Rear Brake/ABS Pump issue

[maxtog]

Would you be interested in breaking this off into a thread of it's own? The Boss could then archive the repair.

The bigger issue is hosted photos disappearing.  Photos from third-party sites often just disappear after several months, a year, or just some day, crippling what would be a good archival thread/topic.  On important threads it is best to have the photos uploaded to the native site (zggtr.org) if possible.

[jamiemac]

The bigger issue is hosted photos disappearing.  Photos from third-party sites often just disappear after several months, a year, or just some day, crippling what would be a good archival thread/topic.  On important threads it is best to have the photos uploaded to the native site (zggtr.org) if possible.

I'd be glad to do that, only I'd have to figure out how it's done. I didn't know we could host pics directly on the forum.

[maxtog]

I'd be glad to do that, only I'd have to figure out how it's done. I didn't know we could host pics directly on the forum.

Sure, it is easy- when posting, see the option called "Attachments and other options" then use the "Attach: Browse" button.  Up to 4 photos can be attached to each posting; 6MB total.

[gPink]

Could you not also post them in the Media section shown on the menu bar above?

[jamiemac]

Going through my posts and re-posting the pics on the forum server.

[maxtog]

Could you not also post them in the Media section shown on the menu bar above?

I know not what you are talking about.  The only thing above the text posting area are controls for tags and inserting links.

[gPink]

look up max

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[maxtog]

look up max

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Oh, way up there.  Interesting, never noticed that before.  There are so many features of SMF.

[Freddy]

Great job man, many kudos..

I have a donor non functioning unit sitting here presently that I had planned on disassembling for a post mortem just as you did, but have not cracked it open yet... hopefully I find the exact same issue with this one, which will go a long way to corroberate the failure,

I will take as many photos as possible also during the event, and share them here also.

I should have done this a month ago, but the weather has not co operated here in Ohio, till just recently...

Just out of curiosity, where there any stampings and part serial numbers you noticed on the assemblies, that we may use for future references, to identify the production date or code for documentation?

Thanks again,

 

[sportytoes]

The frt brake solenoids seemed fine. I could move them with my fingers. I still flushed fresh fluid through them also. It's messy to do, and wastes a lot of brake fluid, but I think it works. After I buttoned everything back up, I had the idea to submerge the unit in brake fluid, but To do that, the pump motor would definitely need to come off, and I advise against that.

Apologies, my mind does not track well here. I wanted to clarify so that I can replicate your success. 

The solenoids are the 4 metal fixed tubes under the electronic control module. How did you move those with your fingers after the love taps with a mallet?

[jamiemac]

Apologies, my mind does not track well here. I wanted to clarify so that I can replicate your success. 

The solenoids are the 4 metal fixed tubes under the electronic control module. How did you move those with your fingers after the love taps with a mallet?

They move in and out. It's a very small amount. Probably 1/8 to 1/16 inch. Once freed up, the stuck solenoid on mine has functioned normally since. probably 1K miles so far.

[sportytoes]

I partially tore down my ABS unit, and found the sticking solenoid valve. Took the snap ring out, and freed it up. Cleaned it. Wasn't terribly dirty inside. Air will now blow through the rear brake line ports. I'll reassemble tomorrow, and test it out.

Ahhh! I hav been reading lots of posts but missed the snap ring statement above. That it what i get for doing my research at midnight at the end of long days.

At this point I am past fixing my pump as I have found an alternative solution. I still have the burden of intellectual curiosity ruining my mental health. And that question is, how do you remove the snap ring? It is not intended to be a serviceable component. I see Jamie the super hero got it done. I want to be like Jamie and only a tamper resistant snap ring remains in my way. Any suggestions?

[jamiemac]

Ahhh! I hav been reading lots of posts but missed the snap ring statement above. That it what i get for doing my research at midnight at the end of long days.

At this point I am past fixing my pump as I have found an alternative solution. I still have the burden of intellectual curiosity ruining my mental health. And that question is, how do you remove the snap ring? It is not intended to be a serviceable component. I see Jamie the super hero got it done. I want to be like Jamie and only a tamper resistant snap ring remains in my way. Any suggestions?

That's a writing mistake on my part. I'm not sure why I put it that way, but when I found the sticking solenoid valve. removal of the snap ring isn't what made it free up. It wasn't even necessary, as the snap ring I removed didn't allow access to the sticking valve. I need to read over My stuff and correct the mistakes.

[jamiemac]

Just a quick update on a related event. I received a call from a an NHTSA investigator in reference to this issue. He asked for any pictures I had and if any other folks had the issue. I referred him to this forum. Also, another investigator will be calling with an update.

[jamiemac]

Email I recieved from NHTSA today.

"Hello James,

As per our conversation I will share your information with my college Peter Kivett. If he has any further questions he might contact you. I really appreciate you reporting this to our agency, public safety is our mission.

 

ODI- 10980896

2008 Kawasaki ZG1400A8F

Teves ABS module failure

 

James Mcclellan  is a professional mechanic  502-640-0246

He does all his own services and repairs to his motorcycle. He opened and cleaned the Teves ABS module, upon his inspection he found the brake fluid to be discolored with aluminum debris in it causing the solenoids to be stuck. He also mentioned online forums to support other riders with the same problem.

 

 

Thank You,

Santiago Maldonado"

 

Safety Defects Specialist

Medium & Heavy Duty Vehicles Division
U.S. Department Of Transportation
National Highway Traffic Safety Admin.
Office of Defects Investigation
1200 New Jersey Avenue, S.E.

Washington, D.C. 20590

Room W45-117

[Freddy]

Thanks for the update Jamie - great stuff - something's happening at last.  Kaw is not doing anything public about it (yet) as failures are so low in number - but life threatening!

[lather]

Wow, I just read this whole thread for the first time. I owned a non abs 08 from October 2007 until June 2017. So I never bothered to read ABS threads at all until now. My non abs 08 was totaled by a Toyota in May 2017 and I replaced it with an abs 08 in July. It runs great and the brakes work fantastic, better than the first 08 and the 09 (when it was running, I also have an 09 with a broken engine. ) The only problem with the abs bike was the gauge cluster had heat damage, so like the complete fool that I am I put the 09 cluster on. (Non abs).  Reading this thread it occured to me I had never felt the abs kick in nor had I noticed the  yellow light come on. The 09 cluster does not have a yellow light!.


I flushed the front brakes and clutch right after I bought it. But not the rear, cause I never, well hardly ever, use the rear brake.
So when it stops raining I am going to buy quart of DOT 4 and flush the rear and swap the guage cluster back. As I said I ownly use the rear brake now and then just to see if it is working and so far it has and did not feel abnormal, just a little weak same as my two non abs bikes. .

So what I am getting out of this thread is that there is potential for a failed abs pump without a warning light that I need to worry about and we are hoping  NHTSA will force a recall.  Have I missed anything important?

I am tempted to use parts from my non running 09 to convert the 08 to non abs.

[jamiemac]

So what I am getting out of this thread is that there is potential for a failed abs pump without a warning light that I need to worry about and we are hoping  NHTSA will force a recall.  Have I missed anything important?

I am tempted to use parts from my non running 09 to convert the 08 to non abs.

Yes, You've got the gist of the issue, although, it's rare enough that it shouldn't be a huge worry. One BIG downside is that normally in automotive use, an ABS failure doesn't result in total brake loss. It usually results in the brakes still functioning as non-ABS brakes until repaired. This was not my experience on the scoot, though. Total rear brake loss. I was glad it wasn't the fronts.

[Freddy]

+1.

lather, ABS is a good thing when it works as designed - HELL, brakes are a good thing when they work as designed, which they do not if you have this failure. 


OFF TOPIC

(Regarding the yellow ABS lamp which you don't have at present, I've read on a Triumph forum that when an owner fitted ABS to his non-ABS bike from a donor bike of the same model which came with ABS he had the same problem - no yellow ABS lamp on his cluster.  IIRC he found that his non-ABS cluster actually had the circuitry of the yellow lamp but was covered over by the speedo clock face.  I don't remember how he solved his problem tho, sorry.)

[jamiemac]

Just a note. I made the mistake of telling the G man it was a Teves ABS unit, in our phone conversation, but sent him an email and corrected it to Nissin. I'm going to send more pics of the torn down unit.