roof, cracking concrete, or a falling fence, and you want justice then APPLY NOW.
That's an idea! :thumbs:
-
Yeah, the legal thing is tough because trying to quantify 'pain and suffering' is impossible and everyone has a different opinion. As long as the contractor comes through in the end, <almost> no matter how difficult or long that path is, they kinda', mostly, did fulfill their legal obligation. Of course all of this is my opinion and I am not a lawyer so.... take it for the free thought that it is.
We have evicted the bats (three of the nastier, tougher ones filed an appeal but lost on summary judgement) and cleaned up the attic, and that went pretty smoothly if not cheaply (~$3,500 and I got NOTHING for any of my precious, precious guano!). Color me a happy camper on that front. Next up is blocking off the second floor staircase so we can keep the upstairs.... disaster entirely upstairs. Then a temporary ladder or stair-set outside to the second floor where the hole has to be made so there is access to that floor without the internal staircase. The deconstruction phase it contracted and will begin in two weeks.
I had absolutely no intention of doing any of this and planned on leaving this house, feet- first, with the current roof in place. But seeing as this situation has happened, we would be foolish if we did not consider as many options as possible; the Chinese word for 'crisis' translates roughly into 'danger' and 'opportunity'. The danger part we have to deal with but there is also opportunity to alter the second floor, expand it, change the floor layout, heating / cooling and many other things. And because the rough construction has to happen anyway, and that is by far the bulk of the expense, it does become <fairly> easy to add some things. For example, I am working through a very interesting idea of putting 'blisters' (naval term, not sure what architects call them but the bulges or outward projections on the second floor of a residential building) on one or both sides of the house. The neat thing about this is that the outer part of the projection of, say, four feet, would be 'hung' by the outer walls with the roof trusses carrying the load. Residential houses are built in compression virtually exclusively; this would be a neat twist on conventional building practices, and yield a four or eight foot wider house, at least for the middle 20 feet or so (the blisters would not run full length). A chase running down both sides would further allow heating, electrical, air conditioning, domestic hot water and a pair of chimneys to run up the sides of the house fully enclosed and 'invisible' from inside or outside. So while the project itself is not desirable, it can be made to have desirable side effects and results I think. Anyway, that is what we are working through now- the finish design and what is most desirable, along with the fascinating engineering challenges some of these designs present. I really lucked out and found a structural engineer who is open to my unusual ideas on this and that is great 'cause "we've never done it like that before" really gets in the way of most of this stuff. I can do the design, modeling and calculations but as I am not a structural engineer (wrong denomination), cannot submit designs to the building dept. of my town.... but the gentleman I am working with can do so.
So the whole thing proceeds with much wariness and a fair bit of worry but also great expectations and very positive aspects.... just like most of life I guess. ;) And I also finally got that gouge out of the stairway bannister.... but cutting out the bannister with a recip. saw and throwing it away. This assumes the new bannister does not come pre- gouged, of course. :rotflmao:
Brian
Brian,
Still holding in neutral (see post #51). It'll be two weeks this Friday so I'm hoping that the metal comes in next week and the roof gets completed then. I'm not holding my breath though. If the metal doesn't come in next week I'll be contacting my lawyer and then we'll see what he can do for me. I'm not sure that he can do anything at all. The contract doesn't specify how long the job may take. I was told by two different employees of this roofing company that the job would take no more than 3 days after the tear off, but that wasn't in writing.
What's going on with your house project?
-
Brian,
Wow, your project sounds HUGE! Are you anticipating that it gets completed before the snow flies?
-
No. I would like to have a weatherproof shell up before snow but just the rough carpentry, a shingled roof) for the weather) but nothing inside but an echo chamber :-) Outside will be Tyvek or equivalent on the upper floor.
We will know much better in a couple of weeks what is going to / able to happen. Have to see inside the structure before making any final decisions on just what we are going to do.
Brian
Brian,
Wow, your project sounds HUGE! Are you anticipating that it gets completed before the snow flies?
-
Brian, you might want to start a new thread for this project so that we can follow along and commiserate (word of the day) with you. Sounds really interesting.
-
Brian, you might want to start a new thread for this project so that we can follow along and commiserate (word of the day) with you. Sounds really interesting.
MUCH more interesting when we get to watch without having to open our checkbooks. ;)
-
Yep, my fault and I apologize for driving this topic sideways. :-[
Brian
Brian, you might want to start a new thread for this project so that we can follow along and commiserate (word of the day) with you. Sounds really interesting.
-
No fault inferred. I'm just thinking it might be more of a Haroldo type thread, if you know what I mean. They've made tv shows out of less.. I'd submit it to DIY or HGTV. Nothing to lose.
-
HA! My wife wrote "This Old House" but never received a response.
I think I will start a new thread though....
Brian
No fault inferred. I'm just thinking it might be more of a Haroldo type thread, if you know what I mean. They've made tv shows out of less.. I'd submit it to DIY or HGTV. Nothing to lose.
-
Brian, you might want to start a new thread for this project so that we can follow along and commiserate (word of the day) with you. Sounds really interesting.
I think I will start a new thread though....
OH you guys! ::) ...always letting max' get away with shirking his moderator duties. If he doesn't split it off and move it for you he's going to forget how to do it. Then next he'll quit being a moderator and we'll have to go back to picking on V'Jim.
-
>:( ;D
-
OH you guys! ::) ...always letting max' get away with shirking his moderator duties. If he doesn't split it off and move it for you he's going to forget how to do it. Then next he'll quit being a moderator and we'll have to go back to picking on V'Jim.
You mean that we're not sposed to be picking on Jim?
-
>:( >:(
-
>:( >:(
Are you mad that we're not picking on you or that we are? ???
-
Are you mad that we're not picking on you or that we are? ???
I'm sure he prefers :hail: :hail: :hail:
...and speaking of hail, you get much there in Chi-town far west Conrad? I don't remember much of it when I lived up there but with global...I better not say that...we'll end up with a locked thread....hmmm...with the changing times do you get much? (easy boys, I mean hail).
Here in Texas I've had the insurance company buy me two roofs so far, now they've raised the deductibles so much (just for roofs) that everyone tries to make them last forever. 15-20 years ago everyone would pray for hail when their roofs got old, now not so much.
-
Are you mad that we're not picking on you or that we are? ???
;D
-
I'm sure he prefers :hail: :hail: :hail:
...and speaking of hail, you get much there in Chi-town far west Conrad? I don't remember much of it when I lived up there but with global...I better not say that...we'll end up with a locked thread....hmmm...with the changing times do you get much? (easy boys, I mean hail).
Here in Texas I've had the insurance company buy me two roofs so far, now they've raised the deductibles so much (just for roofs) that everyone tries to make them last forever. 15-20 years ago everyone would pray for hail when their roofs got old, now not so much.
We get some occasionally but not very often. Normally the large storms go around us here for some reason, not always though. We've had hail but nothing really large.
-
The roofing company is here to finish up my roof.
5 weeks for a three day job... :o
They had to order more metal and the owner was bitching to me that he had to pay another set-up fee for the 'extra' metal. Who's fault is that?
-
A wonder if the contractor had to prepay to the supplier?
-
Personally, I think it is the English standard measuring system.... I mean let's face it, anybody having to work with feet, inches and fractions is bound to have trouble. It starts off poorly with 'A pint's a pound, the whole world round' except for the places where it is not, of course. Which is why, of course, C-14 fobs are manufactured to metric units of wonderfulness.
Best of luck with your roof....
Brian
The roofing company is here to finish up my roof.
5 weeks for a three day job... :o
They had to order more metal and the owner was bitching to me that he had to pay another set-up fee for the 'extra' metal. Who's fault is that?
-
A wonder if the contractor had to prepay to the supplier?
I have no doubt.
-
Personally, I think it is the English standard measuring system.... I mean let's face it, anybody having to work with feet, inches and fractions is bound to have trouble. It starts off poorly with 'A pint's a pound, the whole world round' except for the places where it is not, of course. Which is why, of course, C-14 fobs are manufactured to metric units of wonderfulness.
Best of luck with your roof....
Brian
Thanks Brian. The installer is coming back today and he claims that the roof will be done by noon. He even brought matching paint that came from the manufacturer to fix the areas that he scratched.
Metric or not.
Hey, I cut it twice and it's still too short!
-
Hmmmmm, metal roof issues......metal brake line issues......coincidence? I think not. I'm thinking you should stay away from anything metal at this point.
-
Hmmmmm, metal roof issues......metal brake line issues......coincidence? I think not. I'm thinking you should stay away from anything metal at this point.
Even Connie? :o
I prolly won't have to worry over much about salt on the roof at least
-
Even Connie? :o
I prolly won't have to worry over much about salt on the roof at least
And hopefully not on the Connie either!!
Salt/chemicals/beet juice has become Mn DOTs preferred method of snow removal over plowing. I wish the environmental extremists would jump on the bandwagon to get them to stop on the premise it's polluting the "Land of 10,000 Lakes" waters (which it is). Salt never goes away, just keeps building up. Vehicles really take a beating up here.
-
So did it get done? What was the final outcome?
-
So did it get done? What was the final outcome?
Yep, it FINALLY got done. A 2 to 3 day job turned into a 5 week ordeal instead. The installer was able to take his time (this time) and fixed all of his screw ups (which shouldn't have happened in the first place). He actually did a fantastic job of the flashing around my chimney. I'll snap some pics if anyone is interested? I already have pics of the screw ups.
-
Without pics, it didn't happen. 8)
-
Glad to hear it had a happy ending Conrad. And in a while, the roof will still be on the house while the pain of the install fades. And it sounds like you did not suffer any other damage due to the roof being opened to weather- which is a fantastic thing. As bad as things are, they can always be made worse when it rains.... in the kitchen.
By all means, please do share some photos. I find steel roofs interesting although they are pretty rare around here (southern New England).
Brian
Yep, it FINALLY got done. A 2 to 3 day job turned into a 5 week ordeal instead. The installer was able to take his time (this time) and fixed all of his screw ups (which shouldn't have happened in the first place). He actually did a fantastic job of the flashing around my chimney. I'll snap some pics if anyone is interested? I already have pics of the screw ups.
-
Thanks Brian.
I'll go up top and get some pics of the finished roof. I'll show y'all the screw ups too.
Now that the flashing is all done around the chimney I'll be installing brick panels on the chimney. It's not really a chimney, it's a chase around the woodstove vent that I made to look like a chimney.
-
Send the drone up. :)
-
Send the drone up. :)
Won't do any good. My RC helicopters don't have cameras. :)
-
HA! Funny world- I have a brick chimney I plan on replacing with a wooden chase when it has to be raised (new roof will be considerably taller). In other words, I want my chimney to look like a chase and you are going the other way.... :-)
Brian
Thanks Brian.
I'll go up top and get some pics of the finished roof. I'll show y'all the screw ups too.
Now that the flashing is all done around the chimney I'll be installing brick panels on the chimney. It's not really a chimney, it's a chase around the woodstove vent that I made to look like a chimney.
-
HA! Funny world- I have a brick chimney I plan on replacing with a wooden chase when it has to be raised (new roof will be considerably taller). In other words, I want my chimney to look like a chase and you are going the other way.... :-)
Brian
Bizarro World? :)
-
ran across this gem, thought it appropriate...
enjoy...
https://youtu.be/cz4dgkiaezA
-
I like those old tv shows. None of this shaky cam s :censored: t. Reminded me of Ma and Pa Kettle. Sometimes we pile into my truck and go to Fredericksburg and it's Ma and Pa Kettle go to town.. And yes this has nothing to do with roofs.
-
ran across this gem, thought it appropriate...
enjoy...
https://youtu.be/cz4dgkiaezA
Well now, that was entertaining! Thanks Rich!
My salesman wasn't nearly as attractive as that (black and white) blonde though. >:( I am glad that he didn't try to kiss me though.
-
It's been a couple months now, can we get updates?
Conrad,
How's the roof holding up?
Brian,
What happened to your "housing adventure"?
Thanks!
-
On my end, mostly waiting.... waiting for drawings / plans so I can draw permits and begin. The top of the building has been reinforced more than sufficiently to withstand any <reasonable> wind or weather, not sure about any record amounts of snow though. Still hoping, probably foolishly now, to have a new structure up before Jan 2016 (note: not anywhere near completed or even sided or shingled, just in place and dried- in).
Brian
It's been a couple months now, can we get updates?
Conrad,
How's the roof holding up?
Brian,
What happened to your "housing adventure"?
Thanks!
-
It's been a couple months now, can we get updates?
Conrad,
How's the roof holding up?
Brian,
What happened to your "housing adventure"?
Thanks!
So far so good. We've had our first snow of the season last week, ~10" of very heavy very wet snow. The snow is gone now but we weren't home for the thaw so I don't know if the snow slid off in big sheets or not.