Kawasaki Concours Forum

Concours 1400 (C14) FAQ => C-14, aka Concours-14 GTR 1400 => Cooling => Topic started by: tyler1015 on June 16, 2011, 10:01:32 am

Title: Radiator fluid change
Post by: tyler1015 on June 16, 2011, 10:01:32 am
I know on the last board this was mentioned. Couldn't find anything on a search here. I am having my bottom fairings painted so I have to take apart just about everything to do it. I figured I would go ahead and change out the radiator fluid while I was doing it. Any tips?
Title: Re: Radiator fluid change
Post by: Tactical_Mik on June 16, 2011, 12:07:00 pm
don't do it inside.  The fluid comes out with suprising gusto.
Title: Re: Radiator fluid change
Post by: c14addict on June 16, 2011, 12:12:13 pm
Yes, there were several postings on this on the old system. There is debate on the actual coolant, and I ended up using the 50/50 mix from an auto parts store.  It did say low phosphates, and I did not feel like finding deionized/distilled water, and mixing it first.  I have done it twice, have 61K on my Connie, and no leaks, so I must have one possible way to do it.

The one thing to remember is, when that little drain screw is opened at the bottom, be prepared! :o  It does not dribble out, it launches horizontal until it empties.  I thought I was prepared. IIRC you are supposed to open the cap first. Even when open, figured there was no pressure.  WRONG.  It is just gravity, right?  But with the small drain hole, physics is deceiving.

When drained, close the drain plug, and all hoses, then re-fill radiator.  Fill up the plastic tank on the side to just the low point line.  Keep the radiator cap off and run it for a bit to circulate, but don't let it get too hot.  You should see bubbles on the surface of the fluid, and some fluid may spill out. Fill up if needed. Close the cap.
Now all fill adjustment is at the plastic reservior.  Run the bike for a while to get it nice-n-hot until the fans turn on.
Check the level in the plastic tank and fill if needed.
One thing that was odd about mine was that the plastic tank actually lowered a little when hot, but I thought it would do just the opposite.
Take a look at section 2-50 of the service manual.

Good Luck.
Title: Re: Radiator fluid change
Post by: jonathan on June 16, 2011, 03:30:09 pm
When I did mine nothing came out of the drain hole until I loosened the radiator cap. So, if you position the pan, remove the plug and then loosen the cap the results are less messy.
Title: Re: Radiator fluid change
Post by: ZedHed on June 16, 2011, 03:41:22 pm
OK, fellas here we go again -- Japanese coolant contains NO silicates but has phosphates.  It is an HOAT antifreeze.  All Makes All Models antifreeze from the auto parts store is just an OAT coolant and has NO silicates or phosphates and contains a Organic Acid called 2-EHA which is the OAT used in Dexcool.  This is a very problematic OAT chemical and I would NEVER use that crap in my C14.

I use Honda or Kawasaki pre-mix coolant as they are identical and the Honda is cheaper.  You can probably use Honda or Mazda auto coolant too.  You could also use Xerex Asian formula coolant except it is pink like Toyota coolant and would make the green OEM coolant look kinda brown.  I wouldn't do this unless I could flush every bit of the OEM Kawasaki coolant first.

As a last resort you could use Traditional North American Green coolant except it is not considered a Long-Life coolant and needs to be changed every 2-3 years and contains mega silicates and phosphates and again flush all the old OEM coolant first.

Silicates and phosphate provide immediate corrosion protection and the OAT provides long-term corrosion protection so OAT coolants with either silicates or phosphates are considered HOAT coolants (hybrid organic acid technology)
Title: Re: Radiator fluid change
Post by: lather on June 16, 2011, 04:05:23 pm
I posted elsewher about switching to water wetter. If you buy the concentrate which I did you mix with distilled water at 1 OZ to a quart of HO2. The resulting color is a light pink. I drianed my old coolant but did not flush and agter everthing got all mixed up the color is still greenish. So I concluded that with a simple drain per manual instructions there is still a pinto or 2 of old coolant in there. Redline says water wetter is compatible with everything else and actually advises to use at least 15% anti-freeze for streetbike applications (I wish I knew why but they don't say) Anyway what I had in before I drained was HOnda pre-mix so I should be good.

Next time I will do a full flush with  a couple bottles of Distilled untill it drains out clear just so I will know exactly what I have in there.
Title: Re: Radiator fluid change
Post by: gildaguz on June 16, 2011, 04:11:00 pm
What about one of those two products
http://www.redlineoil.com/product.aspx?pid=74&pcid=10 (http://www.redlineoil.com/product.aspx?pid=74&pcid=10)
http://www.locox.com/Coolant-Engine-Ice.html?sc=10&category=9775 (http://www.locox.com/Coolant-Engine-Ice.html?sc=10&category=9775)
Title: Re: Radiator fluid change
Post by: lather on June 16, 2011, 04:53:47 pm
What about one of those two products
[url]http://www.redlineoil.com/product.aspx?pid=74&pcid=10[/url] ([url]http://www.redlineoil.com/product.aspx?pid=74&pcid=10[/url])
[url]http://www.locox.com/Coolant-Engine-Ice.html?sc=10&category=9775[/url] ([url]http://www.locox.com/Coolant-Engine-Ice.html?sc=10&category=9775[/url])

The first link is what I was talking about.
Title: Re: Radiator fluid change
Post by: jonathan on June 17, 2011, 08:44:29 am
OK, fellas here we go again -- Japanese coolant contains NO silicates but has phosphates.  It is an HOAT antifreeze.  All Makes All Models antifreeze from the auto parts store is just an OAT coolant and has NO silicates or phosphates and contains a Organic Acid called 2-EHA which is the OAT used in Dexcool.  This is a very problematic OAT chemical and I would NEVER use that crap in my C14.

Why? Surely it makes no difference as aluminum and cast iron are pretty much the same the world over.
Title: Re: Radiator fluid change
Post by: ZedHed on June 17, 2011, 12:56:56 pm
Why? Surely it makes no difference as aluminum and cast iron are pretty much the same the world over.

Jonathan -- 2-EHA has been proven to turn to sludge in the presence of cast iron and air.  Any system that uses this organic acid MUST be specifically designed for it.  It also has been proven to attack certain nylon and plastic gaskets specifically head gaskets.  Do a little research and you'll find many articles related to Dexcool problems and it's clones like Prestone All Makes and Models.  If you don't care about your own bike, just don't encourage other less experienced riders to use it.
Title: Re: Radiator fluid change
Post by: speed545 on June 17, 2011, 03:17:43 pm
as for draining the coolant, i placed an 1 inch tube redirecting the fluid  toward a pan in front of the drain plug and slowly unscrewed it. no mess at all.

I used Motul Motocool
Title: Re: Radiator fluid change
Post by: jsd on June 17, 2011, 05:04:48 pm
Wondering about engine ice coolant? Does anyone use it?
Title: Re: Radiator fluid change
Post by: Freddy on June 19, 2011, 04:28:41 am
How timely - I'm working myself up to do the valve check/adjust over winter here in OZ and was pondering what coolant to use.  From preceeding comments, I'll be going with Honda M/cycle coolant.  Thanks for the input.
Title: Re: Radiator fluid change
Post by: jonathan on June 20, 2011, 09:08:44 am
Jonathan -- 2-EHA has been proven to turn to sludge in the presence of cast iron and air.  Any system that uses this organic acid MUST be specifically designed for it.  It also has been proven to attack certain nylon and plastic gaskets specifically head gaskets.  Do a little research and you'll find many articles related to Dexcool problems and it's clones like Prestone All Makes and Models.  If you don't care about your own bike, just don't encourage other less experienced riders to use it.

I'm not arguing the point, I was just unaware of this before. This is one of those situations where you don't even know enough to ask a question. What antifreeze would you recommend?
Title: Re: Radiator fluid change
Post by: ZedHed on June 20, 2011, 12:35:33 pm
I posted earlier that I would use Honda or Kawasaki pre-mix coolant as they are identical.  The Mazda FL-22 (Ford too) coolant or Honda automotive Green coolant is also near identical.  Suzuki/Yamaha coolant is a slightly different formulation although still green in color.  The Kaw/Honda coolant is a dark green color and the Suz/Yam coolant is bright green.  If you just insist on using over-the-counter automotive coolant -- then use the old traditional North American Green coolant,  but flush your system completely first.  That's the trick -- how do you get all the old coolant out?  Very carefully !!

Best scenario?  Just drain the C-14 coolant system every 3-4 years and refill with Kaw/Honda pre-mix coolant.  No flushing, no guessing, no doubts or worries.

If you don't mind using a different color coolant, then Zerex makes an Asian formula coolant that is bright pink in color. (flush completely first)

Whatever you do, DO NOT use Dexcool or any dex-clones (Prestone All Makes-All Models, etc.)

Remember, Asian coolant is an HOAT coolant that contains phosphates, Europeans (and Chrysler) use an HOAT that contains silicates (G-O5, G-12, etc) and most American cars now use Dexcool which is just an OAT coolant having no silicates or phosphates and contains the "kiss-of-death" organic acid called 2-EHA.  Systems that use Dexcool MUST have gaskets and seals specifically designed for 2-EHA.  Big no-no for a C-14....

Title: Re: Radiator fluid change
Post by: khager01 on February 05, 2019, 12:01:58 pm
There's a reason they call it DEATHCOOL!  I worked at a GM dealer in the late 90's and seen the results 1st hand.  Just google GM Dexcool history.