Kawasaki Concours Forum

The C-14, aka Kawasaki Concours-14, the new one :) => Accessories and modifications - C14/GTR 1400 => Topic started by: SmokinRZ on August 09, 2018, 05:57:59 am

Title: Gas Cap Key
Post by: SmokinRZ on August 09, 2018, 05:57:59 am
Hello, I am about to take a week long trip and would rather not fumble with the key in the FOB and would like to keep a key in the glove box of my 08.  Will I have problems finding a key blank at my locksmith or having the key cut from the FOB key?  Thanks
Title: Re: Gas Cap Key
Post by: fartymarty on August 09, 2018, 10:44:09 am
Will I have problems finding a key blank at my locksmith or having the key cut from the FOB key?  Thanks

I don't think so, I didn't for the gas cap and saddle bags. However most key blanks that match the key profile will have too large of a head to also be used in the stove knob section. If you also want to have a backup for that as well be sure to get out a grinder and test fit the spare key in the stove knob area before you leave on a trip. It was more difficult for me to find a blank for the GIVI top case than for the C14.

There are two different keys used (A & B) so a blank that might work for one C14 may not work for 50% of the rest of them.
You might want to start the locksmith off with one of the below blanks.
 Ilco KW14; Ilco KW14R; Ilco X254 ; Ilco X255; Ilco X258; Ilco X259

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=3&ved=2ahUKEwjH4fGht-DcAhUOYK0KHeokDaYQFjACegQICBAC&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ilco.us%2Fmedia%2F770046%2Fv4%2FFile%2Fmotorcycle-key-blank-reference.pdf&usg=AOvVaw3OsvUX1406DKX-k2ExG2UE (https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=3&ved=2ahUKEwjH4fGht-DcAhUOYK0KHeokDaYQFjACegQICBAC&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ilco.us%2Fmedia%2F770046%2Fv4%2FFile%2Fmotorcycle-key-blank-reference.pdf&usg=AOvVaw3OsvUX1406DKX-k2ExG2UE)
Title: Re: Gas Cap Key
Post by: connie_rider on August 09, 2018, 02:47:02 pm
I went to a locksmith and had some made.
Not a problem.

Ted
Title: Re: Gas Cap Key
Post by: maxtog on August 09, 2018, 03:23:52 pm
I went to a locksmith and had some made.
Not a problem.

Same here.  The resulting key was too big (huge head, sticks way out of the locks too), but works fine.
Title: Re: Gas Cap Key
Post by: kzz1king on August 09, 2018, 07:50:21 pm
I had a couple made and cut the heads down and epoxied them in oil cap Lids. I leave  mine in my saddlebags all the time. If I feel I need to secure things were closely I just drop them in the cubby. It's real Handy to reach for one when I fill up for gas.
Title: Re: Gas Cap Key
Post by: connie_rider on August 10, 2018, 08:47:00 am
The key I initially bought from the locksmith was also long like the one that maxtog has.
I went back to the locksmith and he found a shorter blank to use. Works perfectly.

I did the same as kzz1king, but used Radio knobs instead of oil caps.
I suspect we both built them so that they barely stick out of the top of the bags.
Not noticeable at all. I tell folks mine are knobs to adjust the stereo.
        {Surprisingly, most believe me).  :o

I use a leather key case that I put my Fob, lock keys, spare trunk keys, and keys for the gas tank in.
Very handy..
NOTE: I'm always concerned I'll loose my FOB, so In the key case I have a dog tag with a note saying "If found, call ###-#### for $100 reward".

Ride safe, Ted
Title: Re: Gas Cap Key
Post by: VirginiaJim on August 10, 2018, 02:46:42 pm
Not a bad idea, Ted.  Although, with me if you found my fob it would have my pants attached to them.
Title: Re: Gas Cap Key
Post by: gPink on August 10, 2018, 05:37:52 pm
caught in the zipper?
Title: Re: Gas Cap Key
Post by: tweeter55 on August 10, 2018, 05:57:19 pm
caught in the zipper?
First time I've heard it called that. :rotflmao:
Title: Re: Gas Cap Key
Post by: katata1100 on August 11, 2018, 09:49:59 am
Local locksmith has blanks that will work, just with different top. I have one from dealer, drilled a hole in it to attach Del Sol ( changes color with sunlight ) key chain.
I keep that in the gas cap on long trips, along with a cc in the glove box.
Title: Re: Gas Cap Key
Post by: SmokinRZ on August 11, 2018, 01:26:40 pm
Thank you for the responses.  I used to carry a spare key zip tied under the side cover of my C10.  I get thousands of miles from home and worry about things like that .  I might do that with a Ford F-150 key since my 08 didn't come with a passive key, just two active FOBs.         
Title: Re: Gas Cap Key
Post by: fartymarty on August 11, 2018, 02:04:53 pm
  I might do that with a Ford F-150 key since my 08 didn't come with a passive key, just two active FOBs.         

I know I'm going to be guilty of --->  :deadhorse: :deadhorse: :deadhorse:

..but because there is so much confusion and mis-information around, I will take this opportunity to once again point out what most of you already know....
..that is that both of those active FOBs are passive FOBs as well....I know I know..you already know this..but down the road someone that doesn't will stumble across this thread
about keys and go "HUH? I didn't know that."  So this is a just a in case post.
Title: Re: Gas Cap Key
Post by: SmokinRZ on August 11, 2018, 05:15:43 pm
I know I'm going to be guilty of --->  :deadhorse: :deadhorse: :deadhorse:

..but because there is so much confusion and mis-information around, I will take this opportunity to once again point out what most of you already know....
..that is that both of those active FOBs are passive FOBs as well....I know I know..you already know this..but down the road someone that doesn't will stumble across this thread
about keys and go "HUH? I didn't know that."  So this is a just a in case post.

I was just thinking that storing an active FOB on your bike might not be a good idea  ;D.  Even if theft was not an issue I'm not sure if it was built with the long term elements in mind. 
Title: Re: Gas Cap Key
Post by: gPink on August 11, 2018, 05:29:06 pm
I leave mine in the tank bag.
Title: Re: Gas Cap Key
Post by: fartymarty on August 11, 2018, 11:53:36 pm
I was just thinking that storing an active FOB on your bike might not be a good idea  ;D.  Even if theft was not an issue I'm not sure if it was built with the long term elements in mind. 

Understood, and I like your idea and agree with your thoughts. The way you worded it however, might confuse a newb so I was just bangin' on a horse so we don't inadvertently become a part of the
mis-information cycle.
Title: Re: Gas Cap Key
Post by: SmokinRZ on August 28, 2018, 05:44:16 pm
Update:

I took the stove key and FOB in and the locksmith at first said he didn't have the blank and that I would have to get it from Kawasaki and he would cut it.  I explained that there were no specific blanks for this application and just wanted a gas cap key.  He was bale to use the FOB key to cut me an extra key that works like a champ. 

Then I explained about wanting a spare passive FOB made from a Ford blank.  He tested my FOB and said he could do it but it was going to be $80, so I held off that.  Is that the going rate for a smart key?   
Title: Re: Gas Cap Key
Post by: maxtog on August 28, 2018, 06:27:41 pm
Then I explained about wanting a spare passive FOB made from a Ford blank.  He tested my FOB and  said he could do it but it was going to be $80, so I held off that.  Is that the going rate for a smart key?


That seems a bit high to me, based on my poor memory of what others have said they paid.  $50 seems more reasonable...

http://www.zggtr.org/index.php?topic=18252.msg248160#msg248160 (http://www.zggtr.org/index.php?topic=18252.msg248160#msg248160)
http://www.zggtr.org/index.php?topic=18252.msg258040#msg258040 (http://www.zggtr.org/index.php?topic=18252.msg258040#msg258040)

You can buy a genuine Kawasaki passive fob for around $35 online, but then you have to bring it and the bike to a dealer and pay $$$$ to have it added to the ECU.  So you do have to factor the TOTAL cost of the key.  $80 is actually not crazy when you figure a dealer is likely to charge something like $35 or more for the special-order fob + another $50 to program it + you still have to go somewhere to have the physical key cut, which is another $10 or something.

The active fob- well, that is a LOT more.
Title: Re: Gas Cap Key
Post by: MAN OF BLUES on August 30, 2018, 03:33:48 pm
Smokin' is not correct again, in his statement you can't get key blanks... should have asked before posting a fallacy.. sorry.

I just went thru this for someone wanting a new stove knob cut, so here, all the keys, and differences, and KAW p/n's for replacement blanks below, and attached picture...

27008   27008-0048   KEY-LOCK,BLANK,#A
27008A   27008-0049   KEY-LOCK,BLANK,#B

27008B   27008-0050   KEY-LOCK,BLANK,#A,MAIN SWITCH
27008C   27008-0051   KEY-LOCK,BLANK,#B,MAIN SWITCH

27008D   27008-0062   KEY-LOCK,BLANK,#A,SPARE FOB
27008E   27008-0063   KEY-LOCK,BLANK,#B,SPARE FOB

Title: Re: Gas Cap Key
Post by: SmokinRZ on September 05, 2018, 10:26:07 pm
Smokin' is not correct again, in his statement you can't get key blanks... should have asked before posting a fallacy.. sorry.

I stand corrected, I have an 08 that came with two active FOBS and the two mini keys contained in them.  I didn't think about later models that come with a passive FOB.       

My real point was, the locksmith was ready to send me on my way before I could convince him there was an aftermarket blank that would work.

Thanks for providing the part numbers MOB, it's good to know the FOB key blanks are available.           

 

   
Title: Re: Gas Cap Key
Post by: Cuda on October 01, 2018, 08:49:26 pm
Gee I've been using the ignition all these years,  what's the problem :o
Title: Re: Gas Cap Key
Post by: Y0ssarian on October 02, 2018, 04:41:17 am
Gee I've been using the ignition all these years,  what's the problem :o


Every time I see these posts I wonder the same thing:
1. Pull up to the pump
2. Turn the ignition switch to the right instead of the left
3. Without taking your hand off the key, pull it out


It takes more effort to fish a key out of a pocket or the glovebox.
Title: Re: Gas Cap Key
Post by: kzz1king on October 02, 2018, 07:53:57 am
It comes out??!!


Every time I see these posts I wonder the same thing:
1. Pull up to the pump
2. Turn the ignition switch to the right instead of the left
3. Without taking your hand off the key, pull it out


It takes more effort to fish a key out of a pocket or the glovebox.
Title: Re: Gas Cap Key
Post by: MtnRider on October 02, 2018, 08:54:56 am

Every time I see these posts I wonder the same thing:
1. Pull up to the pump
2. Turn the ignition switch to the right instead of the left
3. Without taking your hand off the key, pull it out


It takes more effort to fish a key out of a pocket or the glovebox.

This. At least as long as the gas cap lock turns freely.
Title: Re: Gas Cap Key
Post by: okrider on October 02, 2018, 08:58:55 am
Wait, so you can open the gas cap without the fob key? The stove knob has a key built in!?
Title: Re: Gas Cap Key
Post by: Cuda on October 02, 2018, 10:42:54 am
This. At least as long as the gas cap lock turns freely.

I guess your wife never gave you the lubrication talk ;)
Title: Re: Gas Cap Key
Post by: MtnRider on October 02, 2018, 12:09:41 pm
Cuda, how did you manage to get a picture of Yoda's mother???    :o  ;D
Title: Re: Gas Cap Key
Post by: maxtog on October 02, 2018, 03:04:35 pm
This. At least as long as the gas cap lock turns freely.

^  That, exactly.  I usually use the "main" key (stove knob) to open the gas tank.... except when the gas cap starts getting impossible and needs cleaning and lubrication for the one millionth time.  I don't want to damage that knob.
Title: Re: Gas Cap Key
Post by: maxtog on October 02, 2018, 03:05:10 pm
Wait, so you can open the gas cap without the fob key? The stove knob has a key built in!?

You are joking, right?
Title: Re: Gas Cap Key
Post by: MAN OF BLUES on October 02, 2018, 04:25:12 pm

Every time I see these posts I wonder the same thing:
1. Pull up to the pump
2. Turn the ignition switch to the right instead of the left
3. Without taking your hand off the key, pull it out


It takes more effort to fish a key out of a pocket or the glovebox.

seeing as I never tempt fate, and hate the thought of trying to find a "K-Rock", my stove knob has only been removed 3 times in 10 years... and only to 'test it'.

that stove knob is an expensive key, ($20+ and add shipping and time to get it) and finding a place that can actually cut a new blank one, without gooching it up first try, and repeating the order process again, is not in the cards...
By all rights, they are pretty damned fragile, I've seen quite a few people with stripped wratchet internals on them (from someone attempting to turn it without activating it), rendering them inoperative temporarily, until you drill a hole in the plastic part, and fill it with glue/JB Weld. Rotating said key to the 'remove' position becomes a tricky thing when that happens...

I also find it a bit stupid on Kaw's part, to make the key removable ONLY when turned to the right... when the LOCK position is to the left, and if you are actuating the lock, you really want to remove that key anyways, because some idiot, the same person that is the reason you are locking the forks for, will attempt to turn that key... and wreck the guts inside. then you are totally gooched...

as for the "expended effort" thing...
it takes more effort to climb off the bike, remove my helmet and gloves, un-clip my tank bag and move it, figure/decide which fuel grade I feel like getting raped over, fishing around in my Stich inner pocket for my wallet, and credit card, getting the pump going, and reversing all of those motions when finished....before I reset my trip odometer to zero again,  than it does for me to pop the extra fob out of my outer jacket pocket and remove the key and open and close the tank....

creature of habit so to speak, after doing this for 10 years, I don't break the tradition, and don't loose my FOB... I also refuse to be interrupted by people trying to talk to me at a gas pump.... that's where FOBS get misplaced.... ::) ;)

Of course, some folks don't have tank bags.
Don't press down on the tank lid, while turning the key.
Don't get off bike to fuel up.
don't remove helmet, or gloves.
Struggle to reach the nozzle and credit card slot from seated on a bike..
Find it a perfect time to make a cell phone call, or text some one.
and generally don't care if they by some happenstance spill fuel, all over themselves or their gloves.  or have to 'emergency run away' from the bike during the process...
 :rotflmao: :rotflmao:
amazingly, there are gas stations still operating here in the U.S.A., where you have to get off the bike, manually actuate the pump, and then WALK IN to pay the person at the counter... OMG... that is totally redunculous.... :yikes:

ride safe, and don't take this as seriously, most of it is just injecting humor.

peace.
Title: Re: Gas Cap Key
Post by: lather on October 02, 2018, 04:53:30 pm
I thought all of it was pretty funny :rotflmao:
Title: Re: Gas Cap Key
Post by: maxtog on October 02, 2018, 05:13:01 pm
I thought all of it was pretty funny :rotflmao:

Me too.

I will say that I never try to gas the bike while on it, and I always leave my helmet on at gas stations (too much work to remove, especially in the winter, yeesh).  Have to remove at least my right glove and do have to go into the side bag to get my credit card (unless I was planning gas first thing and put the CC in my shirt pocket, but then I still go into the bag to put it away when done.).
Title: Re: Gas Cap Key
Post by: MAN OF BLUES on October 02, 2018, 05:47:14 pm
Me too.

I will say that I never try to gas the bike while on it, and I always leave my helmet on at gas stations (too much work to remove, especially in the winter, yeesh).  Have to remove at least my right glove and do have to go into the side bag to get my credit card (unless I was planning gas first thing and put the CC in my shirt pocket, but then I still go into the bag to put it away when done.).

I've probably seen at least 6 times in the last 2 years, riders getting a high octane douche, sitting on the bike, then trying to jump off it while holding the filler nozzle... very entertaining..
I always pull both gloves off, as trying to guide the nozzel in, and remove it, without spillage every time, is futile, and I hate having nice gloves wet with gasoline.. bummer, and fishing my wallet out, and operating keys, without them is much easier.
as for the helmet thing, I've been wearing a flip up front model for 10 years, and I could just flip it up, but as I usually have to put my glasses on anyways, it's simpler to remove it.. plus, in summer, It is cooler... and a gas stop many times is just a break from riding, and removing the helmet is more comfy on a break.
I did have an instance once, with a brand new helmet, first ride with it, where someone had ruined the fuel filler nozzle/hose junction, and compromised the 'break-away' junction probably tried to drive off with it in the filler on their car... and the hose itself was split... why it wasn't spitting fuel prior, I have no idea, didn't notice it until I squeezed the nozzle, and immediately got a gasoline shower.. soaked the helmet foam, and ruined the helmet... I walked into the cashier and set the helmet on the counter, and demanded the manager pay for it... which he did, I shoulda got a new pair of boots outta that deal, because I didn't realize they were soaked also... wife wouldn't let me bring them in the house after that.. could not get them to a point where they were normal again. The rest of my clothes at that I had on went into the fire pit..
Title: Re: Gas Cap Key
Post by: okrider on October 03, 2018, 07:08:41 am
The rest of my clothes at that I had on went into the fire pit..

Was it the easiest fire you ever lit?

Also, I honestly had no idea the knob was a key until I tried pulling on it yesterday. Now I'm curious if I can use the fob key instead of the knob..
My stove knob key was already slightly bent. The gas cap is already quite hard to open. Going to take the gas cap apart and clean. If it's much better after that, I'll start using the knob. I'm afraid I'm going to lose they key getting gas one day.
Title: Re: Gas Cap Key
Post by: Rubber_Snake on October 03, 2018, 09:17:37 am
Me too.

I will say that I never try to gas the bike while on it, and I always leave my helmet on at gas stations (too much work to remove, especially in the winter, yeesh).  Have to remove at least my right glove and do have to go into the side bag to get my credit card (unless I was planning gas first thing and put the CC in my shirt pocket, but then I still go into the bag to put it away when done.).

I rarely ever get off the bike to fill it.  Maybe it comes from years of riding at “work”, but I’ve gotten so used to it, rarely do I ever spill or have any problem from it.  Plus, it ensures I get the most fuel in the tank possible.  I usually have to take of a glove off though, to fish out my debit card and maintain finer control of the filler nozzle. 

With the Kawa, I’ve always taken the stove knob out to open the gas lid.  My locking mech still functions perfectly, so I haven’t had any of the “gunking up” problems that some of you have dealt with. 

Our local Chevron now has a NFC reader so its even easier to use my phone or smart watch.  Hopefully, more stations go with those.  Very convenient. 
Title: Re: Gas Cap Key
Post by: B.D.F. on October 03, 2018, 10:28:53 am
Me too- I never get off the bike to fuel it. Never spilled any fuel either. Chain saws, firearms, nail guns, gasoline..... none are inherently dangerous but all are very unforgiving. :-)

I too use the stove knob key unless I am on a timed run; if timed, I put a fob key in the fuel cap and leave it there for the duration of the ride. With two credit cards in the left inside breast pocket of my jacket (I am right- handed), it is extremely fast to fuel and get back up to riding speed.

As far as gloves, I can fuel with gloves on (except Aerostitch triple- digit rain cover gloves, which reduce human dexterity to that of a quahog.....) but I have to take off the right glove to unzip the pocket and use the credit card.

Brian

I rarely ever get off the bike to fill it.  Maybe it comes from years of riding at “work”, but I’ve gotten so used to it, rarely do I ever spill or have any problem from it.  Plus, it ensures I get the most fuel in the tank possible.  I usually have to take of a glove off though, to fish out my debit card and maintain finer control of the filler nozzle. 

With the Kawa, I’ve always taken the stove knob out to open the gas lid.  My locking mech still functions perfectly, so I haven’t had any of the “gunking up” problems that some of you have dealt with. 

Our local Chevron now has a NFC reader so its even easier to use my phone or smart watch.  Hopefully, more stations go with those.  Very convenient.
Title: Re: Gas Cap Key
Post by: maxtog on October 03, 2018, 03:03:40 pm
Was it the easiest fire you ever lit?

LOL!  I was wondering the same thing.

Quote
Also, I honestly had no idea the knob was a key until I tried pulling on it yesterday.

:)  Ok, now you get the lecture to sit down and read your whole owner's manual!

Quote
Now I'm curious if I can use the fob key instead of the knob..

Of course.  They are all the same.  Of course, the other keys offer no weather protection, so that should be an "emergency only" type thing (at least remove it when done each time).

Quote
My stove knob key was already slightly bent.

Yep, that happens.

Quote
The gas cap is already quite hard to open. Going to take the gas cap apart and clean. If it's much better after that, I'll start using the knob.

It will be..... at least for a while.  My "while" seems to be getting shorter and shorter each time.

Quote
I'm afraid I'm going to lose they key getting gas one day.

Do the mod I outlined in the gas cap thread, then you can unlock the cap and IMMEDIATELY put the key knob back in the ignition.
Title: Re: Gas Cap Key
Post by: Cuda on October 03, 2018, 10:17:45 pm
When I was 16 I had a job at a gas station (remember when someone else pumped it for you), that qualifies me as a professional  ;)

I normally don't get off the bike,  but once I was filling up a Chevy Nova, the gas cap was behind the license plate I guess I had my legs spread  and there

must have been an air pocket because of all of a sudden gas sprayed back out on to my virgin balls, man did that burn I remember running to the john  :-[