Author Topic: What did you do to your Concours today?  (Read 860757 times)

Offline just gone

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Re: What did you do to your Concours today?
« Reply #3060 on: June 18, 2018, 07:58:56 AM »
I think you also need this: https://www.ebay.com/p/Kawasaki-57001-1504-57001-1504-SIGNAL-CONVERTER/1222149426?iid=222991902057&chn=ps

.....and a USB cable, and a 'puter. and maybe a time machine?  ;) :
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Offline okrider

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Re: What did you do to your Concours today?
« Reply #3061 on: June 18, 2018, 09:00:03 AM »
I think you also need this: https://www.ebay.com/p/Kawasaki-57001-1504-57001-1504-SIGNAL-CONVERTER/1222149426?iid=222991902057&chn=ps

.....and a USB cable, and a 'puter. and maybe a time machine?  ;) :

Windows computer is achievable but the signal converter costs a little more than I expected. I guess I'll just go to the dealership one last time..
'11 Black: Russel Day-Long, Mountain Runner, cage w/ highway pegs, 2Bros Slip-on, Helibars Horizon

Offline Impster

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Re: What did you do to your Concours today?
« Reply #3062 on: June 19, 2018, 06:22:06 PM »
Installed some "special edition lime green" reflective rim tape thingies sold by "customTAYLOR33" on Amazon.

The color is close enough to Kawasaki green for my old eyes.

Specifically:
https://www.amazon.com/customTAYLOR33-Intensity-Reflective-Copyrighted-SportsBikes/dp/B014HXRJV8/ref=cm_cr_arp_d_product_top?ie=UTF8

The pre-curved sections went on easily and the glue is quite sticky. I was able to reposition them as long as I didn't press down on them.

Pics were taken in garage with moderate light when door open, then with door open flash enabled and then door closed with flash enabled.
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2016 Concourse 14 (Black), Corbin seat, Murph's risers, T-Rex lowering links and kickstand

Offline maxtog

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Re: What did you do to your Concours today?
« Reply #3063 on: June 19, 2018, 07:52:38 PM »
Kinda goes with your green pin-striping.  Would never put that on my silver :)
Shoodaben (was Guhl) Mountain Runner ECU flash, Canyon Cages front/rear, Helibars risers, Phil's wedges, Grip Puppies, Sargent World seat-low & heated & pod, Muzzy lowering links, Soupy's stand, Nautilus air horn, Admore lightbar, Ronnie's highway pegs, front running lights, all LED, helmet locks, RAM Xgrip, Sena SMH10, Throttle Tamer, MRA X-Creen, BearingUp Shifter, PR4-GT, Scorpion EXO-T1200,etc

Offline Conniesaki

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Re: What did you do to your Concours today?
« Reply #3064 on: June 19, 2018, 11:36:02 PM »
Installed some "special edition lime green" reflective rim tape thingies sold by "customTAYLOR33" on Amazon.

The color is close enough to Kawasaki green for my old eyes.

Specifically:
https://www.amazon.com/customTAYLOR33-Intensity-Reflective-Copyrighted-SportsBikes/dp/B014HXRJV8/ref=cm_cr_arp_d_product_top?ie=UTF8

The pre-curved sections went on easily and the glue is quite sticky. I was able to reposition them as long as I didn't press down on them.

Pics were taken in garage with moderate light when door open, then with door open flash enabled and then door closed with flash enabled.

Looks good  :thumbs:

BTW, I think the normal application method is to spray the area with a slightly soapy water mix, place the decal onto the wet surface, slide it around until it's in the right spot, hold it there with one hand and with the other squeegee the water out.

1 or 2 drops of dish detergent in a spray bottle of water works great.

Now you know for "next time"   :) :thumbs:

Offline Impster

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Re: What did you do to your Concours today?
« Reply #3065 on: June 20, 2018, 05:20:34 AM »
Kinda goes with your green pin-striping.  Would never put that on my silver :)

A lot of reviews for this color pointed out that it was close to Kawi green. But who really trusts amazon reviews? :)
They do have many other colors... you could get a bright purple or something?  ;D :yikes:

Looks good  :thumbs:

BTW, I think the normal application method is to spray the area with a slightly soapy water mix, place the decal onto the wet surface, slide it around until it's in the right spot, hold it there with one hand and with the other squeegee the water out.

1 or 2 drops of dish detergent in a spray bottle of water works great.

Now you know for "next time"   :) :thumbs:
Thanks!  :chugbeer:
 I thought that going in as well. However their instructions specifically stated not to use this method.
The glue on the back was quite tacky and didn't feel the same as other applications where I've used the squeegee method.

Chuck
----
2016 Concourse 14 (Black), Corbin seat, Murph's risers, T-Rex lowering links and kickstand

Offline okrider

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Re: What did you do to your Concours today?
« Reply #3066 on: June 20, 2018, 07:30:06 AM »
Called the dealership yesterday morning to tell them about the key needing to be reprogrammed. The guy who's selling the services immediately says he wants to charge me another $40 to reprogram my original key. So after a fiery discussion with him, he talks to his manager who agrees to get the job done with no additional charge which is what I'd expect in the first place as the dealership isn't close to my house and this is costing me valuable time, especially since nobody knows what they're doing. Went to the dealership after work, the guy who I talked to on the phone isn't there which is awesome because he's the worst salesperson I've ever seen. The other sales guy is actually quite nice, so is the person in charge of the service department.

They get the bike in, call Kawasaki to make sure they understand how the system works and program it. I still get the Subkey ID Error when the battery is out of the transponder which Kawasaki said was normal but reading up on it on the forum, it seems that they were wrong. But I'm over it. I'm done dealing with this dealership.

Just so I'm clear, does the original fob (the proximity one with the battery in it) start the bike when you put it against the front of the ignition with no battery in it? Or does it only work with the battery dead but in place? I have a 2011 model in case that matters.
« Last Edit: June 20, 2018, 08:58:26 AM by okrider »
'11 Black: Russel Day-Long, Mountain Runner, cage w/ highway pegs, 2Bros Slip-on, Helibars Horizon

Offline connie_rider

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Re: What did you do to your Concours today?
« Reply #3067 on: June 20, 2018, 08:42:13 AM »
I liked the way it glows, and looked for other colors from the same Reflective tape Supplier. {Taylor}
(I was looking for Red and found it).
They have quite a selection of colors.

Decided to look at Ebay too to see if Taylor was there.
Taylor was not, but this add is the exact same bike/wheel, but is from another supplier for 1/4 the cost.
May be the same tape manufacturer?
I assume it is not the same material or quality, but appears to be pretty reflective...

https://www.ebay.com/itm/16-17-18-19-Reflective-Rims-Tape-Wheel-Rim-Decal-Stripes-Sticker-Glowing-Green/322274707520?hash=item4b0911c840:g:ZR0AAOSwJtdaQYgb

Ride safe, Ted
« Last Edit: June 20, 2018, 09:28:45 AM by connie_rider »

Offline Conrad

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Re: What did you do to your Concours today?
« Reply #3068 on: June 20, 2018, 11:38:34 AM »
Called the dealership yesterday morning to tell them about the key needing to be reprogrammed. The guy who's selling the services immediately says he wants to charge me another $40 to reprogram my original key. So after a fiery discussion with him, he talks to his manager who agrees to get the job done with no additional charge which is what I'd expect in the first place as the dealership isn't close to my house and this is costing me valuable time, especially since nobody knows what they're doing. Went to the dealership after work, the guy who I talked to on the phone isn't there which is awesome because he's the worst salesperson I've ever seen. The other sales guy is actually quite nice, so is the person in charge of the service department.

They get the bike in, call Kawasaki to make sure they understand how the system works and program it. I still get the Subkey ID Error when the battery is out of the transponder which Kawasaki said was normal but reading up on it on the forum, it seems that they were wrong. But I'm over it. I'm done dealing with this dealership.

Just so I'm clear, does the original fob (the proximity one with the battery in it) start the bike when you put it against the front of the ignition with no battery in it? Or does it only work with the battery dead but in place? I have a 2011 model in case that matters.

There's two types of fobs for this bike.



The lager fob on the right above works in two ways. If the battery is working then it just needs to be near the bike (~5 feet or less). If the battery is dead or missing then the fob needs to be touching the ignition boss area. This means that you can test that the programming has been done correctly by removing the battery and the key then placing the fob on the boss.

The smaller fob needs to be touching the boss in order to work and it doesn't take a battery. 
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Offline okrider

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Re: What did you do to your Concours today?
« Reply #3069 on: June 20, 2018, 11:56:30 AM »
If the battery is dead or missing then the fob needs to be touching the ignition boss area. This means that you can test that the programming has been done correctly by removing the battery and the key then placing the fob on the boss.

The smaller fob needs to be touching the boss in order to work and it doesn't take a battery.

Yeah, thanks for confirming. I need to find someone who has the program and do the work myself.
'11 Black: Russel Day-Long, Mountain Runner, cage w/ highway pegs, 2Bros Slip-on, Helibars Horizon

Offline maxtog

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Re: What did you do to your Concours today?
« Reply #3070 on: June 20, 2018, 03:20:05 PM »
There's two types of fobs for this bike.

Good post.

I tend to use the terms "active" and "passive" to describe the fobs; it is the two types of RFID (radio frequency identification).  The smaller one is "passive only", it has no battery.  The  larger is "active" and has a battery (it actively transmits from a considerable distance.  But if the battery is dead, both can be used passively.

The owner's manual calls them "FOB" (the active one) and "Spare FOB" (the passive-only one) and yet on the display it calls both of them a "Transponder" when used actively and "Subkey ID" when used passively.    Somewhere else I have seen the passive FOB referred to as a "credit card" FOB, which makes zero sense, since it is nowhere near the size, shape, thickness, or weight of a credit card.

Clear as mud, right?
Shoodaben (was Guhl) Mountain Runner ECU flash, Canyon Cages front/rear, Helibars risers, Phil's wedges, Grip Puppies, Sargent World seat-low & heated & pod, Muzzy lowering links, Soupy's stand, Nautilus air horn, Admore lightbar, Ronnie's highway pegs, front running lights, all LED, helmet locks, RAM Xgrip, Sena SMH10, Throttle Tamer, MRA X-Creen, BearingUp Shifter, PR4-GT, Scorpion EXO-T1200,etc

Offline FTB530

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Re: What did you do to your Concours today?
« Reply #3071 on: June 20, 2018, 03:49:21 PM »
Picked up my bike at the dealer today after a service was done, they could not program my extra fob since I don’t have the code from the first bike, I do not recall getting my fobs with any code when I bought it new, so I guess I have a couple of paperweights!

Offline just gone

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Re: What did you do to your Concours today?
« Reply #3072 on: June 20, 2018, 04:37:39 PM »
They get the bike in, call Kawasaki to make sure they understand how the system works and program it. I still get the Subkey ID Error when the battery is out of the transponder which Kawasaki said was normal but reading up on it on the forum, it seems that they were wrong. But I'm over it. I'm done dealing with this dealership.

Just so I'm clear, does the original fob (the proximity one with the battery in it) start the bike when you put it against the front of the ignition with no battery in it? Or does it only work with the battery dead but in place? I have a 2011 model in case that matters.
Yes, you remove the key in the active FOB (either with battery removed or a dead battery) and the opening where the key was goes over the block protrusion on the front of the lock assembly, the same spot as you would use the smaller FOB.

Well that's a shame, calling Kawasaki should have got the correct information to the dealer. Yes both the passive spare FOB and the active FOB with battery removed should have been programmed into the bike one right after the other on this extra trip you took. The instructions for how the FOB is supposed to work is in the owner's manual but I guess the dealer couldn't be bothered. Very troubling that when they called Kawasaki the wrong info was provided. Since I'm not sure what they really did, I worry that they may have now screwed up both FOBs so that when you do have an active FOB battery problem that you have no passive FOB to get things started when you really should have two available. Have you checked the little (credit card, just to irritate max') FOB to make sure it still works since your second trip? Fingers crossed for you.

Offline just gone

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Re: What did you do to your Concours today?
« Reply #3073 on: June 20, 2018, 04:56:10 PM »
Picked up my bike at the dealer today after a service was done, they could not program my extra fob since I don’t have the code from the first bike, I do not recall getting my fobs with any code when I bought it new, so I guess I have a couple of paperweights!
Well some paper weights are heavier than others. When you say a "couple" of paper weights do you mean that you have two active FOBs from the earlier C14? If so then they both should have RFID chips in them and it is my understanding that the passive chips do not need the code for programing with KDS, only the active part needs the code. So yes they will always be paperweights in the active FOB world, but they will just be fat passive FOBs in the passive world...assuming you can find a dealer that knows what they are doing with their KDS to program them in. Judging by the luck okrider is having, then yeah, maybe you do have a couple of paper weights no matter what world they are in.  If I was tweeting from the White House I'd end this with "SAD, so so very sad.

Offline maxtog

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Re: What did you do to your Concours today?
« Reply #3074 on: June 20, 2018, 05:00:13 PM »
Picked up my bike at the dealer today after a service was done, they could not program my extra fob since I don’t have the code from the first bike, I do not recall getting my fobs with any code when I bought it new, so I guess I have a couple of paperweights!

That doesn't sound right.  They shouldn't need a printed code from anything- that is the tire pressure sensors.  They should be able to program the passive functions of each fob into the bike simply by electronically reading all of them into the bike, but each fob must be present at the time of programming.  And I thought the active one had the code printed inside it.... checking now...
Shoodaben (was Guhl) Mountain Runner ECU flash, Canyon Cages front/rear, Helibars risers, Phil's wedges, Grip Puppies, Sargent World seat-low & heated & pod, Muzzy lowering links, Soupy's stand, Nautilus air horn, Admore lightbar, Ronnie's highway pegs, front running lights, all LED, helmet locks, RAM Xgrip, Sena SMH10, Throttle Tamer, MRA X-Creen, BearingUp Shifter, PR4-GT, Scorpion EXO-T1200,etc

Offline maxtog

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Re: What did you do to your Concours today?
« Reply #3075 on: June 20, 2018, 05:06:38 PM »
And I thought the active one had the code printed inside it.... checking now...

There are no ID numbers on the inside, at all.  But there is a lot of printed info on the outside back of the active fob.  However, it is extremely hard to read, and mine seems to be mostly rubbed off.  I see a model number and FCC info... but it looks like there is also some type of code/ID string printed also.  Damn if I can tell, though.
Shoodaben (was Guhl) Mountain Runner ECU flash, Canyon Cages front/rear, Helibars risers, Phil's wedges, Grip Puppies, Sargent World seat-low & heated & pod, Muzzy lowering links, Soupy's stand, Nautilus air horn, Admore lightbar, Ronnie's highway pegs, front running lights, all LED, helmet locks, RAM Xgrip, Sena SMH10, Throttle Tamer, MRA X-Creen, BearingUp Shifter, PR4-GT, Scorpion EXO-T1200,etc

Offline okrider

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Re: What did you do to your Concours today?
« Reply #3076 on: June 20, 2018, 05:08:46 PM »
Picked up my bike at the dealer today after a service was done, they could not program my extra fob since I don’t have the code from the first bike, I do not recall getting my fobs with any code when I bought it new, so I guess I have a couple of paperweights!

They said that to me too. Dealerships have absolutely no idea how the KiPass works or what they can and can't program.
'11 Black: Russel Day-Long, Mountain Runner, cage w/ highway pegs, 2Bros Slip-on, Helibars Horizon

Offline just gone

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Re: What did you do to your Concours today?
« Reply #3077 on: June 20, 2018, 05:30:38 PM »
Dealerships have absolutely no idea how the KiPass works or what they can and can't program.

Maybe you can call?

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For customer or product-related questions or comments, please contact our Consumer Services Department by telephone at 949-460-5688, or by mail at:

Kawasaki Motors Corp., U.S.A.

PO Box 25252

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Office hours are Monday-Friday 7:30am-4:30pm PDT.

Please have Hull or Vehicle Identification Number available when calling.

Offline okrider

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Re: What did you do to your Concours today?
« Reply #3078 on: June 20, 2018, 05:38:43 PM »
The dealership I was at called Kawasaki HotLine on the phone to confirm they are doing it right and was told that it needs a battery for the passive fob to work. Shows you how much Kawasaki Customer Support knows as documentation you can find on this forum shows it is supposed to work without the battery in it.

I don't really care how it's supposed to work or not. I just want a bike that is not going to leave me stranded. I think I found someone who is going to be able to help me in a couple weeks.

I spent hours learning how it's supposed to learn and be programmed. Dealership I went to didn't even know the small RFID fobs were programmable. Proceeded to tell me I don't know what I'm talking about and wouldn't bother to do the research.
'11 Black: Russel Day-Long, Mountain Runner, cage w/ highway pegs, 2Bros Slip-on, Helibars Horizon

Offline jwh20

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Re: What did you do to your Concours today?
« Reply #3079 on: June 21, 2018, 08:39:22 AM »
Just so I'm clear, does the original fob (the proximity one with the battery in it) start the bike when you put it against the front of the ignition with no battery in it? Or does it only work with the battery dead but in place? I have a 2011 model in case that matters.

Kawasaki sells TWO FOBs for the C14 and there are TWO different systems on the bike to unlock it.  First the two systems are, in Kawasaki's terms:

1) KiPass
2) Key Immobilizer

It helps if you speak to them in THEIR terminology.  KiPass is the ACTIVE 300MHz (in North America at least) system that will unlock the bike from a short distance away.  When you press the stove-knob the KiPass ECU under the seat sends a radio signal that is picked up by the KiPass FOB.  The FOB then replies and if the bike is happy with the reply, the ECU will unlock the bike.  The Key Immobilizer system is different, actually completely different and independent and it ONLY comes into play if the KiPass system fails to locate a FOB and unlock the bike.  The Key Immobilizer system is a very short-range RFID system with the transceiver located in the front part of the keyswitch housing.  So for it to do anything you must NOT have your KiPass FOB around with a battery in it and must hold a Key Immobilizer device against the front of the keyswitch housing while you press the knob.  The KiPass ECU sends a signal to the keyswitch to try to read a Key Immobilizer and if successful, it will unlock the bike.

Ok, once that's straight we need to talk about the FOBs themselves.  As I mentioned, there are TWO.

1) KiPass FOB - This is the "big" FOB with the battery in it.  But, and this is the part that trips up many dealers and C14 owners, there is ALSO a Key Immobilizer device inside of the housing.  If you take it apart like you are changing the battery, you will see it in the larger end of the half of the case that does NOT have the battery slot.  It's a small ( about 10mm x 2mm) black plastic bit that you might otherwise miss.  This is a Key Immobilizer FOB device and if you remove it from the KiPass FOB housing it can start the bike all by itself.  This is the one that the dealers never know to program and, I believe, is the one you are having issues with.  (BTW, make sure your KiPass FOB has this inside.  I suppose it's possible that it could have been removed at some point.)

This is also why you don't have to worry about getting stranded by a dead KiPass FOB battery since, as long as it's properly programmed into the bike, this will always start your bike in a pinch.  You take the key out of the FOB, place the empty slot where the key was over the top of the keyswitch, and press the knob.  The bike will unlock.  Try it but you must remove the battery first, otherwise KiPass will unlock the bike and you'll never test this function.

The KiPass system uses IDs that come ONLY on the plastic bags that come with a new bike or with a new FOB from Kawasaki.  As far as we now know, it's NOT possible to recover this ID if you don't have the bag with the label.  So an ID-less FOB is nearly useless.  You can repurpose the Key Immobilizer chip but nothing else.  But you MUST have the ID for the FOB if you want to program a KiPass FOB into your bike.  No ID, no programming!  This is also why you are stuck if you lose all your FOBs.  You cannot enter programming mode if you cannot unlock the bike.  So you must buy a new KiPass ECU that comes with a FOB pre-programmed into it to revive your C14.  NEVER KEEP ALL  YOUR FOBs with you.  Leave one at home or in a safe-deposit box so that if the worst-case scenario happens, you can (eventually) get your bike started.  If you bought a used bike with just the KiPass FOB, remove the Key Immobilizer chip and leave it home until you get a spare!  I personally have one KiPass FOB and TWO Key Immobilizer FOBs.  I use the KiPass for daily rides.  If I'm going on a trip, I pack the Key Immobilizer, usually in an inner-pocket so I can get it in a pinch.  I always leave the 2nd Key Immobilizer at home so that I have a fail-safe backup if everything gets lost or stolen.

The ECU has 6, and only 6 slots for these FOB IDs.  A new 2010+ comes with ONE slot programmed. 2008-2009 come with TWO FOBs and TWO slots programmed.  You CANNOT EVER re-use a slot, you can only erase/deactivate it.  Once you've written all 6 slots, no more KiPass FOBs can be added.  The KDS system does show you which slots are available and used but it DOES NOT show you the IDs in any slot.  So you cannot recover IDs using the KDS system.  (I have a suspicion that there is a way, but it's currently unknown to the public.)

2) Key Immobilizer FOB - this is the small "credit card" FOB (although it's a lot smaller than a credit card) and this contains ONLY a Key Immobilizer device and a space for the tiny "spare" key.  The Key Immobilizer system does not have any printed ID that you must know.  Once you enter the Key Immobilizer programming mode you place each and EVERY Key Immobilizer FOB you want to use, one at a time, above the keyswitch, and it will read and record the IDs.  Once you have read all of them, you tell KDS to program the Key Immobilizer and it will REPLACE whatever is in the ECU with the new set of IDs.  From that point on, only those ID will unlock the bike.  This is why you MUST RE-PROGRAM ALL YOUR Key Immobilizers every time you want to add one.  (Dealers, for some reason, just can't get this!)

So this is why the KiPass FOB is tricky, if you buy a spare, you need to have BOTH parts of it programmed into the bike, as well as all your other Key Immobilizer FOB devices to have a complete set of working FOBs.

I hope this helps your understanding of what's going on.  IMHO there is little excuse for a dealer not to know how to do this.  It's all clearly documented in the KDS Users Manual, which they have!  There is absolutely NO excuse for the Kawasaki Service Technical line folks to not know how to help their dealer out.