Author Topic: Key stuck  (Read 7716 times)

Offline B.D.F.

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Re: Key stuck
« Reply #40 on: January 17, 2019, 09:14:05 AM »
This is  a new problem, at least to me. It will be interesting to see what is causing that problem.

Brian

Same thing it has always displayed. A rendering of the stove knob with two arrows wrapping around it,  one pointing clockwise the other ccw
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Offline maxtog

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Re: Key stuck
« Reply #41 on: January 17, 2019, 03:42:44 PM »
This is  a new problem, at least to me. It will be interesting to see what is causing that problem.

I have never seen/heard of this happening before either.  I still suspect a physical problem with the solenoid linkage or perhaps the cylinder is damaged and will just not turn and the ignition will need to be disassembled.  In such a case, I would strongly recommend a competent dealer.

Since we have not seen this before, it can be surmised this is a very rare thing.
Shoodaben (was Guhl) Mountain Runner ECU flash, Canyon Cages front/rear, Helibars risers, Phil's wedges, Grip Puppies, Sargent World seat-low & heated & pod, Muzzy lowering links, Soupy's stand, Nautilus air horn, Admore lightbar, Ronnie's highway pegs, front running lights, all LED, helmet locks, RAM Xgrip, Sena SMH10, Throttle Tamer, MRA X-Creen, BearingUp Shifter, PR4-GT, Scorpion EXO-T1200,etc

Offline BrianK

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Re: Key stuck
« Reply #42 on: January 17, 2019, 04:25:05 PM »
Got home 1/2 hr ago been at it since.  No change.  Tonight I will swing a little harder, douse a little heavier then disassemble this weekend if no change.  There will be no dealership involvement it will be fixed in my garage by me

Offline maxtog

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Re: Key stuck
« Reply #43 on: January 17, 2019, 06:31:38 PM »
frankly Max, I'm just gonna drop this one, and let you figure it n out...

Not sure why you are having to be nasty... (at least it appears to me to be that way, as I am guessing most people would.).

Quote
I'm strictly basing this on all the responses prior, and when you had the response of the "lock" position, vs the "FSS"Position... I actually double face palmed myself..

My line of questioning was wondering if the steering lock persisted, somehow, even though it was in the fss position, thinking maybe it could bind the key from turning (as can sometimes happen when it is actually in the lock position).  I am not sure if that is possible, it was just wild speculation.

Quote
great find relating to the solenoid... which I noted prior as the switch issue...
 :thumbs: :thumbs: :nuts: :nuts: :popcorn: :popcorn: in response #25...duh.

The microswitch and solenoid are two different things of which one or the other or both can fail.

Is this some type of competition or game?  I can assure you, it wasn't/isn't for me.  I thought we were trying to solve a problem for someone...

Quote
I'm gonna have a nice cup of tea, and resign from "further " attempts...[...]thanx Max.  you handle this one, I'm out.

 ::)  Yeesh.  I see no reason to punish BrianK (and insulting me) because you are apparently assigning hostility or malice to something I said.  I can assure you, no such thing was intended.
Shoodaben (was Guhl) Mountain Runner ECU flash, Canyon Cages front/rear, Helibars risers, Phil's wedges, Grip Puppies, Sargent World seat-low & heated & pod, Muzzy lowering links, Soupy's stand, Nautilus air horn, Admore lightbar, Ronnie's highway pegs, front running lights, all LED, helmet locks, RAM Xgrip, Sena SMH10, Throttle Tamer, MRA X-Creen, BearingUp Shifter, PR4-GT, Scorpion EXO-T1200,etc

Offline maxtog

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Re: Key stuck
« Reply #44 on: January 17, 2019, 06:49:19 PM »
Got home 1/2 hr ago been at it since.  No change.  Tonight I will swing a little harder, douse a little heavier then disassemble this weekend if no change.  There will be no dealership involvement it will be fixed in my garage by me

:)  You are a braver soul than I, for sure!  Having my gas cap assembly fall apart into a pile of little pieces that are undocumented in the factory manual was traumatic enough to make me very "lock shy."  I just tried to find a diagram of the ignition switch assembly, no luck.  Yuck.
Shoodaben (was Guhl) Mountain Runner ECU flash, Canyon Cages front/rear, Helibars risers, Phil's wedges, Grip Puppies, Sargent World seat-low & heated & pod, Muzzy lowering links, Soupy's stand, Nautilus air horn, Admore lightbar, Ronnie's highway pegs, front running lights, all LED, helmet locks, RAM Xgrip, Sena SMH10, Throttle Tamer, MRA X-Creen, BearingUp Shifter, PR4-GT, Scorpion EXO-T1200,etc

Offline BrianK

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Re: Key stuck
« Reply #45 on: January 17, 2019, 06:54:28 PM »
frankly Max, I'm just gonna drop this one, and let you figure it n out...
have a day.

I'm strictly basing this on all the responses prior, and when you had the response of the "lock" position, vs the "FSS"Position... I actually double face palmed myself..

sorry o/p, Max will help you./

great find relating to the solenoid... which I noted prior as the switch issue...
 :thumbs: :thumbs: :nuts: :nuts: :popcorn: :popcorn: in response #25...


duh.


I'm gonna have a nice cup of tea, and resign from "further " attempts...
'
buy a new ignition switch, and stove knob, and have it programmed to your bike.


 :battle: :grouphug: :nuts: :deadhorse:
you handle this one, I'm out.



Well thanks for the half hearted effort and for momentarily putting up with the silly diatribe!! No sarcasm intended I do appreciate any help

Offline VirginiaJim

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Re: Key stuck
« Reply #46 on: January 18, 2019, 08:16:30 AM »
To quote one of my favorite people 'Well, my, my, my.'  Lieutenant Kenda.


Rich, lighten up please.
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Offline B.D.F.

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Re: Key stuck
« Reply #47 on: January 18, 2019, 09:02:19 AM »
OFFTOPIC, or at least not a cranky post :-)

I have been thinking about this a little bit and would suggest opening up the covers around the ignition switch assembly and taking a look at the shot- pin that locks the ignition via the solenoid. That assembly can be seen / modified without taking the entire ass'y apart and would be an easier first step in diagnosis I believe. Plus, you will have to take all of that same stuff apart to actually remove the ign. ass'y anyway so no extra labor. It is possible that the shot pin broke or froze, or that there is some piece of debris in the shot- pin hole that is not allowing the cylinder to rotate.

There is a very good video on YouTube about how to access that solenoid. What the author is documenting is incorrect, that it is actually a solenoid failure that causes the dreaded KiPass stuck activation switch but just ignore the words and use the video for instruction on how to get at it and they you can visually verify whether it is working or now.

Now back to your regularly scheduled slug- fest. :-)

Brian

P.S. To BrianK: Rich is really harmless, just grouchy like that alien in Men In Black. And you are not really the target- there IS NO target, Rich is just being cranky and your thread was available. He is not a bad guy in person, or on- line about 2/3 of the time..... just take him with a shaker full of grains of salt.  ;) ;D
Homo Sapiens Sapiens and just a tad of Neanderthal but it usually does not show....  My Private mail is blocked; it is not you, it is me, just like that dating partner said all those years ago. Please send an e-mail if you want to contact me privately.

KiPass keeping you up at night? Fuel gauge warning burning your retinas? Get unlimited peace and harmony here: www.incontrolne.com

Offline VirginiaJim

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Re: Key stuck
« Reply #48 on: January 18, 2019, 11:55:11 AM »
He's being cranky on another board as well...


Could it be debris in the mechanism that's locked it in place?
"LOCTITE®"  The original thread locker...  #11  2020 Indian Roadmaster, ABS, Cruise control, heated grips and seats/w/AC 46 Monitoring with cutting edge technology U.N.I.T is Back! Member in good standing with the Knights of MEH.

Offline BrianK

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Re: Key stuck
« Reply #49 on: January 18, 2019, 01:07:56 PM »
OFFTOPIC, or at least not a cranky post :-)

I have been thinking about this a little bit and would suggest opening up the covers around the ignition switch assembly and taking a look at the shot- pin that locks the ignition via the solenoid. That assembly can be seen / modified without taking the entire ass'y apart and would be an easier first step in diagnosis I believe. Plus, you will have to take all of that same stuff apart to actually remove the ign. ass'y anyway so no extra labor. It is possible that the shot pin broke or froze, or that there is some piece of debris in the shot- pin hole that is not allowing the cylinder to rotate.

There is a very good video on YouTube about how to access that solenoid. What the author is documenting is incorrect, that it is actually a solenoid failure that causes the dreaded KiPass stuck activation switch but just ignore the words and use the video for instruction on how to get at it and they you can visually verify whether it is working or now.

Now back to your regularly scheduled slug- fest. :-)

Brian

P.S. To BrianK: Rich is really harmless, just grouchy like that alien in Men In Black. And you are not really the target- there IS NO target, Rich is just being cranky and your thread was available. He is not a bad guy in person, or on- line about 2/3 of the time..... just take him with a shaker full of grains of salt.  ;) ;D

Brian, 
I did watch that video last night and agree that he is incorrect and I took the switch assembly/upper triple clamp off last night so as soon as I get home I'll take off the solenoid cover and scavenge around for debris. I'll update this thread shortly after...

Offline MAN OF BLUES

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Re: Key stuck
« Reply #50 on: January 18, 2019, 01:53:51 PM »
Sorry guys, was just having a bad day, didn't mean to be so grouchy.
 had just returned from picking up a tin of ashes from the vet's office.

carry on, I think BDF's idea right now is the best to follow up on.

46 YEARS OF KAW.....  47 years of DEVO..

Offline BrianK

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FIXERATED!!!!!
« Reply #51 on: January 18, 2019, 05:17:46 PM »
SOOOO I decided to take apart. The more I took apart the more i realized I am screwed. No way can I get this thing back together :'(
After every step I tried and still no worky. I had it down to basically bare bones nothing and it still wouldn't work :battle:
Then a little something something caught my eye. There's a copper clasp like thingy way down the bottom and i spotted an unauthorized user hanging out incognito like tring to avoid me :o

nabbed that little f$%^$er and my key turned!!! Every step of reassembly checked again to make sure key worked.....
Put it all back together and NOTHING THE F-ing   key wouldn't turn again UGH! But then I realized I reassembled in lock position must push and turn and bingo!!!!! Motor purring!!!!

Sadly we did lose a member of our party on reassembly. A moment of silence please for the steering lock position assembly....there is no way in hell I could get that thing back in it's like a chinese water torture jedi mind puzzle that i don't have the patience and know how to do. If you look at my pics you'll see what i am speaking of and you'll think wow that's easy to do so I invite you and your family over to have at it!!

Offline BrianK

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Re: Key stuck
« Reply #52 on: January 18, 2019, 05:24:17 PM »
OOH look I spotted the foreigner in my blurry pic look I circled the offender in red.....

Offline gPink

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Re: Key stuck
« Reply #53 on: January 18, 2019, 05:35:36 PM »
Were you able to determine what the offending foreign object is or where it's from?

Offline BrianK

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Re: Key stuck
« Reply #54 on: January 18, 2019, 06:22:37 PM »
A copper clasp on the bottom that holds together the tumbler

Offline VirginiaJim

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Re: Key stuck
« Reply #55 on: January 18, 2019, 07:19:34 PM »
Wow!  Just wow!  Glad you figured it out.  What year bike?
"LOCTITE®"  The original thread locker...  #11  2020 Indian Roadmaster, ABS, Cruise control, heated grips and seats/w/AC 46 Monitoring with cutting edge technology U.N.I.T is Back! Member in good standing with the Knights of MEH.

Offline maxtog

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Re: Key stuck
« Reply #56 on: January 18, 2019, 07:54:48 PM »
A copper clasp on the bottom that holds together the tumbler

HA!
One little tiny thing.  That's all it takes!  (I assume you put the clasp back on the tumbler to keep it together?  Are you lucky that the tumbler didn't fall apart in a zillion springs and nibs?)

Congrats and thanks for the info/pics.
Shoodaben (was Guhl) Mountain Runner ECU flash, Canyon Cages front/rear, Helibars risers, Phil's wedges, Grip Puppies, Sargent World seat-low & heated & pod, Muzzy lowering links, Soupy's stand, Nautilus air horn, Admore lightbar, Ronnie's highway pegs, front running lights, all LED, helmet locks, RAM Xgrip, Sena SMH10, Throttle Tamer, MRA X-Creen, BearingUp Shifter, PR4-GT, Scorpion EXO-T1200,etc

Offline BrianK

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Re: Key stuck
« Reply #57 on: January 18, 2019, 09:38:20 PM »
Wow!  Just wow!  Glad you figured it out.  What year bike?
2009

Offline BrianK

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Re: Key stuck
« Reply #58 on: January 18, 2019, 09:46:06 PM »
HA!
One little tiny thing.  That's all it takes!  (I assume you put the clasp back on the tumbler to keep it together?  Are you lucky that the tumbler didn't fall apart in a zillion springs and nibs?)

Congrats and thanks for the info/pics.
I took a really small flat head screwdriver and stuck it between clasp and tumbler wall and pushed the clasp towards the center of assembly and didn't really get any movement out of it probably accomplishing nothing....also you would be surprised, or at least I was, how few parts make up the tumbler it is such super simple set-up.

Offline B.D.F.

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Re: FIXERATED!!!!!
« Reply #59 on: January 19, 2019, 09:25:35 AM »
Glad to hear that you got it running, fixed the problem and best of all, identified the problem. Nothing worse IMO that tinkering with something, having a problem 'go away' and having no idea what, if anything at all, you did to 'fix' it. That is a sure recipe for the original problem to come back and bite you on the butt.....

Brian

SOOOO I decided to take apart. The more I took apart the more i realized I am screwed. No way can I get this thing back together :'(
After every step I tried and still no worky. I had it down to basically bare bones nothing and it still wouldn't work :battle:
Then a little something something caught my eye. There's a copper clasp like thingy way down the bottom and i spotted an unauthorized user hanging out incognito like tring to avoid me :o

nabbed that little f$%^$er and my key turned!!! Every step of reassembly checked again to make sure key worked.....
Put it all back together and NOTHING THE F-ing   key wouldn't turn again UGH! But then I realized I reassembled in lock position must push and turn and bingo!!!!! Motor purring!!!!

<snip>

Homo Sapiens Sapiens and just a tad of Neanderthal but it usually does not show....  My Private mail is blocked; it is not you, it is me, just like that dating partner said all those years ago. Please send an e-mail if you want to contact me privately.

KiPass keeping you up at night? Fuel gauge warning burning your retinas? Get unlimited peace and harmony here: www.incontrolne.com