Kawasaki Concours Forum

Mish mash => Open Forum => Topic started by: Chrome Megaphone on August 18, 2020, 12:45:21 pm

Title: Bikes are TOO COMPLEX TODAY RANT
Post by: Chrome Megaphone on August 18, 2020, 12:45:21 pm
Just my opinion.
See, back in the day there was the Universal Japanese Motorcycle.  Four cylinders, standard riding position.  No ABS, no heated nothing, no nav system, nothing but a powerful bike to get you to work, pleasure ride, or whatever.  If you wanted to take a long trip you just bolt on plexiglass screen and tank/saddle bags and off you went.  You planned the trip on something called a map that you put in the tank bag.  Need I say no one bothered you on the cell phone?  I just cannot understand having something that is jammed up with electronics and ####.
Title: Re: Bikes are TOO COMPLEX TODAY RANT
Post by: maxtog on August 18, 2020, 03:16:43 pm
Well, I like all the fancy **#*$@**   :)

It is great to be on something fast, smooth, comfortable, confident, and reliable.  It is true there is more accessory stuff to break, but I would NEVER go back to carburetoration, for example.  EFI- starts every time, no fuss no muss.  ABS is a *great* safety feature, I will never have a bike without it now.  Love riding listening to music I can easily control.

Sure, there is something "neat" about a low-tech/old bike.  And it might even be fun to ride one once in a while.  But gimme modern for any regular riding.  I am even looking forward to electric (once they get the range issues worked out)- super fast/smooth, quiet, and even more reliable.  I think I would miss having a transmission, though.
Title: Re: Bikes are TOO COMPLEX TODAY RANT
Post by: Chrome Megaphone on August 18, 2020, 05:26:49 pm
 Carburetors start every time if you start and refuel more than once a week.  No, month.
Title: Re: Bikes are TOO COMPLEX TODAY RANT
Post by: DC Concours on August 18, 2020, 05:40:06 pm
Nostalgia. I miss the days of simplicity but some of the fancy stuff is nice to have. EFI is more complex but rarely fails and do not have the issues carbs do. So, some of these fancy stuff is nice to have. In 40 years the fancy of today will be the nostalgia of their yesteryears.

Title: Re: Bikes are TOO COMPLEX TODAY RANT
Post by: gPink on August 18, 2020, 06:38:45 pm
push button start

disc brakes

fuel injection

suspension

tires

lighting

etc...etc...

Nostalgia is so 20th century.  8)
Title: Re: Bikes are TOO COMPLEX TODAY RANT
Post by: VirginiaJim on August 18, 2020, 07:08:20 pm
Personally, I like ABS, cruise control, gps, and electric windshields...  I still carry a paper map though.
Title: Re: Bikes are TOO COMPLEX TODAY RANT
Post by: George R. Young on August 18, 2020, 07:56:23 pm
One of my bikes had points and condenser, and a centrifugally actuated advance mechanism, hung on the end of the SOHC cam. I thought it was ok at the time, but I wouldn't want to go back to that.

Much prefer the electronic ignition and fuel injection of my current steed.
Title: Re: Bikes are TOO COMPLEX TODAY RANT
Post by: Chrome Megaphone on August 19, 2020, 12:26:07 am
One of my bikes had points and condenser, and a centrifugally actuated advance mechanism, hung on the end of the SOHC cam. I thought it was ok at the time, but I wouldn't want to go back to that.

Much prefer the electronic ignition and fuel injection of my current steed.
I didn't mention EFI or electronic ignition in the opening post.  While more complex in terms of design those actually simplify ownership and enhance the riding experience by removing distractions   Imagine a SOHC Honda CB with that, it would be a better example of the same bike.  What turns me off is the accessories and rider aids that began with the Gold Wing dressers.  Sheesh the C14 is literally a Gold Wing mated with a BMW.
Title: Re: Bikes are TOO COMPLEX TODAY RANT
Post by: Boomer on August 19, 2020, 03:08:13 am
Then I guess you shouldn't buy a C14 then. Nobody is forcing you to buy anything.  ::)
If you want a "like new" Z1A or CB750K1 then I guess you need to get you a shed-load of cash.

I have a 1989 C10 that I like,... and a 2007 C14 that I also like.
I like them for very different reasons.

I have owned a variety of bikes dating from the 60's to 2007 and while they all had their own unique charm, about the only one I would like to once again own, is a 1984 Z1300/6. Yes, that's the one with DFI. :-)
I owned a CB750F2 and it was without doubt the most boring motorcycle I have ever owned.
It was adequate at most things but excelled at nothing, and never excited me in any way.
After 2 months and nearly 10000 miles I chopped it in on the Z1300/6 which despite having from awful fuel economy, awful rear tyre consumption and difficult handling, was an absolute hoot to ride.

The 1977 XS500 was fun but unreliable, the 1981 GS550E was under-powered and overweight and unreliable, and the 1961 GoldStar 500 was gutless, had awful brakes, and was horrendously unreliable.

Motorcycles, like many other things in life, have improved massively since I started riding.
They have their faults but overall they are safer, faster, and WAY more reliable.
Title: Re: Bikes are TOO COMPLEX TODAY RANT
Post by: Chrome Megaphone on August 19, 2020, 08:24:27 am
Always loved motorcycle magazine criticisms
Cycle World on the new 1978 Honda CX500, the engine
"looks like an air compressor" lol
https://www.motorcycleclassics.com/classic-japanese-motorcycles/honda-cx500 (https://www.motorcycleclassics.com/classic-japanese-motorcycles/honda-cx500)
Title: Re: Bikes are TOO COMPLEX TODAY RANT
Post by: maxtog on August 19, 2020, 09:02:24 am
"looks like an air compressor" lol

It really does look like an air compressor.
Title: Re: Bikes are TOO COMPLEX TODAY RANT
Post by: VirginiaJim on August 19, 2020, 10:24:34 am
I had a Silver Wing (81) as my first bike that used that engine.  There were two, 500 and 650 CC.
Title: Re: Bikes are TOO COMPLEX TODAY RANT
Post by: Chrome Megaphone on August 19, 2020, 10:33:40 am
I had a Silver Wing (81) as my first bike that used that engine.  There were two, 500 and 650 CC.
Ideal (and nice) first bike.  When the sport 600s came out guys were buying those and busting themselves and the bikes up.
This was my first bike, the CB750A. Sublime the way it just went from a stop.  Wish I kept it, was embarrassed to be seen on it at the time.
Title: Re: Bikes are TOO COMPLEX TODAY RANT
Post by: VirginiaJim on August 19, 2020, 10:43:44 am
My brother loved his 750.
Title: Re: Bikes are TOO COMPLEX TODAY RANT
Post by: Chrome Megaphone on August 19, 2020, 11:13:30 am
My brother loved his 750.
I really loved my DOHC 750F.  My first tuned bike with a beautiful chrome Vance & Hines 4-1 exhaust, black & chrome foam pod filters, Dynojet needles, jets, drilled slides, cafe fairing, fork brace, painted British Racing Green.  Learned to ride fast and slide the rear with amatuer road racers in the Texas Hill Country (and Twist Of The Wrist Vol 2).  It would roll past a stock 750 Interceptor and make music through those pipes.
Title: Re: Bikes are TOO COMPLEX TODAY RANT
Post by: just gone on August 19, 2020, 12:17:57 pm
Despite the older skew of this group, Chrome M' I'm afraid your search for commiseration or kindred spirits here maybe fruitless. I have two mid seventies
motorcycles and both have been upgraded to electronic ignition and if it was easy they'd both have fuel injection as well. I'm sure they'd both run better with the mighty powah of
KIPASS
, but alas Brian (aka BDF) hasn't come out with his universal KIPASS system yet.
Title: Re: Bikes are TOO COMPLEX TODAY RANT
Post by: Cholla on August 28, 2020, 11:43:35 am
Both my bikes have fairings and hard bags. Both have carbs-infinately tunable. Never a problem.
They both have points. One OEM, the other converted after the OEM electronic system went Tango Uniform in 4k miles.
Brakes? Triple Brembos.
GPS? Yes, they have Gluteus Positioning Systems.
Only problem I have is I can't get either to run on more than two cylinders.
Title: Re: Bikes are TOO COMPLEX TODAY RANT
Post by: B.D.F. on August 28, 2020, 02:15:26 pm
Whatever an individual or even a group of people may want, motorcycles continue to become more modernized as the years go by. KiPass is not unique to the C-14 (well that specific name is but not the basic type of system), and carburetors and points ain't comin' back ever. In some ways this does make them more complex but the trade- off is greatly increased reliability and less service, especially 'it will not start' type of service and worst of all 'it stranded me' service. And yes, things such as KiPass and all the other electronics do bring with them the possibility of new, modern type failures, the older cruder forms of machine were far less reliable overall.

While Marty is right in that this is generally an older group of people I think the great majority of us can be honest enough to realize that most changes over, say, the last four decades have resulted in better machines. Personally, I do not miss wiping out distributor caps when they got wet and would not run.  ::)

Brian

Despite the older skew of this group, Chrome M' I'm afraid your search for commiseration or kindred spirits here maybe fruitless. I have two mid seventies
motorcycles and both have been upgraded to electronic ignition and if it was easy they'd both have fuel injection as well. I'm sure they'd both run better with the mighty powah of
KIPASS
, but alas Brian (aka BDF) hasn't come out with his universal KIPASS system yet.
Title: Re: Bikes are TOO COMPLEX TODAY RANT
Post by: Chrome Megaphone on August 28, 2020, 02:24:31 pm
Perhaps rereading the opening post is needed.
Nowhere are digital ignition and EFI criticized.
Title: Re: Bikes are TOO COMPLEX TODAY RANT
Post by: B.D.F. on August 28, 2020, 02:27:43 pm
I think those two things are at the top of the list making modern motorcycles more complex.

Brian

Perhaps rereading the opening post is needed.
Nowhere are digital ignition and EFI criticized.
Title: Re: Bikes are TOO COMPLEX TODAY RANT
Post by: just gone on August 29, 2020, 12:09:37 pm
  I just cannot understand having something that is jammed up with electronics and ####.

Perhaps rereading the opening post is needed.
Nowhere are digital ignition and EFI criticized.

Well excuse the f##k outta me for not knowing exactly what you meant by ..."...jammed up with electronics and ####". :censored: :facepalm:
Title: Re: Bikes are TOO COMPLEX TODAY RANT
Post by: VirginiaJim on August 29, 2020, 02:50:00 pm
Excellent usage of the face palm smiley!
Title: Re: Bikes are TOO COMPLEX TODAY RANT
Post by: B.D.F. on August 29, 2020, 03:27:02 pm
Yeah, that is what I thought too but clearly, I was mistaken.  :rotflmao: :rotflmao:

I tells' ya', the Covid is making some peoples a little..... 'iffy'. :-)

Well excuse the f##k outta me for not knowing exactly what you meant by ..."...jammed up with electronics and ####". :censored: :facepalm:
Title: Re: Bikes are TOO COMPLEX TODAY RANT
Post by: B.D.F. on August 29, 2020, 03:27:57 pm
Nothing smiley about it- it means, more or less, I cannot believe (whatever it is used with regards too).

Excellent usage of the face palm smiley!
Title: Re: Bikes are TOO COMPLEX TODAY RANT
Post by: VirginiaJim on August 30, 2020, 05:04:50 am
It's a smiley if I say it's a smiley....LOL.
Title: Re: Bikes are TOO COMPLEX TODAY RANT
Post by: Nosmo on September 04, 2020, 11:20:30 am
If you don't want complex technology, don't watch this video.  The next step is to eliminate the rider altogether, and just let the vehicles go out on their own, do what they want without us even being involved.  We'll just buy them, and set them loose on their own.

https://duckduckgo.com/?t=ffab&q=self-balancing+BMW+motorcycle&pn=1&iax=videos&ia=videos&iai=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fwatch%3Fv%3D0W8p9Pc7VUQ (https://duckduckgo.com/?t=ffab&q=self-balancing+BMW+motorcycle&pn=1&iax=videos&ia=videos&iai=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fwatch%3Fv%3D0W8p9Pc7VUQ)

Not sure if the "rider" shown is organic or robotic.