Kawasaki Concours Forum
The C-14, aka Kawasaki Concours-14, the new one :) => Accessories and modifications - C14/GTR 1400 => Topic started by: roland on December 30, 2011, 08:39:55 AM
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Ok let the flaming begin... I went to darkside and put a car tire on the 09 Concours!
Found a brand new 205/40/17 Nexen tire for $25.00, tire is a little shorter than the
stock tire but fits fine. I was worried about hitting the drive shaft cover on the left
side but no problems.... Dont get me wrong, it was a bitch to get on the rim. the 40 profile
sidewall was really stiff but after some time we got it mounted...
Did a 175 mi. loop Wednesday with a friend and the more I rode the better I liked :)
Rpm came up about 300 spedo is 3mph fast (65is actually 62),
but that is fine I just get into od sooner and the
bike really pulls stronger than before... Gearing change from the shorter tire...Hopfully I can
get pictures to load and you can see the install.
Al In New Bern.
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I see many posts on many boards about car tires (darkside) I have never asked but guess it is time
WHY
smoother ride. better traction. cheaper
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When I see a car tire on a MotoGP bike I'll try one.
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I see many posts on many boards about car tires (darkside) I have never asked but guess it is time
WHY
smoother ride. better traction. cheaper
Better traction, in a straight line on the drag strip. Leaned? No.
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:o :-X :'(
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I have never asked but guess it is time,
WHY
smoother ride. better traction. cheaper
From all I've read, and with many friends who have done their homework and put them on GoldWings, Harleys, FJR's, Vulcans, etc. it comes down to one overriding reason - MILEAGE.
If fitment is reasonable, if size and radius are good fits, and IF the person can come to grips with the the different ride and handling characteristics, the payoff in cheap initial tire cost and quadruple mileage make it an easy decision for some.
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From all I've read, and with many friends who have done their homework and put them on GoldWings, Harleys, FJR's, Vulcans, etc. it comes down to one overriding reason - MILEAGE.
If fitment is reasonable, if size and radius are good fits, and IF the person can come to grips with the the different ride and handling characteristics, the payoff in cheap initial tire cost and quadruple mileage make it an easy decision for some.
thanks for the info. I have seen many people use them but have never checked to see why?
I guess when I can not come to grips with the price of tires I will have to stop riding. I got my new C14 a couple months ago and have spent 3k worth of stuff for it so I guess right now the tires are still cheap.
thanks again for the info
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:o
Good thing Fred isn't on this forum anymore... ;)
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I got a great deal on this tire of $25, full price is $96. The main reason I did this is economics... Tired of buying tires every 4500mi. All I do is commute to and from work and trips with my Wife and friends... I did lots of research and no one on any of the connie forums has done this on the c14. Well I will be the "crash test dummy" hopfully without the crash. So far so good. I will keep you posted. ;)
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:o
Good thing Fred isn't on this forum anymore... ;)
:rotflmao:
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Fred is a good guy, just a little openionated at times, This forum is way cooler thank Godness.
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I got a great deal on this tire of $25, full price is $96. The main reason I did this is economics... Tired of buying tires every 4500mi. All I do is commute to and from work and trips with my Wife and friends... I did lots of research and no one on any of the connie forums has done this on the c14. Well I will be the "crash test dummy" hopfully without the crash. So far so good. I will keep you posted. ;)
Its been done, but due to the board crash all the info is bit-bucketed. The common thread was its not worth the "unknowns" for the amount of money being saved. There is definitely a reason a motorcycle tire is designed the way it is versus a car tire. Traction/Stability/Capability. Saving a few hundred dollars a year is not worth loosing the years that went into designing a motorcycle tire. We spend alot of $$$ on safety and convenience, I just don't see compromising in the most important safety component on the motorcycle...the tires.
Aaron
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Roland, I've got to agree with Fred on this but good luck and keep us informed. I noticed you've got a low post count so welcome to the Forum.
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Just curious, is that tire "V" rated?
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There is definitely a reason a motorcycle tire is designed the way it is versus a car tire.
Cars do not lean and ride on the side of their [square] tires. The geometries and design functions are TOTALLY different. I think putting a car tire on a bike is a horrible, unwise, and unsafe maneuver. ESPECIALLY on a sporty bike, like the Concours.
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Cars do not lean and ride on the side of their [square] tires. ...
What about those old school VW Bugs that have been lowered so much that the tread doesn't sit flat? ;D
Question to OP... What pressure is the tire at? If lower than stock, would the TPMS be thrown off? That fact that you've ridden means you aren't having any issues, but still a general question, I guess.
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I got a great deal on this tire of $25, full price is $96. The main reason I did this is economics... Tired of buying tires every 4500mi. All I do is commute to and from work and trips with my Wife and friends... I did lots of research and no one on any of the connie forums has done this on the c14. Well I will be the "crash test dummy" hopfully without the crash. So far so good. I will keep you posted. ;)
I can't imagine why...
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That would not matter- he was not a moderator and so could not have deleted posts or threads. The moderators that are on this site have never shown any interest in censorship of any topic that I am aware of. We can all love or hate a subject, or even have no opinion at all but we do seem free to discuss any motorcycle topic here.
Brian
:o
Good thing Fred isn't on this forum anymore... ;)
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Yep, that is the logic I use to determine safety and usefulness on a street motorcycle and so do not have headlights, taillights, brake lights, reflectors, passenger seats / pegs, turnsignals, a horn, mirrors, or tread on my tires.
;)
Brian
When I see a car tire on a MotoGP bike I'll try one.
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Interesting, and thanks for posting the info. and photo. I am a little surprised that the tire fit without any side clearance issues but that certainly makes it easy to mount a significantly [wider than stock] tire on the bike.
What tools and method did you use to mount the tire- irons or a lever type tool?
Best of luck and please do let us know from time to time how that CT is working out for you.
Brian
Ok let the flaming begin... I went to darkside and put a car tire on the 09 Concours!
Found a brand new 205/40/17 Nexen tire for $25.00, tire is a little shorter than the
stock tire but fits fine. I was worried about hitting the drive shaft cover on the left
side but no problems.... Dont get me wrong, it was a bitch to get on the rim. the 40 profile
sidewall was really stiff but after some time we got it mounted...
Did a 175 mi. loop Wednesday with a friend and the more I rode the better I liked :)
Rpm came up about 300 spedo is 3mph fast (65is actually 62),
but that is fine I just get into od sooner and the
bike really pulls stronger than before... Gearing change from the shorter tire...Hopfully I can
get pictures to load and you can see the install.
Al In New Bern.
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That would not matter- he was not a moderator and so could not have deleted posts or threads. The moderators that are on this site have never shown any interest in censorship of any topic that I am aware of. We can all love or hate a subject, or even have no opinion at all but we do seem free to discuss any motorcycle topic here.
Brian
You may notice that I edited your post. I hit the wrong key...oh well...
I'm looking to turn over a new leaf in the coming days.... (http://zggtr.org/Smileys/default/tongue.gif)
Actually, I think he was a mod besides being the tech editor for the C14...that's where things went a little catywompus.
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Yep, that is the logic I use to determine safety and usefulness on a street motorcycle and so do not have headlights, taillights, brake lights, reflectors, passenger seats / pegs, turnsignals, a horn, mirrors, or tread on my tires.
;)
Brian
I hate logic. It always comes back to bite you.
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Yep, that is the logic I use to determine safety and usefulness on a street motorcycle and so do not have headlights, taillights, brake lights, reflectors, passenger seats / pegs, turnsignals, a horn, mirrors, or tread on my tires.
;)
Brian
I've got tread on my tires.
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Roland, I've got to agree with Fred on this but good luck and keep us informed. I noticed you've got a low post count so welcome to the Forum.
He's been around... just hasn't posted much since Da Crash. 8)
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Car Tire on a Goldwing.. rightside up! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xaIj1XrmvLM#)
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That would not matter- he was not a moderator and so could not have deleted posts or threads. The moderators that are on this site have never shown any interest in censorship of any topic that I am aware of. We can all love or hate a subject, or even have no opinion at all but we do seem free to discuss any motorcycle topic here.
Brian
+1000! Well said Brian.
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:o
Good thing Fred isn't on this forum anymore... ;)
I've noticed that Fred is no longer around. Did I not get the memo? What happened?
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There's a box here for you, Pandora. ;D
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I really shouldn't... :rotflmao: Good one, but I'll open it..
Fred is at the other site. After the crash I think he decided that occupying two sites at the same time was a little too much. I can certainly understand it as I can't keep up with this site, let alone others.
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Thanks for the info. Now back to car tires. ;D
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I really shouldn't... :rotflmao: Good one, but I'll open it..
Fred is at the other site. After the crash I think he decided that occupying two sites at the same time was a little too much. I can certainly understand it as I can't keep up with this site, let alone others.
I'm pretty active on 3 forums, what a loser I am... Maybe someday I'll have to get real face to face friends... ;)
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Hell I'm still somewhat active on the S2000 forums even though mine got stolen and I have no intentions of buying another one LoL.
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I'm pretty active on 3 forums, what a loser I am... Maybe someday I'll have to get real face to face friends... ;)
I know 2 of the three, this one and that other one, but what is the third??
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Not a loser at all, just means you can multi-task. You are most blessed. I, on the other hand, have 'What's that shiny thing over there?' syndrome. I can't even focus on what I'm doing at the moment....like this.
I like to meet people through these interactions. I've met Poke and will meet Conrad next year at some point assuming my neck is fixed. Heck, you may be unlucky enough to meet me at some point.... :yikes:
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I know 2 of the three, this one and that other one, but what is the third??
gixxer.com
Not a loser at all, just means you can multi-task. You are most blessed. I, on the other hand, have 'What's that shiny thing over there?' syndrome. I can't even focus on what I'm doing at the moment....like this.
I like to meet people through these interactions. I've met Poke and will meet Conrad next year at some point assuming my neck is fixed. Heck, you may be unlucky enough to meet me at some point.... :yikes:
This is true Jim, you do still owe me some beers for the whole change your email trick... ;) :chugbeer:
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This is true Jim, you do still owe me some beers for the whole change your email trick... ;) :chugbeer:
:-[
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:-[
:grouphug:
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[video]Car Tire on a Goldwing.. rightside up![/url]
If that video doesn't make my point, nothing will. Car tires are NOT designed to be ridden on like that.
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Maxtog, I agree with you. If this were a good option, someone would have tried to sell us a car tire for our motorcycles. Either that, or all tires companies are involved in the conspiracy to not sell them for motorcycle use.
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You buy an expensive bike and ruin it to save money on the back tire? Sounds like federal government finance to me.
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He's been around... just hasn't posted much since Da Crash. 8)
crash????? what crash????
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Thanks for all the input. Put another 150mi. on it today and the more i ride the more I like...
I am running 46psi in the tire and the bike is reading 47-48 so I am getting accurate readings and no problems there. Mounting the tire was done on a Harbor Freight changer. Lots of lube, and lots of experence from my younger grease monkey years. Yes it was a challange but SOMEONE had to do it on the c14. The stock tire measures 7 3/4" at the widest point. the ct is 8 1/16" at the widest point. Clearance was my main concern next to the drive shaft cover, that is why I did lots of research on the sizes. I still have a good 1/2" between the tire and driveshaft cover. In the future I may try a 205/50 that will be closer to the correct height of the stock setup...
I WANT TO STRESS THAT I DONT RIDE HARD, DONT ROAD RACE, I JUST RIDE TO AND FROM WORK AND TOUR W/ WIFE AND FRIENDS. I WILL NEVER DO ANYTHING THAT I FEEL UNSAFE TO MY WIFE OR BIKE... I love my Concours and enjoy every moment on it. If I felt unsafe or had any reservations about the change I would pull it off and go back to m/c tires.....
The only thing now is I want to find another stock rear rim to mount a m/c tire on just in case I need to go in for warr. work or a trip to the mountains... I really do try to be open minded and plan ahead for different projects. Just think where we would be had no one in the past tried to do somthing new or different, ie. fuel injection vs carbs, varable valve timing vs set timing, etc, etc, etc... :stirpot: I really like this forum and respect the openion of all involved, I am sure some where down the road we will get to meet.
Al
New Bern Nc.
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Sounds like federal government finance to me.
Oh hell no dont even go there. I work for my money so dont push the wrong buttons :cannon:
Sorry to vent but that really struck the wrong nerve....
Al
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I WANT TO STRESS THAT I DONT RIDE HARD, DONT ROAD RACE, I JUST RIDE TO AND FROM WORK AND TOUR W/ WIFE AND FRIENDS. I WILL NEVER DO ANYTHING THAT I FEEL UNSAFE TO MY WIFE OR BIKE.
Look at that video again. Do you think he is "riding hard"? Nope. Anything that requires more than a few degrees of lean will put you outside the design spec of a car tire. And riding a motorcycle in any manner other than perfectly straight will require more than a few degrees of lean.
Your contact patch is going to be malformed/distorted.
The patch is going to be unacceptably small at times when it needs to be big.
The patch is unnecessarily large at times it needs to be smaller.
The transition through lean is going to be non-linear and unpredictable.
The side of a car tire is not designed to be driven on.
The tread is not designed to shed water when driven on the edge.
The belts in the tire are not designed to be stressed that way.
It is harder to mount and unmount.
The wheel is not designed to mount a car tire, and it could fail to stay on.
You have probably severely overinflated the car at 46-49psi, designed to run at maybe 32.
It might be ruled gross negligence by an insurance company in an accident.
I can't imagine that would be legal for state inspections.
Even the cheapest, crappiest motorcycle tire will be much safer.
I am not an engineer, and am probably just scratching the surface of the issues.
All this to maybe save $100 over perhaps 5 thousand miles on a $16,000 vehicle?
If I felt unsafe or had any reservations about the change I would pull it off and go back to m/c tires.....
Yeah. I see.
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All this to maybe save $100 over perhaps 5 thousand miles on a $16,000 vehicle?
+1...
I don't get the saving a $100 thing on a tire... If you want to use that tire buy a Geo Metro and sell your Connie.
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Car Tire on a Goldwing.. rightside up! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xaIj1XrmvLM#)
The video supplied by So Cal Joe says it all. Not everything people have tried and posted on this forum can be considered brilliant although occasionally someone offers an option or method that sparks of brilliance. This one can only be labeled stupid beyond belief. Let me emphasize "STUPID" and compare it to "Russian Roulette". Albeit this is not as dangerous as Russian Roulette simply because landing on the loaded cylinder will be fatal whereas landing on your ass probably won't kill you or your wife - but it just might.
Someone stated that Fred is a bit opinionated at times. I don't know Fred but do know that his opinions are based on knowledge he has acquired empirically rather than on notions that occurred to him while he was sitting on the john. This act of genius was probably conceived while you had your head in the john.
I agree with ZG who stated, "I don't get the saving a $100 thing on a tire... If you want to use that tire buy a Geo Metro and sell your Connie."
Maxtog also offered several posts. All of them are correct and anyone with the good sense God has bestowed upon the average goose should be able to recognize the wisdom implied and act accordingly.
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I'm pretty active on 3 forums, what a loser I am... Maybe someday I'll have to get real face to face friends... ;)
We're real J! :chugbeer:
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Not a loser at all, just means you can multi-task. You are most blessed. I, on the other hand, have 'What's that shiny thing over there?' syndrome. I can't even focus on what I'm doing at the moment....like this.
I like to meet people through these interactions. I've met Poke and will meet Conrad next year at some point assuming my neck is fixed. Heck, you may be unlucky enough to meet me at some point.... :yikes:
:thumbs:
How's that neck doing Sparky?
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We're real J! :chugbeer:
Thanks C.
:grouphug:
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Thanks for all the positive feedback ;D
Yea thou I walk thru the valley of the shadow of death, I shall fear no evil, I am protected by KAPASS... 8)
Happy New Year to all, Now I'm going to watch guys jump motorcycles and snowmobiles over a river....
Wow thats really safe too :rotflmao:
Take care and see ya on the road.
Al
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Now I'm going to watch guys jump motorcycles and snowmobiles over a river....
Wow thats really safe too :rotflmao:
Yes, that is also unsafe... I am sure our recommendation would be "don't do that either".
I WILL NEVER DO ANYTHING THAT I FEEL UNSAFE TO MY WIFE OR BIKE...
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Another factor to consider is liability. If someone with one of the these tires wrecks they would be subject to serious liability from anyone suffering damage. I can almost understand this kind of thing on a cruiser but on on a C14?
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:thumbs:
How's that neck doing Sparky?
I'm going to lobby for surgery. I don't like taking the drugs (not that there's anything wrong with that) to dull the pain and therapy ain't working. Makes it hurt worse and to top it off my C14 is giving me ugly looks when I walk by it.
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Throw a blanket over her head.
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I can almost understand this kind of thing on a cruiser but on on a C14?
No, I can't understand that either. All street motorcycles have to corner and lean for than several degrees. And that is all it takes to be WAY outside the design of a car tire.
About the only place I could see trying to use a car tire on a motorcycle is for one that is specifically designed for drag racing and ONLY drag racing. As in, straight-line motion only. In that single application, it might actually make sense, since you need every bit of straight upright contact patch possible and there is no cornering.
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Throw a blanket over her head.
Butter face? (http://i1200.photobucket.com/albums/bb336/jaywilcox/smiley_dunno.gif)
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Throw a blanket over her head.
Can't bear to do that either...
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Thanks for all the positive feedback ;D
Yea thou I walk thru the valley of the shadow of death, I shall fear no evil, I am protected by KAPASS... 8)
Happy New Year to all, Now I'm going to watch guys jump motorcycles and snowmobiles over a river....
Wow thats really safe too :rotflmao:
Take care and see ya on the road.
Al
Roland, as far as I am concerned if you are a reasonably experienced rider and you feel comfortable with the CT, go for it. It isn't for me but to each his own. I also understand the economics of the tire as I also use my bike as my primary transportation, that being said I will still not install a CT since the savings might be a maximum of about 200 per CT for me. I typically get around 15k out of each of my rear tires probably a result of my heavy winter riding where the tires don't get heated up nearly as much as they would during warmer temps. Good luck with the tire, I hope it works out for you.
Dave
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I'm going to lobby for surgery. I don't like taking the drugs (not that there's anything wrong with that) to dull the pain and therapy ain't working. Makes it hurt worse and to top it off my C14 is giving me ugly looks when I walk by it.
Do you have a pinched nerve or a herniated disc? I had two levels fused in my neck.. just curious.
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Do you have a pinched nerve or and a herniated disc? I had two levels fused in my neck.. just curious.
Yes.
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Haven't read all pages of this thread, but put me on the side of thinking that putting a car tire on any motorcycle is a very bad idea. MC tires don't get the mileage of a car tire because they are softer and stickier, and circumventing that design is as dangerous as replacing your motorcycle helmet with a bicycle helmet. False economy and inappropriate exchange of purpose-designed protection.
Would you get onto a JetBlue plane if you heard they had switched to 83 octane autofuel instead of Jet A to save money?
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Yes.
My surgery didn't fix anything. It is really only preventing further injury. I had one shot of steroids injected under x-ray and that was really the thing that cured the majority of my symptoms. To date I still have less feeling in my left hand and at I will never feel "right" again but I am able to function. I can only recommend you go into any operation with realistic expectations. The doctors will not guarantee anything. Have you tried the steroid injection at the site? It may take two to three injections for some people, I was lucky and one was enough. It helps reduce the swelling and accelerate the nerve healing. Best of luck.
Dave
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You are onto the truth- KiPass will not allow a tire failure even if you ride off a cliff....
This is one of those topics that generates tremendous emotional response and almost no data; just about everybody 'knows' this is a terrible idea even though they have no basis for that opinion. It just strikes people as 'wrong'. I would not worry about that too much- I assume that our common ancestor who invented the stone wheel was surrounded by his fellow cavemen telling him he was in for certain death should he try to ride on that stone thing.... it just isn't natural. :D
There are quite a few people on an FJR forum using car tires with what seems like success (they keep posting about it so I assume the car tires have not killed them all). There is a bit of good info. over there about using car tires on relatively high power, heavy sport touring motorcycles. It seems that they have a problem with the narrowest car tire rubbing against the brake caliper stay though so a C-14, having a wider stock wheel size, may actually be a better candidate.
I would love to see a C-14 using a tractor tire (the nasty, cross- cleated type used on backhoes) - I can just imagine the feedback that would generate. Especially if it was mounted backwards. ;D
Ride safe and let us know how it works out.
Brian
Thanks for all the positive feedback ;D
Yea thou I walk thru the valley of the shadow of death, I shall fear no evil, I am protected by KAPASS... 8)
Happy New Year to all, Now I'm going to watch guys jump motorcycles and snowmobiles over a river....
Wow thats really safe too :rotflmao:
Take care and see ya on the road.
Al
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From a rodent's point of view, anything that increases a vehicle's tire's width is a 'bad thing'. I am already having a hard enough time dodging vehicles without making the footprint any wider than it has to be.
Just trying to enjoy my nuts,
Kirby
Ok let the flaming begin... I went to darkside and put a car tire on the 09 Concours!
<snip>
Al In New Bern.
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From a rodent's point of view, anything that increases a vehicle's tire's width is a 'bad thing'. I am already having a hard enough time dodging vehicles without making the footprint any wider than it has to be.
Just trying to enjoy my nuts,
Kirby
Did one of Brians cats do that to you? :stirpot: All my bikes are cat free, if you are looking to live/exist in a rodent concerned area drop me a PM, I'll send in SWAT to break you out :shoot:
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We have several "darksider's" on ST-O sharing their knowledge/experience. Pretty much positive feedback, experience and tire responsiveness. Every CT has it's quirks and setup, air pressure and suspension tweaking.
Like seats and shields, everyone has an opinion... if you don't feel comfortable running one, then stick with a MC tire... it's what brought you to the dance. 8)
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Sounds like federal government finance to me.
Oh hell no dont even go there. I work for my money so dont push the wrong buttons :cannon:
Sorry to vent but that really struck the wrong nerve....
Al
A. Your first sentence was let the flaming begin...
B. That seems to me like what the government does - they spend bigs bucks on a machine, then in the name of saving a very small percentage of total ownership cost, they cut corners/expenses and reduce the benefit/performance by a very large percentage.
Makes no sense to me, but it is your bike and your money. I would not make a negative comment - except you asked for comments. ::)
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If I were a sedate enough rider to even consider a CT on my bike, I would instead go with a longer life cruiser or touring tire. I see on a C10 forum that some guys are using the Michelin Commander 2. I've read several places where they're getting twice the mileage of some other tires. Also, there at least a bike tire.
http://www.michelinmotorcycle.com/index.cfm?event=Commander (http://www.michelinmotorcycle.com/index.cfm?event=Commander)
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Hi ,
Have to admit that I was alittle intrigued , untill seeing the vidieo,and considering the potential liability issues with this set up.
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While we're on this subject...... Can anyone tell me where to find a steering wheel and seat belts for a 2010 Concours.
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http://www.campagnamotors.com/ (http://www.campagnamotors.com/)
Maybe there's a C14 underneath it all somewhere.... ::)
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Car Tire on a Goldwing.. rightside up! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xaIj1XrmvLM#)
Man, his chicken strips must be huge ;)
A motorcycle is a single track vehicle, it uses weight transfer to turn. A car is a dual track vehicle, it uses friction to turn, excessive weight transfer hinders it's ability to maintain friction/traction. Just using these two simple ideas would be counter to using a car tire on a motorcycle, same holds true for a motorcycle tire on a car. If motorcycle tires simply use a softer compound why wouldnt a race car mount motorcycle tires? The again simple concept of single track vs dual track is all I need to know about what I mount on my bike.
Roland, I will plead that you reconsider your decision, if not for you, then your loved one. I do not want to read of a bad encounter from you or another forum member. You've been around for some time, from what I remember you are a very wise man, wise men know when to swallow their pride. I hope you take this well, it is intended to evoke a level of emotion, not to tick you off, rather to hopefully open your eyes to what I think is tantomount to extreme danger. If you want to be a pioneer, see about adding a nitrous setup (since the turbo is already being done), nitrous has an on and off, a car tire doesnt (well, hopefully it has an off the rim and not an "Off"). Please, please, reconsider the car tire.
Chet
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There are quite a few people on an FJR forum using car tires with what seems like success (they keep posting about it so I assume the car tires have not killed them all).
Just wondering how many of those people would have a bad experience with it and post it. Pride?
This is one of those topics that generates tremendous emotional response and almost no data
Scientifically speaking, a non-random sample of only testimonials on a forum is also not really valid data either (specifically pointing at the FJR forum reference). Sometimes you don't really need hard data to know when something just isn't right. We might not have any data about replacing motorcycle handlebars from ones made from wood, either; but it has face validity that it would be a bad idea (strength, breaking, splintering, weather resistance, failure can cause death, etc).
Ride safe [with your car tire] and let us know how it works out.
Personally, I think that is an oxymoron
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Nope, I was not trying to claim it was data other than the fact that several of the posters keep posting and that indicates that using CT's on a motorcycle has not 'gotten' them yet.
My personal opinion is that all those who reach all the way over to one side on this issue are being led by their emotions rather than anything concrete. It is an undeniable fact that car tires will mount and seal to a motorcycle wheel, and allow the motorcycle to be ridden on some level. Where I think many people go awry is when they claim that it is hugely unsafe- we simply do not know how safe or unsafe it really is. Even those who advocate the use of CTs on motorcycles (and I am not one of them, I have no opinion really.... we are just discussing the topic here) do not claim that they are better across the board, rather they seem to be trying to expand on one major area of performance (tire longevity, tire economy, and similar) at the expense of some other areas of performance.
Still, I find the topic interesting in the same way I would find it interesting how it would work out to use a tube inside a tubeless tire: that too would be 'unsafe', a bad idea, not what the manufacturers of either the tube or tire intended, and specifically mentioned to be avoided by tubeless tire mfgs. But I suspect that on some level it would work with predictable trade- offs and loss of maximum performance.
Two things do seem to be certain though: as long as it can be done (car tires mechanically fit on motorcycle wheels) it will be done, and not very many people will ever try it.
Brian
Just wondering how many of those people would have a bad experience with it and post it. Pride?
Scientifically speaking, a non-random sample of only testimonials on a forum is also not really valid data either (specifically pointing at the FJR forum reference). Sometimes you don't really need hard data to know when something just isn't right. We might not have any data about replacing motorcycle handlebars from ones made from wood, either; but it has face validity that it would be a bad idea (strength, breaking, splintering, weather resistance, failure can cause death, etc).
Personally, I think that is an oxymoron
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Be safe.
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If I see the motorcycle tire on your car I'll be even more impressed.
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If I see the motorcycle tire on your car I'll be even more impressed.
... even more so if it has 100% nitrogen in them! HA! ;D
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If I see the motorcycle tire on your car I'll be even more impressed.
Part of my business has me visiting large truck tire dealers.
At one location in San Antonio, I saw a car rim with a bridgestone motorcycle tire on it.
It was worn to the cords and had huge chicken strips!
I wish I had thought to snap a pic.
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I still have to ask myself, why? :)
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Thanks for all the positive feedback ;D
Yea thou I walk thru the valley of the shadow of death, I shall fear no evil, I am protected by KAPASS... 8)
Happy New Year to all, Now I'm going to watch guys jump motorcycles and snowmobiles over a river....
Wow thats really safe too :rotflmao:
Take care and see ya on the road.
Al
You heard from all the experts who have not tried the dark side so I thought I would jump in and say I rode a Goodyear TT on my Valkyrie for 35,000 miles (all on the same tire) and did not experience any flaming death or crashes. I would not put one on my C-14 but to each his own.
Heard all the rants about how insurance would not cover you if you wrecked and such but went to my agent and showed him and he said who cares we don't come out and check your car tires when you wreck and wont your motorcycle either.
Got great wet weather riding, better braking and striaght line accleration. She was different in the twistes (not worse just a different feel) hence the reason I would not put one on my C-14.
Tire cost $100 and at $250 dollars per Motorcyle tire (including change) for tires that went around 8k I saved alot. I really did not do it just for that, I am a curious fellow and dont often listen to people who tell me the sky is falling.
Good Luck and let me know how you make out, even if you crash ;).
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A few things to ponder.......
1. I will never ride bitch with you!!!
2. Maybe a motorcycle tire would help my Subaru corner even better?
3. I don't go cheap on tires or brakes "on any vehicle".
4. What is KAPASS?
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If I see the motorcycle tire on your car I'll be even more impressed.
Indeed, PR3's all around on one of those stupid little smart cars... ;D
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Indeed, PR3's all around on one of those stupid little smart cars... ;D
No way, everyone knows Angels are the best choice, has anyone ever heard of a "Guardian PR2/3? ;D
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No way, everyone knows Angels are the best choice, has anyone ever heard of a "Guardian PR2/3? ;D
:chugbeer: :rotflmao:
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Yeah, and if you like them now wait 'till you try them so that the fat one is on the back of the bike.
Brian
No way, everyone knows Angels are the best choice, has anyone ever heard of a "Guardian PR2/3? ;D
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Yeah, and if you like them now wait 'till you try them so that the fat one is on the back of the bike.
Brian
You talkin 'bout me or the tire?
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I was talking about those Angels- the skinny one should go up front, and the fat one in the back.
:o ;)
Brian
You talkin 'bout me or the tire?
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Everyone knows my wife is an angel, you calling her FAT? ;)
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;D
May do we need a dose of Haroldo around here or what? Even the car tire on a motorcycle threads are running down.
Brian
Everyone knows my wife is an angel, you calling her FAT? ;)
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;D
May do we need a dose of Haroldo around here or what? Even the car tire on a motorcycle threads are running down.
Brian
I do wonder if he used synthetic lube when he mounted up the tire 8)
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Everyone knows my wife is an angel, you calling her FAT? ;)
PHAT... ;)
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PHAT... ;)
I don't think she would understand, if I called her fat or phat I'd get punched no matter what I offered as an explanation :-X She is still looking for a fix for monkey butt 8)
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Wow, This thread is kicking some major ideas around about my IQ.. :yikes:
I would like to thank two members of the forum that were really understanding B.D.F. AND BALKMC. :grouphug:
You guys didnt completely agree but understand where I am coming from...
Now for everones entertainment, I have copied and will paste now the ten reasons for running the darkside. From the darkside forum.... Please read and understand where I am coming from. :hail:
Just read and enjoy. And remember I was the first to darkside the c14. :loco: :chugbeer:
Comments from VTwin Bobby of the Riding the Darkside:
"Why Use A Car Tire????
1. Our tires are NOT flat! The have the same contour of a worn motorcycle tire. The only reason you change the motorcycle tire is NOT because it doesn't handle any more, it's because it's out of rubber in the middle. Our Darksides just start and stay that way. When we wear a car tire out, the whole tire is gone. Not so with the motorcycle tire. You still have good sidewalls left....about 50% of the tire is unused. We use the whole tire whether riding straight or when doing twisties, we have about 40% of the contact patch is still on the ground in the twisties. It's still larger than a motorcycle tire can produce. (Even a 3/4 worn car tire still has rain grooves left, NOT so with a motorcycle tire)
2. Just so you know, we don't run low air pressure and flex the sidewalls to make it work. We use the roll of the tire just like a motorcycle tire and never get on the sidewalls. This Mod is for a cruiser only because by the time we get leaned to get close to gettting off the tread and onto the sidewalls, we are dragging everthing on our bikes and couldn't lean any more if we wanted to. (I have done the tread pattern by running it thru water and then making tight turns...the car tire contact patch is always a twice that of the motorcycle tire.
3. If a vehicle that weight 3500 lbs. on the average can't destroy a car tire all the while stressing the side walls while the rim of the wheel stays on it's on plane and the tire stresses and flexes and distorts and doesn't fail while traveling on another plane...how much more damage could we do if we never stress our car tires and always under any condition we ride in, our tires stay directly in line with rim and the line of motion. Plus loaded we (motorcycles) can only at best put a 1/4 of load on it that a vehicle could put on it.
4. The statement that we only run hiways and interstates couldn't be further from the truth. I have dragged my pipes so much since going to the darkside, that they looked wrecked...hehehehe I have already tore all the peg indicators off my pegs from diving in so hard that instead of scraping the just snapped off. Do some research on here and you will see all kinds of twisty riding from Valk's to wing's to X's and they have ridden all over this country. Check out Daniel Meyers site and see where's he's ridden a car tire and he will never, ever go back to a motorcycle tire. You see at many post's and this is common..."I wouldn't go back to a motorcycle tire on the rear if they were free!" It's true. I want go back either, even if they were free.
5. Biggest myth is that motorcycle tires wear out because they have softer rubber....Myth Busted! They have harder rubber, that's why wet riding conditions they slip so much. I have a durometer and I have tested at least 30 motorcycle tires to car tires...and in every case my car tire was at least 15 to 20 points softer than any motorcycle tire I tested. That's why wet riding conditions and twisties the car tire kicks butt every time. Softer is more traction every time. My son races karts and we are always looking for softer compounds and ways to make more grip. Now, why does our car tires last twice to 4 times as many miles than a M/T is because ALL our C/T's tread is working together instead of one little contact patch of a M/T. I know this might sound ignorant...but the world's flat where I live and motorcycle tires are round. It's gonna wear 4 times faster.
***Here's the durometer link******* ( Click the below link!)
http://mcdarksiders.forumotion.com/general-discussion-f6/durometer-test-on-205-and-dunniepics-added-t557.htm?highlight=durometer (http://mcdarksiders.forumotion.com/general-discussion-f6/durometer-test-on-205-and-dunniepics-added-t557.htm?highlight=durometer)
6. I don't expect you to trust us...but look on here and PM some guys in your area and just watch or follow some one around who has a darkside. You will be impressed. Plus, if it didn't work then the Boss Hoss's would be out of business. Think about it. How much HP do they have and the C/T works for them...they could put a 300 M/T on back, but it doesn't hold up or could handle the HP even in twisties. You don't hear of them wrecking every time they get to a curve...hehehehe
7. This mod only came about because some of us where daily riders or traveled for a living and every 6,000 to 8,000 miles we had to put a new tire on with 50% of it still good and the prices keeps going up. We didn't do it for the money only...it's the principle and practical nature of the abuse put on a M/T. It doesn't work on high HP cruisers.
8. This mod isn't for every one. If you only ride 5,000 miles a year. ####! It isn't for you. If you are a daily commuter or traveler and you want a tire to handle any thing mother nature or a road condition (including twisties) can throw at you....then this is your way to go.
9. Collect all the data you can and NOT from guys who don't put their lives on the line and ride every day and put their money where they mouth is.....or better said. Don't take advice from guys who don't do what you are planning to do. The more data you got the better decision you can make. So, good luck with your decision and if we can help, WE WILL BE THERE FOR YOU.
10. Remember, this is a mod that you do willing. If we wanted to be safe on the road, we would buy a SUV. We already have picked the most dangerous hobby any one can think of for riding America's roads against cagers.....hehehehehe
Thanks for asking. This probably doesn't answer all you questions, but it will get you started toward the Darkside.
................bobby"
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oh, forgot to add Thanks to all the mods for not deleting my subject matter :hail:
Thank you.
Al in New Bern.
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Roland, I sure do enjoy your passion!! I think #2 is really telling. #1? He says it isnt flat, but? If it isn't then why does it look like it? Isn't that how it has such a large contact patch? A motorcycle weighs what, %20 of a car? Ever been in a car during a big rain and hydroplane? Imagine having %80 less weight pressing the tire down into the water. Which stands a better chance of surviving a moderate amount of hydroplaning? I average annually 20-24 thousand miles on 2 wheels. I would say I have ridden faster then I would guess %80-90 of the forum, my chicken strips are as small as most anyone I have ever seen, and somehow I still get 12-14000 miles from a set of tires. From a riders perspective I could in no way suggest CTs as a safe alternative. I teach BRCs for the MSF and I also teach an advanced Street Skills course so from that perspective I have the same view, but that in no way influenced my reasoning. I wonder when a top tier racer will stumble on the fact that CTs offer a softer tire with longer life? Just imagine, they could run BsTTW for the entire race with no fear of the grip falling off. Something else to ponder is rolling mass, just how much more does a CT weigh vs a MC tire? There are so many reasons why a CT is inferior to a MC tire, I have only scratched the surface. Food for thought.
I sure hope that isnt the Bobby who scammed the old forum, he is on a v twin courtesy of donations made by members of this forum >:(
If cars tires are as great as this guy makes out you would see them on vespas and other low end MCs. I for one had no intention of insulting you, rather I was trying to snap you out of what I consider a very dangerous practice. I sure hope you understand my intentions.
On a more serious note, I asked my wife if my Carharts made me look phat, she quickly said no, my a$$ did :(
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On a more serious note, I asked my wife if my Carharts made me look phat, she quickly said no, my a$$ did :(
:rotflmao: :rotflmao: :rotflmao:
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Vtwin Bobby is a whack-job!!!!!!! ::)
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Again #2:This Mod is for a cruiser only because by the time we get leaned to get close to gettting off the tread and onto the sidewalls, we are dragging everthing on our bikes and couldn't lean any more if we wanted to.
Not for me but have at it.
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oh, forgot to add Thanks to all the mods for not deleting my subject matter :hail:
Thank you.
Al in New Bern.
You're welcome and why would we delete this? Have you had it deleted somewhere else? The entertainment value is priceless!
By the way, you ain't the first to bring this up here and probably won't be the last.
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Car Tire on a Goldwing.. rightside up! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xaIj1XrmvLM#)
and again....I still think the video tells it all!
Aaron
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Does anybody have the how-to on fitting a bench seat from a '71 Chevelle onto the C14?
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Does anybody have the how-to on fitting a bench seat from a '71 Chevelle onto the C14?
Back seat, right? The front was soooooo boring ;)
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Back seat, right? The front was soooooo boring ;)
That seat resides in the World's Most Interesting Man Hall of Fame. Stay thirsty my friend. ;D
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Roland, I think you promised more pics of the install. I would like to see them added here, if possible. I think I'm going to put this into our FAQ area once it dies down a bit. It's an interesting read. If you need help posting more pics then let me know.
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You're welcome and why would we delete this? Have you had it deleted somewhere else?
:stirpot: :-X
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That seat resides in the World's Most Interesting Man Hall of Fame. Stay thirsty my friend. ;D
Do ya think that he's a Darksider?
(http://chzmemebase.files.wordpress.com/2011/04/memes-untitled9.jpg)
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I think Forrest Gump's mama said it best. Wasn't it "Life is like a box of chocolates.", or something like that? :)
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I think it was the other one. :)
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Do ya think that he's a Darksider?
(http://chzmemebase.files.wordpress.com/2011/04/memes-untitled9.jpg)
Sounds a bit like me, I'm afraid...
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Roland, I think you promised more pics of the install. I would like to see them added here, if possible. I think I'm going to put this into our FAQ area once it dies down a bit. It's an interesting read. If you need help posting more pics then let me know.
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How about a pic with the bike in it.
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more pcx
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more pcx
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That was fast, thanks.
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I hope the pcx are working.
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These were taken Sat. we went for a ride today and now just getting pcx. up. The chicken strip pcx is a line i painted accross the tire just to let me know (and you guys) where I am riding.... Not much to brag about but I still drag my shoes on turns w/no problems.... Just like the stock tires...
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My wife gets tired of hearing it, but "damn I love this bike" :thumbs:
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Does anybody have the how-to on fitting a bench seat from a '71 Chevelle onto the C14?
I want an electric sunroof and AC
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Still aint a good idea.
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What...the sunroof and ac? I could go for ac.
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I dunno if it's previously been done on a C-14 or not. But it's been done on a lot of other bikes, evidentially with some success.
I drive agressive and it's just not worth it to me.
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I guess Booger didnt read the beginning of the topic ? :banghead:
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These were taken Sat. we went for a ride today and now just getting pcx. up. The chicken strip pcx is a line i painted accross the tire just to let me know (and you guys) where I am riding.... Not much to brag about but I still drag my shoes on turns w/no problems.... Just like the stock tires...
You're leaning over enough on a CT to drag your shoes? :o
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I dunno if it's previously been done on a C-14 or not. But it's been done on a lot of other bikes, evidentially with some success.
I drive agressive and it's just not worth it to me.
I guess Booger didnt read the beginning of the topic ? :banghead:
Perhaps roland didn't read Booger's post? Yes, on the crashed forum, there was a forum member who reported running a car tire on the rear for quite a while, but replaced it with a motorcycle tire when it wore out.
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So I may have not done much research on the whole darkside thing but here's a good kicker... who runs a CT on the front wheel? What's that tell you about how good a CT is for a bike if you can't run the same tire front and rear ?!?!
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We don't run the same tire front and back. They are different sizes and tread patterns. Typically same mfg, though, and they are radials.
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Nevertheless they aren't flat like a car tire though, no? LOL
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Most assuredly not...
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This is the most winning-est topic and thread on the internet! (http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j180/stevewfl/avatars/iconhammer.gif)(http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j180/stevewfl/avatars/iconhammer.gif)(http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j180/stevewfl/avatars/iconhammer.gif)
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I think a car tire from and back would be great, there would be no need to put down the kickstand.
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I think a car tire from and back would be great, there would be no need to put down the kickstand.
http://en-us.spyder.brp.com/showroom/build-your-spyder.aspx?vehicleID=e4f23b56-d92d-4411-9521-1af82db4d87e (http://en-us.spyder.brp.com/showroom/build-your-spyder.aspx?vehicleID=e4f23b56-d92d-4411-9521-1af82db4d87e)
;)
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Had one. I'll be damned if the first time I rode it I put my foot down coming to a stop and about broke my ankle with the footpeg.
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http://en-us.spyder.brp.com/showroom/build-your-spyder.aspx?vehicleID=e4f23b56-d92d-4411-9521-1af82db4d87e (http://en-us.spyder.brp.com/showroom/build-your-spyder.aspx?vehicleID=e4f23b56-d92d-4411-9521-1af82db4d87e)
;)
No thanks, although they would be perfect for the Winter. They just take up too much room, oh year, and I already have a car, I just rarely use it. ;D
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Winter? I wonder how a chain would work on the 14 ;) A chain in the rear and a tire sock up front? Or maybe studs and a sock?
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Winter? I wonder how a chain would work on the 14 ;) A chain in the rear and a tire sock up front? Or maybe studs and a sock?
I just use tire warmers, then ride really fast so they don't cool down before I'm done.
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No applause, no applause, just throw money ;) I'm really glad that this has kept everone entertained and learning. WE all are different and ride different. I just wanted everone to know it is possible and works well for MY riding style..... 8)
I am sure it is not for everyone, and never suggested it, just wanted to let you know it works for me.
Cant remember who ask it but Yes I do drag my shoes with the ct. just like the mc tire. That was when I really felt safe, using the same corner with the same results....Nice and stable and predictible.
Al
Ps:
9 pages and still going strong :stirpot:
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Since you are a guy who really likes a challenge do as Jettn Jim (and his KLR) did, carry some studs and stare danger in the eyes everytime it snows.
Saying this in all sincerity, you can honestly say you've been well informed and challenged by some of the best. I can say I hope you prove me wrong.
Keep the flat side down and shiny side up ;D
Chet
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Yep, true enough because when we use motorcycle tires like we are supposed to, we put the same size tire on the front and the back.
Steve is right- this thread delivers.
Brian
So I may have not done much research on the whole darkside thing but here's a good kicker... who runs a CT on the front wheel? What's that tell you about how good a CT is for a bike if you can't run the same tire front and rear ?!?!
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Yes I do drag my shoes with the ct. just like the mc tire.
Wooptie-do. That just means you need to get your feet up on the pegs where they belong when cornering. ::)
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Unless he's not using the front brake and doing the Harley Shuffle to stop.
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Wooptie-do. That just means you need to get your feet up on the pegs where they belong when cornering. ::)
Discussing proper riding technique in a car tire thread is not logical.
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No applause, no applause, just throw money ;) I'm really glad that this has kept everone entertained and learning. WE all are different and ride different. I just wanted everone to know it is possible and works well for MY riding style..... 8)
I am sure it is not for everyone, and never suggested it, just wanted to let you know it works for me.
Cant remember who ask it but Yes I do drag my shoes with the ct. just like the mc tire. That was when I really felt safe, using the same corner with the same results....Nice and stable and predictible.
Al
Ps:
9 pages and still going strong :stirpot:
If you think 9 (now 10) pages of people telling you (somewhat politely) that you are an idiot, or are at least doing an idiotic thing, means that "everyone" is learning something, then perhaps you need to go home and rethink your life.
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No applause, no applause, just throw money ;) I'm really glad that this has kept everone entertained and learning. WE all are different and ride different. I just wanted everone to know it is possible and works well for MY riding style..... 8)
I am sure it is not for everyone, and never suggested it, just wanted to let you know it works for me.
Cant remember who ask it but Yes I do drag my shoes with the ct. just like the mc tire. That was when I really felt safe, using the same corner with the same results....Nice and stable and predictible.
Al
Ps:
9 pages and still going strong :stirpot:
(http://i1200.photobucket.com/albums/bb336/jaywilcox/someone_is_wrong_on_the_internet1.jpg)
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You've used that before....let's get something a bit newer, shall we?
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If an old shoe fits, you can still wear it :thumbs:
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If you think 9 (now 10) pages of people telling you (somewhat politely) that you are an idiot, or are at least doing an idiotic thing, means that "everyone" is learning something, then perhaps you need to go home and rethink your life.
Dang Clyde, resorting to name calling isn't going to help a thing now is it?
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If an old shoe fits, you can still wear it :thumbs:
It still gives me a chuckle, but we won't tell ZG about that, shall we?
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It still gives me a chuckle, but we won't tell ZG about that, shall we?
I'm here for your entertainment Sparky, and I know you laugh more after a couple martini's too... (http://i1200.photobucket.com/albums/bb336/jaywilcox/martini-drinking-emoticon.gif)
You know you're always keepin an eye out for my posts bro... ;) ;D
(http://i1200.photobucket.com/albums/bb336/jaywilcox/sakdjsiuiu.jpg)
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You've used that before....let's get something a bit newer, shall we?
Ok Sparky, are these better... ;D
(http://i1200.photobucket.com/albums/bb336/jaywilcox/wdoqwoiueq.jpg)
(http://i1200.photobucket.com/albums/bb336/jaywilcox/soiueiwquew.jpg)
(http://i1200.photobucket.com/albums/bb336/jaywilcox/siudweuqw.jpg)
(http://i1200.photobucket.com/albums/bb336/jaywilcox/skdjiwquew-1.jpg)
(http://i1200.photobucket.com/albums/bb336/jaywilcox/sdjiweurw.jpg)
(http://i1200.photobucket.com/albums/bb336/jaywilcox/ekjriuu38.jpg)
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And your point?
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And your point?
:rotflmao:
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Son of pappy, As little snow we get here in eastern NC, it might be awhile before I need the studs... ;D
I have really enjoyed all the input from everyone, really this has been fun and entertaining for all. I am pleased that I did the ct on the connie 1400 first, someone had to break the ice. This is just another page in history.. :chugbeer:
I did fine another interesting thing on the internet. Someone has the crazy idea of a tubeless tire. :yikes:
Is that the stupidest thing you have ever heard of. How in the world can a tire hold air without a tube... :stirpot:
Keep having fun and I will keep having fun and maybe try other crazy things.
I really respect all you guys and gals. Thanks for being friends and guiding lights. :grouphug:
Wow, when was the last time this forum had a 11 page thread? This is specal.
Al
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Um, again, you are NOT THE FIRST to run a car tire on a C14. And it wasn't a brilliant idea then, either.
The last 11-page C14 thread was last month. A long thread is not necessarily a sign that the OP had his ducks in a row. We had a very long thread by a guy who said the bike came without oil from the dealership, but it unfortunately got locked after about a year.
Oh, well.
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Clyde, did your egg nog spoil? ;)
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I don't think so. Sounds normal to me.
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I don't think so. Sounds normal to me.
Correct! :thumbs:
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Hummmmmmm. If i go to Boston next summer I may try that