Author Topic: Front Won't Build Pressure  (Read 10287 times)

Offline okrider

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Re: Front Won't Build Pressure
« Reply #20 on: March 17, 2020, 03:24:19 PM »
Just did reverse bleed and went for a quick test ride. No difference. Very little front brake. Tried getting ABS to kick in, couldn't even do that.

I think I'm going to take a break, and get back to this tomorrow or next day and take the calipers apart again and re-do the whole thing, but I won't replace the seals this time. Just take apart and inspect
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Offline gPink

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Re: Front Won't Build Pressure
« Reply #21 on: March 17, 2020, 03:55:27 PM »
The brakes are linked? What happens when you activate the rear only?

Offline okrider

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Re: Front Won't Build Pressure
« Reply #22 on: March 17, 2020, 06:22:04 PM »
yes, they're linked. The rear seems to work fine, like before.
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Offline gPink

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Re: Front Won't Build Pressure
« Reply #23 on: March 17, 2020, 06:28:08 PM »
yes, they're linked. The rear seems to work fine, like before.
Does engaging the rear activate the front?

Offline Freddy

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Re: Front Won't Build Pressure
« Reply #24 on: March 17, 2020, 06:38:24 PM »
                     Going to try reverse bleeding again today, ziptieing the hose so it doesn't come out and make a mess.

If you're reverse bleeding the circuit why do you need to do this?   Secondly, what are you using to reverse bleed it with?  Thirdly, exactly what procedure, step by step, are you following?
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Offline okrider

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Re: Front Won't Build Pressure
« Reply #25 on: March 18, 2020, 07:28:18 AM »
If you're reverse bleeding the circuit why do you need to do this?   Secondly, what are you using to reverse bleed it with?  Thirdly, exactly what procedure, step by step, are you following?

I got a big syringe I'm using to reverse bleed, the hose I attach on the syringe slips off and makes a mess, hence the ziptie.
  • switched to OEM bleeder first and bled real quick to make sure there's no air at the tip
  • Attached hose to the syringe, ziptied.
  • remove the reservoir cap
  • suck fluid into the syringe from the reservoir(I've been bleeding it for days, it's fresh fluid)
  • attach hose to the bleeder nipple, make sure no air bubbles are waiting to get pushed into the caliper
  • loosen the bleeder a half turn
  • push fluid in with the syringe, observe the reservoir level rises
  • tighten the bleeder
  • remove syringe
  • switch back to speedbleeder
  • bleed normally to get air out
'11 Black: Russel Day-Long, Mountain Runner, cage w/ highway pegs, 2Bros Slip-on, Helibars Horizon

Offline Freddy

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Re: Front Won't Build Pressure
« Reply #26 on: March 18, 2020, 05:52:31 PM »
 :thumbs:  That should do it.  Any improvement?
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Offline okrider

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Re: Front Won't Build Pressure
« Reply #27 on: March 20, 2020, 05:07:01 PM »
No, it's still the same as before. I haven't had a chance to touch the bike since the test ride. I did notice the next day that the lever was empty for 2 pulls. no resistance whatsoever. Then I went back to check the day after and it had the same amount of brakes as before where it's nowhere near enough, but you can't super easily touch the lever to the bar. Going to try to spend more time on it this weekend
'11 Black: Russel Day-Long, Mountain Runner, cage w/ highway pegs, 2Bros Slip-on, Helibars Horizon

Offline zrx mitch

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Re: Front Won't Build Pressure
« Reply #28 on: March 20, 2020, 06:19:51 PM »
I would be inspecting the caliper piston fluid and dust seals for proper installation.
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Offline Y0ssarian

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Re: Front Won't Build Pressure
« Reply #29 on: March 21, 2020, 03:08:03 AM »
If the bike has linked brakes don't you need to bleed the system at both ends using both the front lever and the brake pedal?
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Offline Michelle

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Re: Front Won't Build Pressure
« Reply #30 on: March 21, 2020, 04:44:59 AM »
If the bike has linked brakes don't you need to bleed the system at both ends using both the front lever and the brake pedal?

No. There is no physical link. It is done by the computer manipulating the pressure in the abs pump.
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Offline VirginiaJim

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Re: Front Won't Build Pressure
« Reply #31 on: March 21, 2020, 06:42:33 AM »
He had brakes before he cracked the calipers.  We don't know the reason to replace the seals in them other than just because.  Two possibilities I see are the calipers and possibly the way the linked brakes work hydraulically.  I cracked open both my fronts and didn't have this much issue with getting the system bled other than putting two washers together on one side.  Still have to get that fixed for my friend who bought my bike.
Someone with a manual, is the brake bleeding procedure different on these bikes?

I have a hard time thinking this is something other than what was touched to begin with.

Man, I'd love to be closer to the OP to see what's going on with this and troubleshoot the issue.  What a crazy interesting issue!
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Offline VirginiaJim

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Re: Front Won't Build Pressure
« Reply #32 on: March 21, 2020, 08:21:37 AM »
New washers, right?
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Offline okrider

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Re: Front Won't Build Pressure
« Reply #33 on: March 22, 2020, 07:09:25 AM »
New washers, new seals, old pistons. Going to be taking it apart again and inspecting my work. I agree with zrx mitch that it must be something I've done wrong. I just don't know what it is. First time rebuilding brakes, I'll post if I can find what's wrong.

What's the suggested way to bleed calipers to ensure no air is trapped in the caliper after rebuilding it?

Back when I was first bleeding, I could get air bubbles out by compressing the caliper with the bleeder nipple open, which leads me to believe this whole thing's happening because there's still air there
'11 Black: Russel Day-Long, Mountain Runner, cage w/ highway pegs, 2Bros Slip-on, Helibars Horizon

Offline okrider

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Re: Front Won't Build Pressure
« Reply #34 on: March 24, 2020, 10:37:04 AM »
Took the left side apart yesterday, inspected everything and reinstalled, didn't see anything out of the ordinary besides some shaved metal, I think I misplaced the pistons, I figured they'd be identical but maybe not? Because some piston grooves had some markings on the middle.

Anyways, cleaned everything up, put it back together, it gravity bled by the time I put the bleeder in, bled the brakes for quite a while and it feels a little better than before, going to do the right side too, hoping I get all the air out this time
'11 Black: Russel Day-Long, Mountain Runner, cage w/ highway pegs, 2Bros Slip-on, Helibars Horizon

Offline okrider

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Re: Front Won't Build Pressure
« Reply #35 on: March 24, 2020, 02:57:28 PM »
Just redid the right side as well, didn't see anything wrong with it, put it together. Did the bleeds, got a bunch of air out, now I have clear fluid coming out of all the orifices, and I still have super spongy brakes, they build pressure if I pump 3 times but lasts about 3-4 seconds and it's back to the handlebar after that.

Does anyone have any ideas? I'm quite frustrated and don't know what to do anymore..
'11 Black: Russel Day-Long, Mountain Runner, cage w/ highway pegs, 2Bros Slip-on, Helibars Horizon

Offline Daytona_Mike

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Re: Front Won't Build Pressure
« Reply #36 on: March 24, 2020, 03:37:12 PM »
Just redid the right side as well, didn't see anything wrong with it, put it together. Did the bleeds, got a bunch of air out, now I have clear fluid coming out of all the orifices, and I still have super spongy brakes, they build pressure if I pump 3 times but lasts about 3-4 seconds and it's back to the handlebar after that.

Does anyone have any ideas? I'm quite frustrated and don't know what to do anymore..
Well, this is a long shot  but maybe ..this could be your issue.  I have seen on another bike where a caliper was incorrectly installed The Caliper could not center itself on the slide pins.  So when you applied the brakes it took two or three pumps and the brakes would work fine but then a few seconds later - no brakes- you have to pump 3 times again. What happened was the piston on the stuck caliper  pushed on one side only  of the rotor...the rotor would bend over slightly  like a spring... then the rotor would push  / spring back the piston back in again to create a large gap.... so  you had to pump the lever several times again.   Is it possible this is what yours is doing? The other front  caliper could center just fine. The   other side  could  not center which  caused the problem.


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Offline okrider

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Re: Front Won't Build Pressure
« Reply #37 on: March 24, 2020, 03:48:09 PM »
Hmm, I guess I'll observe the pistons squeeze the rotor tomorrow. The reason I took the calipers apart is because my brakes were dragging. I don't know they're still dragging as the bike's still on the lift.

I also don't tighten the caliper mount bolts until I squeeze the brake lever and have the caliper center itself

'11 Black: Russel Day-Long, Mountain Runner, cage w/ highway pegs, 2Bros Slip-on, Helibars Horizon

Offline Daytona_Mike

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Re: Front Won't Build Pressure
« Reply #38 on: March 25, 2020, 12:59:41 PM »

I also don't tighten the caliper mount bolts until I squeeze the brake lever and have the caliper center itself
I never heard of that procedure. Is it in a book or service manual?
I think the calipers may cock  and bind  if you do that.   Tighten the bolts to spec first unless you know  otherwise and can show me please.

Interesting that you had a bind at first.  You may still have the original problem. Before installing the pads... did you verify the caliper can center and move back and forth on the slides. One caliper may still be bound up.
If you still have fuel in the tank, you are not lost yet
Most motorcycle problems are caused by the nut that connects the handlebars to the saddle

Offline okrider

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Re: Front Won't Build Pressure
« Reply #39 on: March 25, 2020, 02:35:41 PM »
here's why I squeeze the brakes first before tightening the bolts. https://youtu.be/C26ww0dsMTI?t=296

so after bleeding everything including myself (pinched my finger), I removed the calipers, pushed the pistons in and hung them sideways using a bungee cord to force any air that might be stuck somewhere/anywhere up towards the bleeder, going to try bleeding again tonight to see if I get any bubbles
'11 Black: Russel Day-Long, Mountain Runner, cage w/ highway pegs, 2Bros Slip-on, Helibars Horizon