Author Topic: bloody video of an accident on a C14 (what caused it?)  (Read 90195 times)

Offline martin_14

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Re: bloody video of an accident on a C14 (what caused it?)
« Reply #40 on: September 10, 2011, 02:41:08 PM »
Martin, thanks for the translation...feel free to take many pictures and please share them with us.

I will post something up on the Rides and Stories section as soon as I sort out the pictures. It was a fantastic ride. I'm extremely happy I did it because I messed up my route (GPS and I have to seat down and have a serious talk  :o) and ended up in incredible places. I'll do it again as soon as I find the time.
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Offline kdm

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Re: bloody video of an accident on a C14 (what caused it?)
« Reply #41 on: September 10, 2011, 04:17:30 PM »
Closest verbatum response to my thoughts on this thread...  maybe not the "nicest" or "kindest" response to someone that has gotten hurt.

The rider claims he did not accelerate after the slip, but he did not brake either because that makes the bike stand up?  When a bike is already upright on the right side of the road, travels all the way across the road upright, and then crashes on the left side of road, seems to me that somewhere on that straight line with the bike upright there would be sometime to brake and regain control of the bike. The right hand turn ahead of him as he was going off the left side of the road was not a tight turn.

No off road/dirt bike experience or sliding experience and the panic afterwords had this poor guy just freeze and hang on until his fate was sealed. I'm glad he only suffered a broken wrist.

JJ

He may say no ,but I swear I heard that thing accelerate after the slide -anybody else ? Maybe faulty memory -things happen fast . Glad he's allright .
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Offline B.D.F.

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Re: bloody video of an accident on a C14 (what caused it?)
« Reply #42 on: September 10, 2011, 04:22:15 PM »
Foreign country? I thought he was local to that area?

Brian


Foreign country, heavily populated rural area, road lined with steel guardrail.  He should have been cruising along taking in the sights instead of trying to make a knee dragger video.
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Offline coastalconnie

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Re: bloody video of an accident on a C14 (what caused it?)
« Reply #43 on: September 10, 2011, 04:36:49 PM »
He may say no ,but I swear I heard that thing accelerate after the slide -anybody else ? Maybe faulty memory -things happen fast . Glad he's allright .
That's exactly the same sound I hear every time I watch this video. 

Offline DaveO

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Re: bloody video of an accident on a C14 (what caused it?)
« Reply #44 on: September 10, 2011, 05:39:19 PM »
I watched it a few more times and i think ive got it .
There was no debree ... I knew he was putting some messed up imput into the steering ... Im pretty sure he was trying to literally hang off his bike . He lost his grip and almost falls into the road . This make the bike go haywire {well not haywire but it quickly corrects itself from messed up steering imput)  for a spit second while he tries unsucessfully to  to recover.(climb back to the bars)
Watch again and see if you agree.

Offline maxtog

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Re: bloody video of an accident on a C14 (what caused it?)
« Reply #45 on: September 10, 2011, 10:19:45 PM »
I watched it a few more times and i think ive got it .
There was no debree ... I knew he was putting some messed up imput into the steering ... Im pretty sure he was trying to literally hang off his bike . He lost his grip and almost falls into the road . This make the bike go haywire {well not haywire but it quickly corrects itself from messed up steering imput)  for a spit second while he tries unsucessfully to  to recover.(climb back to the bars)
Watch again and see if you agree.

I watched it many times too. I am certain the rear tire lost traction.  There was no breaking, and I don't think the steering input or body position caused it.  The only two things I can guess are either a patch of sand, or an abrupt power change caused the loss of traction during the cornering.  The "plume" at the exact instant of loss of traction (and the sideways motion of the rear tire) are what I am focusing on.  So if not sand, that leaves clutch, shift, or throttle.  I suspect the most likely being opening the throttle.  I am no expert in this stuff.
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Offline Conrad

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Re: bloody video of an accident on a C14 (what caused it?)
« Reply #46 on: September 11, 2011, 06:32:14 AM »
I hope someday we have simulators to practice these problems without the crash .

Do it in the dirt first, that's where I learned.
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Offline Conrad

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Re: bloody video of an accident on a C14 (what caused it?)
« Reply #47 on: September 11, 2011, 06:37:12 AM »
I watched it many times too. I am certain the rear tire lost traction.  There was no breaking, and I don't think the steering input or body position caused it.  The only two things I can guess are either a patch of sand, or an abrupt power change caused the loss of traction during the cornering.  The "plume" at the exact instant of loss of traction (and the sideways motion of the rear tire) are what I am focusing on.  So if not sand, that leaves clutch, shift, or throttle.  I suspect the most likely being opening the throttle.  I am no expert in this stuff.

If you listen closely at that moment it sounds like something is hitting the GS, it could be the GS rider moving around but it could be the debris getting thrown up and hitting his bike.
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Offline Fretka

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Re: bloody video of an accident on a C14 (what caused it?)
« Reply #48 on: September 11, 2011, 11:04:20 AM »
At the risk of repeating myself, I think this is a CLASSIC example of someone with no training/experience reverting to the sheer terror response (standing the bike upright and grabbing a bunch of brake and just hoping that he can get it stopped in time is the usual response, but this guy may not have even used his brakes properly for fear of............something...........??

As our military drums into the heads of new recruits on what to do in times of high stress, this fellow did not know what to do when presented with what he thought was the precursor to doom and certain death, so he reverts to the classic deer in the headlights.

Who can blame him as presently there is no easy way to learn (re-program our brain) without being forced to deal with these issues in real life. This video is a very effective advertisement for the need to enroll in some sort of professional accident avoidance school, or, learn it the hard way!

Let's all go out today and practice some emergency avoidance skills.

End of soapbox ranting.. :D

Fretka
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Offline just gone

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Re: bloody video of an accident on a C14 (what caused it?)
« Reply #49 on: September 11, 2011, 01:03:39 PM »
He may say no ,but I swear I heard that thing accelerate after the slide -anybody else ? Maybe faulty memory -things happen fast . Glad he's allright .


Yeah, I hear it too. While he is in the dirt on the right side of the road. Looking at the speedometer on the BMW it seems clear that the Kawasaki is accelerating away.

I just don't think that what caused the initial slide is that important. That could happen for many reasons regardless of what caused it in this instance. It's the failed recovery that's the issue and it just looks and sounds like panic combined with a throttle rocker is not a good combination for successful recovery. I'm thinking if you are not on a super slab then the throttle rocker needs to be in the glovebox. I too am glad that he only suffered a broken wrist, it looked much worse.

Offline DaveO

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Re: bloody video of an accident on a C14 (what caused it?)
« Reply #50 on: September 11, 2011, 01:28:33 PM »
i think if you could slow down the vid you'd see him slip  off the bike (his left arm goes down cause he thinks he's going to impact the road) THEN the bike starts the shake /slide /accelerate

Offline tbanzer

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Re: bloody video of an accident on a C14 (what caused it?)
« Reply #51 on: September 13, 2011, 06:26:23 PM »
Poor guy when he is defenceless they are trying to steal his boots. Sorry its not funny but I couldnt resist. He must have been in a pretty low gear to accelerate like he did. Looks like the road was a different color where he lost traction from the rear tire, then paniced. Best advice I ever got is the bike is going to go wherever you are looking for the most part. Try avoiding something you are looking at as you are going down the road. Then look away from something you want to avoid. Works good for missing small animals or pot holes.

Offline PH14

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Re: bloody video of an accident on a C14 (what caused it?)
« Reply #52 on: September 13, 2011, 07:30:26 PM »
At the risk of repeating myself, I think this is a CLASSIC example of someone with no training/experience reverting to the sheer terror response (standing the bike upright and grabbing a bunch of brake and just hoping that he can get it stopped in time is the usual response, but this guy may not have even used his brakes properly for fear of............something...........??

As our military drums into the heads of new recruits on what to do in times of high stress, this fellow did not know what to do when presented with what he thought was the precursor to doom and certain death, so he reverts to the classic deer in the headlights.

Who can blame him as presently there is no easy way to learn (re-program our brain) without being forced to deal with these issues in real life. This video is a very effective advertisement for the need to enroll in some sort of professional accident avoidance school, or, learn it the hard way!

Let's all go out today and practice some emergency avoidance skills.

End of soapbox ranting.. :D

Fretka

+1

The guy in the video didnt choose a good line, kept correcting because he kept getting too close to the centerline and was not smooth. His jerky movement and the likely application of the rear brake cause this accident. I'm sorry, this was just bad riding. This had nothing to do with debris on the road or tar snakes.  I hit a fresh deer carcass in a curve at 85 MPH the other night, the part I hit was probably 4 or 5 inches high and the entire carcass covered the majority of my lane. There was a tractor trailer in the lane next to me so I had nowhere to go. Nothing happened. Period. I felt movement, but I didn't panic, I let the bike do it's thing. Physics works, work against it and you go down.

Offline BudCallaghan

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Re: bloody video of an accident on a C14 (what caused it?)
« Reply #53 on: September 14, 2011, 11:58:38 AM »
My observation of the video indicates an old axiom is again correct, "Motorcycles are not dangerous, but a faulty connection between the seat and handlebars can make them extremely dangerous."  This guy continually rides the center line, oncoming traffic be damned, same for all left turns, blind curve or not, usually with his body and the upper portion of the bike well over the line.  I've been watching people doing this for as long as I can remember, cars, motorcycles, or trucks and am annoyed each time I witness this particular brand of stupidity.  If you suddenly encounter an oncoming vehicle in or nearly in your lane you're going to try to get to the right as quickly as possible.  Why not be there in the first place?  All of us have seen road racers hang off to the inside of turns.  They have a damn good reason to, they're racing, riding to the limits of their bike's and their own abilities.  By leaning into the turn their bikes can remain more upright and allow them to make the turn at maximum velocity.  Doing this on the street appears to be a product of the imagination.  In the case of this rider it was absolutely pointless as he never had the bike leaned over very far during the entire video.  I assume the cause of the initial slip may well have been gravel on the tarmac.  At any rate, the bike quickly righted itself and was therefore back in his control.  However, during that brief instant when it was not in his control sheer panic took control of the situation.  The left leg quickly extended itself without direction from a brain that was functioning.  Then the bike left the right shoulder and was back on the asphalt where traction was readily available.  Again there was no input from the fear frozen rider so the motorcycle continued in a straight line to the other side of the road onto a wide shoulder that still appeared to offer a chance of recovery.  Because we lost sight of him in the dust we can only speculate the reason he was suddenly getting a taste of the dirt.  I think that he suddenly found the front brake, locked up the tire and it immediately washed out and dumped him unceremoniously on his face. 

Immediately after the bike was back in the rider's control it should have been turned very slightly to the left in the direction of the road and all would have been well.  Any rider possessing a natural affinity for riding a motorcycle would have done this and been on his merry way.  Then he had a second chance as the bike was once more back on the asphalt and crossing the road but the passenger, I do mean passenger as there was no one home to steer the bike, sat frozen in fear or panic, take your pick.  A squid without this natural ability will not react properly or at all and turn this minor loss of traction into a disaster as this one did.  I emphasize natural ability as those without it can take lessons, attend schools or generally absorb information from many sources yet remain incapable of applying the appropriate reflex action to avoid disaster when an emergency arises.  From what I have seen of people either riding or driving over the years indicates that the vast majority of those who ride motorcycles and who drive cars do not have the ability to ride or drive their chosen mode of transport with the skill required to do so competently.  This clown and many like him should not be riding motorcycles because by doing so, the motorcycles they're riding become very dangerous.           
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Offline Mr. Green Genes

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Re: bloody video of an accident on a C14 (what caused it?)
« Reply #54 on: September 18, 2011, 10:55:43 AM »
Foreign country? I thought he was local to that area?

Brian

My mistake.  Every time I see a beemer with aluminum bags and a tank bag I think "long distance".