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Mish mash => Open Forum => Topic started by: B.D.F. on April 30, 2018, 02:40:09 pm

Title: Hearing aids
Post by: B.D.F. on April 30, 2018, 02:40:09 pm
So most of my fellow C-14 owners are 'long of tooth' as I am and therefore, I believe have some experience in an area new to me.....

I am  60 yrs. old and my hearing sucks (technical term meaning significant loss of sensitivity to both very low and mid- to- high frequency sound). I often use the CC portion of TV and just read the words. I am having all the 'usual' problems with speech from an individual, lots of 'white noise' in public areas such as restaurants, and the inability to discriminate consonants. Now while this has a distinctly humorous result, such as when the wife and kid want to watch "Doctor Sour" and I cannot find it because the real title is "Darkest hour", it also has its drawbacks such as conversing with other humans generally.

So, after having a hearing test by an audiologist (real M.D., not a hearing aid center), and getting the curve of my hearing loss, it has been presented to me that I "require" XYZ brand and type of hearing aid. Fine and well. But these hearing aids are $6,200, out of pocket, and I am currently researching how much better 'the best' is from the middle- of- the pack hearing aids, which start at $150 each and run up to $1,200 each. ??

So, here is the question: is $1,000 worth of hearing aids 90% as good as the $6,200 hearing aids? 70% as good?

??

I did test- drive a pair of Opticon One hearing aids for the weekend and I must say that 1) they really seemed to "cure" my nasty tinnitus, which is GREAT all by itself. They seemed to help my overall hearing, starting with human interaction and ending with TV watching. They are comfortable and I actually fell asleep with them installed without any discomfort or problem. But the real question remains: will $300 worth of hearing aids perform well enough by comparison? How about the $1,200 hearing aids?

So to all you half- deaf, 'old people' out there, any insight in choosing between a lesser priced but "full capability" set of hearing aids, and the 'top dog', very expensive, 'state- of- the- art' hearing aids? Is the difference worth 6 or 10 times the cost?

Any useful input appreciated,
Brian
Title: Re: Hearing aids
Post by: Eupher on April 30, 2018, 03:10:25 pm
I'm 61 and have been a performing musician for 50 years. So yeah, my hearing sucks.

I have two different types of hearing aids, and find the smaller ones that fit inside the ear canal without the over-the-ear hook to be most comfortable -- but prone to feedback, unfortunately.

I've used these guys. They're much more reasonable than the $6,200 flavor. Hearing aids, according to a friend of mine who's in the business, is a racket on par with the Crime Families out of NYC. No need to pay that kind of money for the help. They won't even make you an offer "you can't refuse."

And 75% of wearing a hearing aid is actually convincing yourself and training yourself that you need to wear them. Like false teeth (that I don't have), hearing aids is a PITA to contend with. But it is nice to hear stuff that you haven't heard in a very long time -- like a car's turn signal noise, for example. And I don't watch TV because I can't hear the dialogue -- and that is a blessing.

https://centuryhearingaids.com/?SID=e5ipqidgdqvjj7ij9himppbk93
Title: Re: Hearing aids
Post by: maxtog on April 30, 2018, 04:08:42 pm
I don't have hearing aids, but I have often thought it is a racket when I see the pricing.  Some of the higher-end ones do have some neat features, like being able to use them with Blue Tooth, so you can use them as headphones for music, or with your phone.  Others have the ability to be programmed on the fly for different listening conditions.  Some high-end also have automatic gain control and noise filtering.

Like you, I suspect that a basic aid (programmed for your exact audiogram) will give you at least 80% of what the super-expensive ones will.  The old "80/20" rule :)
Title: Re: Hearing aids
Post by: FTB530 on April 30, 2018, 04:41:46 pm
I have been wearing hearing aids since I was 40, 18 years now, the in the ear Canal is what I use and I usually get a set that my insurance pays 100% of the cost, but now I am at a point the ITC aids are not big enough to have the more powerful electronics available. So I went to a audiologist and they let me borrow a set for two weeks over the ear type, they really made a difference but the cost was close to $5k, I am not eligible for a new set from my insurance until December, so I went to Costco and I will be buying a set there and the pric e is about $1800.
 If you have a Costco in Your area take your info from the audiologist there and see what a they can do for you!

Ps the over the ear hearing aids I could not wear inside my helmet!
Title: Re: Hearing aids
Post by: maxtog on April 30, 2018, 04:52:24 pm
Ps the over the ear hearing aids I could not wear inside my helmet!

But would you want to?  Many of us wear earplugs (maybe most?) in an effort to reduce wind noise and prevent progressive hearing loss/damage...  I never really thought of someone WANTING to hear more while riding, unless it was really profound hearing loss, or if it involved needing to use communications (intercom).  I suppose it might be a hassle to have to re-install them in your ears each time, if you are using the bike on and off a lot.  Hmm.
Title: Re: Hearing aids
Post by: jettawreck on April 30, 2018, 05:52:16 pm
I don't need (?) them yet, but my parents have them. My dad has had them for many years and several different types.

1) Very expensive, most of them hugely overpriced and almost should be considered racketeering.
2) "Audiologist" guys always try to sell you on technology. Currently my dad has found the external "old school" behind the ear unit he is using now is superior to the fancy, tiny in the ear units he's had in the past.
Check out options and get local recommendations, lots of them.
Title: Re: Hearing aids
Post by: Rubber_Snake on April 30, 2018, 07:35:04 pm
Brian, what do you mean that the Optican Ones seemed to “cure” your tinnitus?

I have mild tinnitus and it sucks.

When I ride, I wear a pair of Bose bluetooth noise cancelling earbuds.  They are incredible. They help to keep the noise down and protect my ears, albeit to a smaller degree than actual earplugs.  Plus, I can actually hear my music as opposed to my Sena, which only has average sound fidelity and does nothing for noise.
Title: Re: Hearing aids
Post by: tonedeaf1 on April 30, 2018, 08:18:40 pm
My GP Physician recommends Costco. I haven't tried them but I am close to new units and I will definitely check them out:
http://hearinghealthmatters.org/blog/2017/costco-hearing-aid-review-phonak-resound-bernafon-rexton/ (http://hearinghealthmatters.org/blog/2017/costco-hearing-aid-review-phonak-resound-bernafon-rexton/)


Important: Don't believe anything your ears tell you until you have worn them for at least 3 months. Your hearing loss is slow and putting in new hearing aids is fast, so things will sound strange.

Of all the options, the ability is adjust the volume is critical. Cell phones can be a pain so think about Blue Tooth if you spend a lot of time on the phone.
Title: Re: Hearing aids
Post by: maxtog on May 01, 2018, 01:40:36 am
I have mild tinnitus and it sucks.

So do I, and I can confirm that it does, indeed, suck, badly.  It is a far worse disorder than hearing loss because almost nothing can be done about it.  Mine came on pretty suddenly about two years and for no "reason".  It is at about 13KHz and never stops.  For now, thankfully, I can ignore it most of the day, unless it is a really quiet environment.  I pray it doesn't get worse.
Title: Re: Hearing aids
Post by: FTB530 on May 01, 2018, 02:54:01 am
So do I, and I can confirm that it does, indeed, suck, badly.  It is a far worse disorder than hearing loss because almost nothing can be done about it.  Mine came on pretty suddenly about two years and for no "reason".  It is at about 13KHz and never stops.  For now, thankfully, I can ignore it most of the day, unless it is a really quiet environment.  I pray it doesn't get worse.

I have tinnitus also and there is no cure for me it, as far as wanting to wear hearing aid in my helmet I have a Sena I would like to hear ,but I can’t anyway. I plan on buying a set of Westone ac20 to wear in my helmet so I can use the Sena!
Title: Re: Hearing aids
Post by: Conrad on May 01, 2018, 04:23:27 am
My experience is that most people don't say anything worth hearing anyways, so...    ;)
Title: Re: Hearing aids
Post by: maxtog on May 01, 2018, 05:48:41 am
My experience is that most people don't say anything worth hearing anyways, so...    ;)


What??  I can't hear you.....
Title: Re: Hearing aids
Post by: Conrad on May 01, 2018, 07:59:52 am

What??  I can't hear you.....

I'll talk a little louder for you.


Wait, maybe it's glasses that you need Max?
Title: Re: Hearing aids
Post by: B.D.F. on May 01, 2018, 09:26:25 am
The Dr. stuck them in (Boys!) and later, on the ride home, I noticed my tinnitus was simply gone. Mine is a solid hiss, like pure white noise, quite 'loud' in the left ear and it is annoying. But while wearing the hearing aids, it simply did not exist.

Doctor told me that tinnitus was not in the ear but rather in the brain, and occurs because the brain is expecting input from the ear, and so 1) begins to scan for that input harder and 2) will make up <something> to simulate input coming from the ear. Immediately upon installing the hearing aids, I began to hear a lot of little noises, virtually continuously, that I had not been hearing before, so perhaps with real input, the brain relaxes and returns to normal (OK, closer to normal) behavior. ?? Whatever the actual cause and action, it just went away. The funny thing is that I actual fell asleep with them in and 'on', and again, did not hear the usual loud hiss in the left ear at all.

Who knows, maybe it is psychosomatic. Normally I do not go in for anything that cannot be drawn, predicted or explained without using any words that are similar to 'magic' but the sub- conscious..... maybe that can be tricked. I only had the aids for 2 days and 3 nights (hey, like a vacation!) but they were very effective for my tinnitus. And helping me hear. And really helping me understand the words people actually say rather than the ones my brain makes up because they are close to what was said (though my words are always much funnier IMO). So the kids really did not want to watch a movie called Doctor Sour (which frankly sounded lousy just going by the title) but instead wanted to watch Darkest Hour.

Qualtiy of life is improved, seemingly greatly improved, with hearing aids in my case. Now the question is how much improvement and at what price? If I could get 92% effectiveness for a grand, or 96% effectiveness for six grand, I would go for the 92%. Hence this thread: where is that 'knee' in the cost / performance curve?

BTW- I found the same $6,200 hearing aids available on- line for just over $4,000 so that adds to the choices too. I would never 'go around' a full V.A.R. and buy on-line w/out letting them know and seeing if we could cut a deal. I would pay more for a local source that offered other advantages (loaner aids, local repair, etc.) but not 50% more, so somewhere in- between there may be the makings of a workable deal. ??

Brian

Brian, what do you mean that the Optican Ones seemed to “cure” your tinnitus?

I have mild tinnitus and it sucks.

When I ride, I wear a pair of Bose bluetooth noise cancelling earbuds.  They are incredible. They help to keep the noise down and protect my ears, albeit to a smaller degree than actual earplugs.  Plus, I can actually hear my music as opposed to my Sena, which only has average sound fidelity and does nothing for noise.
Title: Re: Hearing aids
Post by: B.D.F. on May 01, 2018, 09:35:02 am
That is what I am looking at as an alternative. Best case would be those programmable by me so I can flatten the hearing response curve (drops on bass, falls into a well at higher freqs). With a simple home- hearing test, I think they could be an excellent alternative to the existing infrastructure where so many have to clip so much profit in the chain that brings hearing aids to the public.

Thanks for the link and the feedback (sorry, I could not resist).

Brian

I'm 61 and have been a performing musician for 50 years. So yeah, my hearing sucks.

I have two different types of hearing aids, and find the smaller ones that fit inside the ear canal without the over-the-ear hook to be most comfortable -- but prone to feedback, unfortunately.

I've used these guys. They're much more reasonable than the $6,200 flavor. Hearing aids, according to a friend of mine who's in the business, is a racket on par with the Crime Families out of NYC. No need to pay that kind of money for the help. They won't even make you an offer "you can't refuse."

And 75% of wearing a hearing aid is actually convincing yourself and training yourself that you need to wear them. Like false teeth (that I don't have), hearing aids is a PITA to contend with. But it is nice to hear stuff that you haven't heard in a very long time -- like a car's turn signal noise, for example. And I don't watch TV because I can't hear the dialogue -- and that is a blessing.

https://centuryhearingaids.com/?SID=e5ipqidgdqvjj7ij9himppbk93
Title: Re: Hearing aids
Post by: maxtog on May 01, 2018, 04:14:54 pm

I'll talk a little louder for you.


Wait, maybe it's glasses that you need Max?

Don't rub it in... now I am nearly blind at anything less than about 2.5 feet.  Freaking glasses.
Title: Re: Hearing aids
Post by: maxtog on May 01, 2018, 04:24:05 pm
Doctor told me that tinnitus was not in the ear but rather in the brain, and occurs because the brain is expecting input from the ear, and so 1) begins to scan for that input harder and 2) will make up <something> to simulate input coming from the ear.

There are different kinds/types and causes of tinnitus, but it is generally not a solid science quite yet.  In many cases, they are related to hearing loss.  In my case, I am not so sure, I seem to have very sensitive hearing and have always protected my hearing.  Yet, I have never had a hearing test.  Perhaps I should.

Last night I tried one of those "listen to this tone for 5 minutes" on YouTube.  To my horror, when it was done, instead of improvement my tinnitus was at least twice as loud and took several hours to return to the "normal" amount of tone/annoyance.

Quote
Who knows, maybe it is psychosomatic.

That, I don't go for, at all.  It has a lot of brain involvement, but in my case, I know it isn't something that can just be wished away.  The only thing that helps is to have background noise, especially white noise (like a fan, which I use at night), which just kinda masks it so it can be "tuned out", but it is always there.

Quote
Normally I do not go in for anything that cannot be drawn, predicted or explained without using any words that are similar to 'magic' but the sub- conscious..... maybe that can be tricked. I only had the aids for 2 days and 3 nights (hey, like a vacation!) but they were very effective for my tinnitus.

In your case, I bet it really is just your brain in a feedback loop from the hearing loss of certain frequencies.  So getting aids sounds like a double-win.  Now, if you can just do it affordably.  It isn't just the initial price either.  Expect them to be like a smart phone- wearing out, breaking, needing updates, service, batteries, etc.  Blah.
Title: Re: Hearing aids
Post by: O.C. on May 02, 2018, 01:03:33 am
There are different kinds/types and causes of tinnitus, but it is generally not a solid science quite yet.  In many cases, they are related to hearing loss.  In my case, I am not so sure, I seem to have very sensitive hearing and have always protected my hearing.  Yet, I have never had a hearing test.  Perhaps I should.

Last night I tried one of those "listen to this tone for 5 minutes" on YouTube.  To my horror, when it was done, instead of improvement my tinnitus was at least twice as loud and took several hours to return to the "normal" amount of tone/annoyance.

That, I don't go for, at all.  It has a lot of brain involvement, but in my case, I know it isn't something that can just be wished away.  The only thing that helps is to have background noise, especially white noise (like a fan, which I use at night), which just kinda masks it so it can be "tuned out", but it is always there.

In your case, I bet it really is just your brain in a feedback loop from the hearing loss of certain frequencies.  So getting aids sounds like a double-win.  Now, if you can just do it affordably.  It isn't just the initial price either.  Expect them to be like a smart phone- wearing out, breaking, needing updates, service, batteries, etc.  Blah.


Is that a common side effect ? 
Title: Re: Hearing aids
Post by: VirginiaJim on May 02, 2018, 04:20:55 am
I hope not.
Title: Re: Hearing aids
Post by: gPink on May 02, 2018, 05:29:16 am
Will your ears fall off?
Title: Re: Hearing aids
Post by: B.D.F. on May 02, 2018, 10:17:37 am
Oh yes, I am already well aware of that. The behind- the- ear types with the in canal coil tend to break..... a lot, and a maintenance warranty is close to a grand for 4 years on them. Batteries are a consideration. And they absolutely have a lifespan; it is figured into everything as being 5 years but even the most optimistic observers claim it is 7 at most. So absolutely, this is an on- going expense and that MUST be known and compensated for before going into the hearing rabbit- hole.

Brian


<snip>

In your case, I bet it really is just your brain in a feedback loop from the hearing loss of certain frequencies.  So getting aids sounds like a double-win.  Now, if you can just do it affordably.  It isn't just the initial price either.  Expect them to be like a smart phone- wearing out, breaking, needing updates, service, batteries, etc.  Blah.
Title: Re: Hearing aids
Post by: just gone on May 02, 2018, 01:37:24 pm
I don't wear 'em (yet) but a word of advice. Whether at home or in public, if you can, reach around and flush the toilet before you stand up, even if you haven't finished all of the paper work yet. One of the things worse than fishing your accidentally dislodged expensive hearing aid out of the toilet, is fishing it out of a recently used toilet. Words of wisdom (or woe) from a now departed family member.
Might want to wear earmuffs in a port o potty.  (https://d9y0irtmw8kyq.cloudfront.net/img/cms/tags/hear-no-evil-monkey-emoji.gif)
Title: Re: Hearing aids
Post by: maxtog on May 02, 2018, 03:52:32 pm
eeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeewwwwwwww
Title: Re: Hearing aids
Post by: VirginiaJim on May 02, 2018, 05:51:31 pm
+1
Title: Re: Hearing aids
Post by: Conrad on May 03, 2018, 04:15:13 am
I don't wear 'em (yet) but a word of advice. Whether at home or in public, if you can, reach around and flush the toilet before you stand up, even if you haven't finished all of the paper work yet. One of the things worse than fishing your accidentally dislodged expensive hearing aid out of the toilet, is fishing it out of a recently used toilet. Words of wisdom (or woe) from a now departed family member.
Might want to wear earmuffs in a port o potty.  (https://d9y0irtmw8kyq.cloudfront.net/img/cms/tags/hear-no-evil-monkey-emoji.gif)

Talk about getting an earful!    :pukeface:
Title: Re: Hearing aids
Post by: Bob Young on May 13, 2018, 09:56:02 am
I've been wearing hearing aids since 2012. Behind the ear [can't wear them in helmet]; Resound brand. Battery life about seven days. 2012 price $4500.00; no insurance; draw from savings.
I could not believe the difference in my hearing. Without them every thing is muted; like stuffed up ears with a head cold.
Fast forward to 2017. Local "hearing aid specialist" offers free hearing test and "tune up" for your hearing aid. So I go for it. Appointment, test reveals hearing loss [duh!]; technician says my current aids are "old school" and they don't have the "computer program" to adjust. So the sales pitch begins. For only a $300.00 payment today, we can build your new hearing aids and have them fitted in less than a week for $6800.00! [I still have my 2012 hearing aids.]
At a sports event booth [12/2017] I see  SportEar, hearing enhancement and protection device. After listening to the well informed "salesperson", I opt to have an ear mold done for an in the ear type aid. Their price $2600.00. I ask why the difference and I'm told if the "aids" are sold as a sporting aid, the pricing can be lower.
Now $2600.00 is no small investment and may be the answer,maybe not. But to cut the price by two thirds certainly got my attention. I sent this company my 2012 hearing test results and they said they could build aids that would increase my hearing level by eight times. [I haven't ordered them yet, but intend to after the new year (2019)]
Getting an hearing test by an audiologist is the key; not a hearing aid specialist/salesperson.
See www.sportear.com (http://www.sportear.com)   I was interested in the custom edge in ear model. They are a shooting sport hearing protector/enhancement tool.
Just my .02 cents worth.

Bob Young
Title: Re: Hearing aids
Post by: B.D.F. on May 18, 2018, 01:53:26 pm
Well, I 'test- heard' a pair of Opticon One aids for a weekend (in fact, Tech. Day in Monson, MA) and liked them a lot. Unfortunately not $6,200 worth :-( Returned them, per prior agreement, on Monday (had them only for the weekend).

Finally decided to try a pair of Audicus hearing aids (~$1,600) but after two missed phone appointments where they (Chloe) were going to call me, on the third appointment, also missed, I get an e-mail from someone else saying Chloe got tied up (again I suppose) and they would call.... if I would send them my telephone number again. Must be the 'Get Smart' organization of the hearing aid industry so I took a pass; I cannot imagine what a return or warranty repair would be like with these folks.

Today I ended up buying a pair of Sonic Cheer 20's, $500 each but also they require a $200 module to connect to them via both Blue tooth as well as to make sound / program changes remotely. So I flipped for that one. Should be here in a week. Hopefully, I will be able to see what you folks type much more clearly.... no, wait, wrong correction device.

Brian
Title: Re: Hearing aids
Post by: B.D.F. on May 25, 2018, 05:56:02 pm
OK, phase 2: I have now purchased a pair of hearing aids from a discount on-line broker that cost $500 each, along with a remote control box for $200. After some study, it is really looking like the remote control <may> not be all that worthwhile but I am still evaluating it.

So far, the aids work pretty well. Not perfect but pretty good. Not as well as the Opticon One set I tried but then again, these are not $6,200 either. So the real question is: are these beneficial and a decent value compared to the top- of- the- line hearing aids? I cannot answer yet. I miss some features of the Opticon hearing aids, especially the ability to control each hearing aid's volume from a remote source (iPhone) quickly and easily. I can control the volume but only for both units at once and cannot adjust one aid independently. So again, the Opticon One were better / nicer but they were also $5 grand more and that is hard to justify, at least to me.

Anyway, I am tinkering around with this set and finding some success. They absolutely work, I just have not yet made a decision on their value to me, personally. I <think> this will be the way I will end up going but want a week or two to 'test- hear' them before making a final decision. I did purchase them and so actually own them but they are reutrnable for either 30 or 45 days so I will be evaluaing them carefully.

BTW: I can read everything you folks wrote MUCH better and clearer with these new hearing aids.  :rotflmao:

Brian
Title: Re: Hearing aids
Post by: just gone on May 25, 2018, 08:43:32 pm
BTW: I can read everything you folks wrote MUCH better and clearer with these new hearing aids.  :rotflmao:

But are the voices in your head still coming through loud and clear or is there now electrical interference?
Title: Re: Hearing aids
Post by: connie_rider on May 26, 2018, 10:04:48 am
BDF: Glad to hear that the aide's are improving your ability to read..  :P 
          If it helps you, there is hope for all of us.. <grin>

Ride safe, Ted
Title: Re: Hearing aids
Post by: B.D.F. on May 26, 2018, 12:42:49 pm
Voices? Nope, never had any voices..... other than Kirby and Mr. Elkhoof of course, and all of you know they are both 100% real.

 :o

Brian

But are the voices in your head still coming through loud and clear or is there now electrical interference?
Title: Re: Hearing aids
Post by: B.D.F. on May 26, 2018, 12:47:05 pm
Yep, reading better / faster and have a better sense of smell too, although that is not always a positive thing.  ::)

Went to adjust the left one to a higher volume setting only to find out that they do not do that. The volume of both hearing aids changes together and cannot be separately adjusted by the user; to change that, they must be sent back to Colorado. There is no charge but it will take at least a week. So I looked at some of the other models I had previously looked at and it seems that that feature is one lost on all of the "low cost" (if you consider over a grand 'low cost') aids. In fact, it does not look like two grand will do it either, more like $1300 and up per ear for the nicer features. Oh well, at least those who choose the more expensive types did get something for the increase in cost.

Brian

BDF: Glad to hear that the aide's are improving your ability to read..  :P 
          If it helps you, there is hope for all of us.. <grin>

Ride safe, Ted
Title: Re: Hearing aids
Post by: maxtog on May 26, 2018, 07:12:18 pm
Went to adjust the left one to a higher volume setting only to find out that they do not do that. The volume of both hearing aids changes together and cannot be separately adjusted by the user; to change that, they must be sent back to Colorado. There is no charge but it will take at least a week. So I looked at some of the other models I had previously looked at and it seems that that feature is one lost on all of the "low cost" (if you consider over a grand 'low cost') aids

Did these low-cost ones not apply your custom waveform you got from the audiologist (your hearing test results graph)?   It seems even some of the cheaper ones would do that (you might not be able to do it yourself, but they might).  The custom waveform would already include the volume adjustments per ear, as well as what frequencies need boosting and how much, since each ear has a different graph.
Title: Re: Hearing aids
Post by: just gone on May 26, 2018, 08:16:49 pm
How about putting the new battery in the one that needs to be louder and moving that used battery over to the one that needs to be oem muffler loud? :o
Title: Re: Hearing aids
Post by: B.D.F. on May 26, 2018, 08:27:50 pm
Yes. These were programmed for me using my audio test results (audio-graph?). Included in the price of the more expensive types, it was $50 for the aids I have.

And yes, they may well have been programmed to conform to my hearing tests but the left ear 'seems' sluggish compared with the right ear, and the increase in hearing perception after putting them in (Easy Boys, picture a hairy, old- man's ear canal before you go off with those thoughts!) is again less with the left ear. I spoke to a tech. at the company and they can and often do adjust the relative volume of each aid (they can do that but the end- user cannot). These hearing aids also have four different programs, which I can scroll through, and when I asked the tech. which one was the custom program, he said they were all custom programmed for my ears.

Brian

Did these low-cost ones not apply your custom waveform you got from the audiologist (your hearing test results graph)?   It seems even some of the cheaper ones would do that (you might not be able to do it yourself, but they might).  The custom waveform would already include the volume adjustments per ear, as well as what frequencies need boosting and how much, since each ear has a different graph.
Title: Re: Hearing aids
Post by: B.D.F. on May 26, 2018, 08:29:22 pm
Well, good thought but these are digital devices (DSP) and so either work or do not work with power input; they do not work 'better' or louder with newer batteries as analog types <may> have in the olden' days.

Besides, both batteries are new as of Thursday night and so still 'good'.

Brian

How about putting the new battery in the one that needs to be louder and moving that used battery over to the one that needs to be oem muffler loud? :o
Title: Re: Hearing aids
Post by: B.D.F. on May 28, 2018, 04:43:32 pm
I responded to this question already but now I have a better answer.  ;) ;D

The hearing aids do NOT 'cure' my tinnitus. What they actually do is distract me from it because there are actual sounds from outside that I 'hear' (read: perceive) and so simply do not 'hear' (read: pay mental attention to) the hiss that is still there.

This is hard to articulate but if it were vision: suppose good hearing is like clear weather and you can see (hear) all the individual things out there in the world. Now tinnitus comes along and it is like the fog rolling in- even when there is nothing to see, you see something (hearing something when there is no real sound). What the hearing aids seem to be doing for me is to amplify the real things IN the fog so that they can be seen and used so you are no longer paying attention to the surrounding for. Does that make any sense at all? If I concentrate, I can still perceive the hiss in my left ear as always but when the hearings aids are in, real sounds that they provide take my attention away from the fog and lack of distinct noises and instead concentrate my conscious attention on those sounds.

To say the identical thing in a different way: with real sounds actually reaching my brain via the hearing aids, they are distracting me away from that constant, background hiss; it is still there but it no longer draws my attention toward it.

Brian

P.S. You cannot believe how loud this keyboard it! My wife has said it is irritating for years and I too have noticed this..... in the last few days. :-)

Brian, what do you mean that the Optican Ones seemed to “cure” your tinnitus?

I have mild tinnitus and it sucks.

When I ride, I wear a pair of Bose bluetooth noise cancelling earbuds.  They are incredible. They help to keep the noise down and protect my ears, albeit to a smaller degree than actual earplugs.  Plus, I can actually hear my music as opposed to my Sena, which only has average sound fidelity and does nothing for noise.
Title: Re: Hearing aids
Post by: maxtog on May 28, 2018, 05:14:59 pm
The hearing aids do NOT 'cure' my tinnitus. What they actually do is distract me from it because there are actual sounds from outside that I 'hear' (read: perceive) and so simply do not 'hear' (read: pay mental attention to) the hiss that is still there.

Unfortunately for you, me, and millions of people, there is no cure for tinnitus.

The example I like to use to explain what you are saying is imagine trying to sleep in your bedroom and hearing rather loud water dripping in the sink next to your room.  Also imagine there is no way to stop it dripping and you can't do anything about it.  That is tinnitus (in some ways).  If you have some soft music playing or the white noise of fan running, that background noise will help to mask the water dripping so you don't notice it as much, "drowning it out."  But it is still dripping and dripping, forever.

What you describe with the hearing aids makes perfect sense.  You probably have "typical" hearing loss, which is in the higher frequencies.  And that is often where the tinnitus sound is too, in the higher frequencies.  Mine is a constant tone of about 13Khz (although I don't believe I have much, if any, hearing loss).  Although other people have a mix of frequencies which sounds like a hiss.  With hearing loss in the same range, there is no external sounds you hear to help mask it as effectively.  Add hearing aids can help that at lot, because it restores more distracting and masking sounds.
Title: Re: Hearing aids
Post by: B.D.F. on May 28, 2018, 08:03:03 pm
This is what my hearing curve looks like:

(https://i.imgur.com/3iTcUZ7.jpg)

Note that the left ear is considerably worse than the right ear; this is due to shooting rifles right- handed, with my left ear toward the muzzle. Back in the olden' days when I was young, stupid and 'bullet proof' (no pun intended but what 20- 30 year old thinks of old age while doing stupid things?). Oh well, I never wore eye protection either so I guess I am lucky the range damage was only done to my ears.....

13 KHz is pretty high; I doubt I can even hear anything in that freq. range anymore. 8 KHz is the highest the hearing test went and it was more than far enough, unfortunately.

Brian

Unfortunately for you, me, and millions of people, there is no cure for tinnitus.

The example I like to use to explain what you are saying is imagine trying to sleep in your bedroom and hearing rather loud water dripping in the sink next to your room.  Also imagine there is no way to stop it dripping and you can't do anything about it.  That is tinnitus (in some ways).  If you have some soft music playing or the white noise of fan running, that background noise will help to mask the water dripping so you don't notice it as much, "drowning it out."  But it is still dripping and dripping, forever.

What you describe with the hearing aids makes perfect sense.  You probably have "typical" hearing loss, which is in the higher frequencies.  And that is often where the tinnitus sound is too, in the higher frequencies.  Mine is a constant tone of about 13Khz (although I don't believe I have much, if any, hearing loss).  Although other people have a mix of frequencies which sounds like a hiss.  With hearing loss in the same range, there is no external sounds you hear to help mask it as effectively.  Add hearing aids can help that at lot, because it restores more distracting and masking sounds.
Title: Re: Hearing aids
Post by: maxtog on May 28, 2018, 08:45:40 pm
This is what my hearing curve looks like:[...]13 KHz is pretty high; I doubt I can even hear anything in that freq. range anymore. 8 KHz is the highest the hearing test went and it was more than far enough, unfortunately.

Wow- that was the first thing I noticed, that the chart only goes up to 8Khz.  Seems odd they wouldn't test for a full range, from perhaps 20khz to 15Khz.

You do have a severe hearing loss in quite a wide range of upper frequencies.  I am amazed you could tolerate that for so long, the world would sound like... well, muffled mud.
Title: Re: Hearing aids
Post by: B.D.F. on May 28, 2018, 09:01:37 pm
Well, it is actually not 'severe' but moderate, according to all the audiologist data, including the one who gave me the test. There are two stages left- severe and profound.

My hearing curve looked like that almost 30 years ago though not quite so severe; most of the damage was done in my teens and 20's, with later years just being the 'icing on the cake'. By the time I was 35 or so, I was wearing ear protection in all noisy environments but again, it was too late, plus hearing loss is more hereditary than any other single factor. Both my mother and M-I-L suffered severe hearing loss without ever having been exposed to excessively (read: damaging) noisy environments.

The good news is that when people mumble at me, my brain makes up something that sounds similar to what the person said but is in fact much, much funnier. "Darkest Hour" becomes 'Doctor Sour', and "sheet ripper" becomes 'sheep dipper' and so forth. hijinx ensue. :-)

As to the high frequencies, while humans can hear a theoretical 20 KHz, it is of little actual import. Almost all of the intelligence of speech, for example, is carried below 5 KHz, actually well below 4 KHz, making the higher frequencies unimportant. No one tests above ~8 KHz, and no hearing aid devices report on amplification or total harmonic distortion above this level. In fact, the frequencies above 4 KHz are relatively unimportant for any circumstance.

Remember, "we all know" a Stradivarius is the finest, most bestus' violin ever made..... until an actual double- blind study is made, and then "we" (trained musicians) cannot pick out the Stradivarius even 50% of the time. :-)

There is a group who can hear far above the nominal limit of human response of 20 KHz but I think that is better left to the thread about nothing.....

Brian

Wow- that was the first thing I noticed, that the chart only goes up to 8Khz.  Seems odd they wouldn't test for a full range, from perhaps 20khz to 15Khz.

You do have a severe hearing loss in quite a wide range of upper frequencies.  I am amazed you could tolerate that for so long, the world would sound like... well, muffled mud.
Title: Re: Hearing aids
Post by: maxtog on May 28, 2018, 10:45:33 pm
That was a typo, I meant 20Hz to 15kHz
Title: Re: Hearing aids
Post by: B.D.F. on June 19, 2018, 04:34:21 pm
I finally send my Sonic 20 hearing aids back to the mfg. for a refund. In the end, I found that while they did amplify sound, they did not allow me to hear any better or understand some people any better than I did w/out them. And very loud noises were actually amplified to a painful level. So back they went.

The Opticon One H.A. that I 'test- heard' with for a weekend worked much better for me but again at $6,200, I just do not feel they improved my quality of life enough to justify it.

In the end, I can hear most things pretty well, and the things that I do not hear clearly (some video and my wife, mostly) can be compensated for; I can use closed captioning to read the more subtle words on TV, and what I hear when my wife speaks is hugely more amusing than what she really says anyway ("Let's watch Doctor Sour" is much funnier than "Let's watch Darkest Hour") so I have work- arounds in place.

Maybe at some point in the future, as my hearing deteriorates, the hearing aids will become a viable option but not at the moment.

Brian
Title: Re: Hearing aids
Post by: gPink on June 19, 2018, 07:06:47 pm
Won't be too long before you can get Medicare to pay for them will it?  ::)
Title: Re: Hearing aids
Post by: mr t on June 20, 2018, 06:00:12 am
Medicare won't pay for hearing aids.

   Tom Taylor COG#7173
Title: Re: Hearing aids
Post by: B.D.F. on June 20, 2018, 08:46:12 am
Medicare / Medicaid will not pay for hearing aids.

This year, my personal health insurance will pay $560 for each ear; this year only because I have exceeded my 'out of pocket' maximum expenditure. So essentially the hearing aids I just sent back did not cost me anything. Still, no need to spend <anyone's> money on something that did / does not work.

Brian

Won't be too long before you can get Medicare to pay for them will it?  ::)
Title: Re: Hearing aids
Post by: FTB530 on June 20, 2018, 09:34:38 am
I usually pull my hearing aids out when riding ,  I have only been wearing the right one lately because the left one seems to do nothing, but yesterday I made a short run to the dealer and I left my one hearing aid in and I believe since it has the noise canceling in my hearing aid it was actually a lot quieter than riding  without it, so today when I go to pick up the bike I’m gonna wear both of them in the helmet and see what that’s like.

I know I need some new ones so instead Of buying the Bluetooth capable ones that are over the ear I’m just going to buy in the canal HA again,the best I can get and use those from now on and see how that works.

I did use the loaner set fromOne hearing aid center here in town and they were worked pretty well,sitting in my house with the door open the little Tweety birds outside drove me crazy for a few hours because I haven’t heard that for many years. I like some of you guys I can’t get past the thought of paying $6200 for the set.
Title: Re: Hearing aids
Post by: B.D.F. on August 27, 2020, 09:40:12 am
Update Aug 2020:   Well, still no hearing aids. Still having trouble understanding people, and the masks they wear are not helping at all. The good news is that most everyone seems to be having trouble hearing people wearing masks so at least I am blending in better :-)

On the bright side, as there is no public gathering where I am, I am no longer having trouble hearing anyone in a crowded environment. There are no crowded environments. Ah Covid, the gift that keeps on giving.....   ;D
Title: Re: Hearing aids
Post by: Conrad on August 28, 2020, 07:47:14 am
Update Aug 2020:   Well, still no hearing aids. Still having trouble understanding people, and the masks they wear are not helping at all. The good news is that most everyone seems to be having trouble hearing people wearing masks so at least I am blending in better :-)

On the bright side, as there is no public gathering where I am, I am no longer having trouble hearing anyone in a crowded environment. There are no crowded environments. Ah Covid, the gift that keeps on giving.....   ;D

Weren't we told that the virus was going to "magically disappear"?
Title: Re: Hearing aids
Post by: B.D.F. on August 28, 2020, 08:42:42 am
I think that everything that can / could be said about this virus HAS been said by someone at sometime. This is supposed to be the 'information age' but it seems more like the 'disinformation age'.

OFFTOPIC: but I think we are stuck with Covid 19. The relief will come in the form of a vaccine; and of course enough people will not be immunized that we will not have herd immunity. So we will have to tag people that have been vaccinated- I am thinking a small brass disc on a neck chain..... you know, sort of like a rabies tag for dogs.

Remember, you heard it here first when some of us are wearing some kind of 'tags'.

Brian

Weren't we told that the virus was going to "magically disappear"?
Title: Re: Hearing aids
Post by: gPink on August 28, 2020, 02:37:37 pm
I think that everything that can / could be said about this virus HAS been said by someone at sometime. This is supposed to be the 'information age' but it seems more like the 'disinformation age'.

OFFTOPIC: but I think we are stuck with Covid 19. The relief will come in the form of a vaccine; and of course enough people will not be immunized that we will not have herd immunity. So we will have to tag people that have been vaccinated- I am thinking a small brass disc on a neck chain..... you know, sort of like a rabies tag for dogs.

Remember, you heard it here first when some of us are wearing some kind of 'tags'.

Brian

Title: Re: Hearing aids
Post by: B.D.F. on August 28, 2020, 02:42:34 pm
Yeah, sure, that oughta' do just fine.  ;D

Brian


Title: Re: Hearing aids
Post by: maxtog on August 28, 2020, 03:32:42 pm
LOL   :rotflmao:

Anyway... speaking of heading aids, these new noise cancelling headphones are da bomb in some ways.  A majorly violent storm moved through last night and it was deafening.  The continuous thunder and insanely loud rain on my skylights disappeared when I put them on.  I just didn't realize the technology had improved so much.  So sometimes the best aid to hearing is not to hear.

Even my dense foam earplugs simply will not block low frequencies.  But the headphones somehow do.  I wish they could counter/mask my tinnitus, too; that would be a major feat.
Title: Re: Hearing aids
Post by: Conrad on August 29, 2020, 07:13:37 am


Gotta admit, that's funny right there!     :rotflmao:
Title: Re: Hearing aids
Post by: Conrad on August 29, 2020, 07:16:02 am
LOL   :rotflmao:

Anyway... speaking of heading aids, these new noise cancelling headphones are da bomb in some ways.  A majorly violent storm moved through last night and it was deafening.  The continuous thunder and insanely loud rain on my skylights disappeared when I put them on.  I just didn't realize the technology had improved so much.  So sometimes the best aid to hearing is not to hear.

Even my dense foam earplugs simply will not block low frequencies.  But the headphones somehow do.  I wish they could counter/mask my tinnitus, too; that would be a major feat.

I told ya they were awesome!