Kawasaki Concours Forum

The C10, aka Kawasaki Concours - The Original => The Bike - C10 => Topic started by: amigoride on July 17, 2011, 09:33:37 pm

Title: Pitted cams.... what's that about?
Post by: amigoride on July 17, 2011, 09:33:37 pm
So one of my cams has some pitting on the surface. Not too bad yet but I assume it will deteriorate by the next valve adjustment.
What's a fair price to pay for resurfacing?
21,000 miles and runs like a watch. Next task is identifying my next pair of tires. My Pilot GT's are starting to look like it's time to order a new set.

Thanks for the input. 
Title: Re: Pitted cams.... what's that about?
Post by: cmoore on July 18, 2011, 03:57:42 am
Hey Amigoride, my cams look like 10 miles of bad road. They have been like that since I got the bike 7 years ago. The motor runs like a top so I don't mess with 'em. Lot's of riders on this forum have pitted cams. I think the general consensus is to leave them alone as long as the bike is running well. I know it is a little unnerving to see those pits in there though. BTW, I have 61000 on my ODO.
Title: Re: Pitted cams.... what's that about?
Post by: 2fast on July 18, 2011, 05:48:04 am
The pitting doesnt bother me as much as wondering where all the metal particles have gone. :o

When I do replace mine, I will be getting SISF's reground, resurfaced set for a little more low end grunt.

https://sites.google.com/site/shoodabenengineering/replacement-torque-cams (https://sites.google.com/site/shoodabenengineering/replacement-torque-cams)
Title: Re: Pitted cams.... what's that about?
Post by: Summit670 on July 18, 2011, 06:51:20 am
I had some pitting since about day 1 on my 87.  It wasn't bad and I just monitor during each valve adjust.  71k now.

Question - I've heard a lot about regrinding cams - is material added to the cam by welding, and then reground?

If no material added then help me understand how that would not affect top end performance.

Thanks.
Title: Re: Pitted cams.... what's that about?
Post by: SteveJ. on July 18, 2011, 03:39:36 pm
The pitting doesnt bother me as much as wondering where all the metal particles have gone. :o

When I do replace mine, I will be getting SISF's reground, resurfaced set for a little more low end grunt.

https://sites.google.com/site/shoodabenengineering/replacement-torque-cams (https://sites.google.com/site/shoodabenengineering/replacement-torque-cams)
Yer gonna like 'em.


Question - I've heard a lot about regrinding cams - is material added to the cam by welding, and then reground?

Quote
If no material added then help me understand how that would not affect top end performance.
You will loose a coupla ponies above 9500 rpm, but gain some torque in the lo-mid range. If you are someone that spends most of their riding time above 8,000 rpm, the Torque grind would not be for you. Get yourself some old Ninja cams, they suck in low-mid range, and scream at the upper.

Now if you're like most on here, myself included, you would be after "driveability" in the lo-mid range(say 3500-7500rpm), where we spend about 99% of our time. This is where SiSF's new cam profile really shines. Combined with a modified 2 minute mod, and a simple tweak of the intake cam timing, it really doesn't/can't get any better, for riding that most folks do 99% of the time. Throttle response is much improved, cylinder pressures get kicked up. It's all good, and it all works.

To reemphasize, these cams will generally not give you a faster top end, but you will be a lot happier with how the bike runs in total, have a fresh set of cams, and the lower cam profile is easier on the valve train.

Summing up: I like mine!

SiSF to the white courtesy phone, please.
Title: Re: Pitted cams.... what's that about?
Post by: T Cro ® on July 18, 2011, 04:23:38 pm
So one of my cams has some pitting on the surface. Not too bad yet but I assume it will deteriorate by the next valve adjustment.
What's a fair price to pay for resurfacing?
21,000 miles and runs like a watch. Next task is identifying my next pair of tires. My Pilot GT's are starting to look like it's time to order a new set.

Thanks for the input.

Close her up and ride..... I'd worry more about the color of my underware than pitted cams!
Title: Re: Pitted cams.... what's that about?
Post by: Nosmo on July 18, 2011, 07:33:32 pm
Close her up and ride..... I'd worry more about the color of my underware than pitted cams!

With two motorcycles, I can't afford underwear. :-[

But I do have nicely pitted cams.  :'(
Title: Re: Pitted cams.... what's that about?
Post by: T Cro ® on July 18, 2011, 08:06:08 pm
With two motorcycles, I can't afford underwear. :-[

But I do have nicely pitted cams.  :'(

And how are your gams?  ;)
Title: Re: Pitted cams.... what's that about?
Post by: Steve in Sunny Fla on July 18, 2011, 08:07:03 pm

But I do have nicely pitted cams.  :'(

  I think you're in the majority! My own zg cams had under 30,000 miles on them, perfectly maintained, and all pitted. I really don't think pitting has anything to do with oil, I suspect it's due to some cams being improperly hardened, and "spider-webbing". When the cracks converge, a little piece pops out. My grinder thinks that's the deal also. Steve
Title: Re: Pitted cams.... what's that about?
Post by: Nosmo on July 18, 2011, 08:11:11 pm
And how are your gams?  ;)

Sadly, much worse than my cams.   :(
Title: Re: Pitted cams.... what's that about?
Post by: Equito on July 19, 2011, 09:34:45 am
  I think you're in the majority! My own zg cams had under 30,000 miles on them, perfectly maintained, and all pitted. I really don't think pitting has anything to do with oil, I suspect it's due to some cams being improperly hardened, and "spider-webbing". When the cracks converge, a little piece pops out. My grinder thinks that's the deal also. Steve

Steve, are your re-ground cams as likely to pit and, if not, why not?
Title: Re: Pitted cams.... what's that about?
Post by: Steve in Sunny Fla on July 19, 2011, 11:58:58 am
According to the grinder, no. They are parkerized, but not hardened. Most older cams are not hardened, and as long as proper oil is used, they generally last a long time.
   The other thing to consider is the price - 275.00 shipped to you. You cannot send your own cams off for a stock regrind for that little - and these have a better profile, so it's a win - win IMO. Steve
Title: Re: Pitted cams.... what's that about?
Post by: Equito on July 19, 2011, 02:53:53 pm
According to the grinder, no. They are parkerized, but not hardened. Most older cams are not hardened, and as long as proper oil is used, they generally last a long time.
   The other thing to consider is the price - 275.00 shipped to you. You cannot send your own cams off for a stock regrind for that little - and these have a better profile, so it's a win - win IMO. Steve

Roger, that.  I know hardening and stock grind runs about $700, so I hear you on price.  I know you had mentioned during your planning phase how the lobe faces might  be treated, but didn't recall seeing that parkerizing was the final call.  I've got my spare stock cores to send, but it's the $275 that's scarce just now!
Title: Re: Pitted cams.... what's that about?
Post by: Steve in Sunny Fla on July 19, 2011, 05:48:57 pm
I have 5 sets at the grinder now, 2 sets are already spoken for - Steve