Author Topic: Linked Brakes Fixed  (Read 47731 times)

Offline RandyN

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Linked Brakes Fixed
« on: May 06, 2013, 08:03:19 pm »
I have accomplished what I set out to do, which is to eliminate the rear link to the front and the ABS system. The first thing I tried was to plug the holes on the ABS block and replace the rear line with a straight line from Galfer, see "block plugged" photo. After a test ride of hard braking and trying to engage the ABS on the front tire, the "ABS Error!" flashed on the display. I think what happens in that situation is the computer can sense that no fluid pressure is being allowed to go out of the ABS block to the rear brakes. Next I reattached some of the rear brake lines and then put my bleeder plugs into those lines, see "hoses plugged" photo. I attached clear hoses to those bleeder fittings and flushed the lines with a vacuum pump. I'm not sure if I got all the air out or not but the brakes feel fine. 

I then test rode it again and everything works as expected. ABS on the front works perfectly. Under sudden braking at about 40mph I felt the ABS trigger and pulsate down to a stop. No more sudden braking and diving unexpectedly when applying front and rear together. The brakes feel perfect to me know. I then found some wet pavement (didn't want to ruin new tires on dry pavement) and locked up the rear several times to make sure that it wouldn't trigger an "Error" on the display. No problem. I think it is my solution.

The plugs that I used, see "bleeder plug" photo, were obtained from Galfer when I bought my rear Stainless line. The plugs needed to have a slight bevel machined into it to look like the original flare fitting to mate and seal properly, see "Flare fitting" photo. All we did was put it on a lathe and machine it with a 90 degree drill bit so that the plug had a 45 degree edge on it. It might be accomplished by putting it in a vise and using a drill bit of your own to make the concave surface. The material is chrome plated brass and I don't think it needs to be a perfect fit. It will deform to fit and seal on its own most likely. Just don't make the bevel too deep. You don't want the plug to bottom out before hitting the cone first where it will seal.

After having done it all I have realized that I could have left the original lines in place, disconnected them at the spot under the tank, plugged them as I did and bought one more flexible line like one of the ones in the photo "Hoses plugged". I would then loop it to connect the rear master cylinder to the caliper using the existing lines that were left in place but had been disconnected from the flexible ones in the photo. 
« Last Edit: May 06, 2013, 08:42:49 pm by RandyN »

Offline The Pope

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Re: Linked Brakes Fixed
« Reply #1 on: May 07, 2013, 03:49:44 am »
Thanks for all of your hard work!  :chugbeer:
The Pope
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Offline VirginiaJim

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Re: Linked Brakes Fixed
« Reply #2 on: May 07, 2013, 04:23:05 am »
Thanks for the writeup!
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Offline Cuda

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Re: Linked Brakes Fixed
« Reply #3 on: May 07, 2013, 04:45:11 am »
I'd rather stop like Fred Flintstone
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Offline jonathan

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Re: Linked Brakes Fixed
« Reply #4 on: May 07, 2013, 09:00:01 am »
Quote:  After having done it all I have realized that I could have left the original lines in place, disconnected them at the spot under the tank, plugged them as I did and bought one more flexible line like one of the ones in the photo "Hoses plugged". I would then loop it to connect the rear master cylinder to the caliper using the existing lines that were left in place but had been disconnected from the flexible ones in the photo.

I am having trouble following this explanation. Could you put it another way?

Offline alexx45

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Re: Linked Brakes Fixed
« Reply #5 on: May 07, 2013, 09:46:04 am »
Quote:  After having done it all I have realized that I could have left the original lines in place, disconnected them at the spot under the tank, plugged them as I did and bought one more flexible line like one of the ones in the photo "Hoses plugged". I would then loop it to connect the rear master cylinder to the caliper using the existing lines that were left in place but had been disconnected from the flexible ones in the photo.

I am having trouble following this explanation. Could you put it another way?
OK I thought maybe it was just me.  ???
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Offline PlaynInPeoria

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Re: Linked Brakes Fixed
« Reply #6 on: May 07, 2013, 10:31:51 am »
Help!  My brain! First off, thanks for all your efforts, especially while being sick.  I want to do this also and only have a bazillion questions, not sure if you have the answers but here goes

1) Is there a drawing of the ABS box dealio in your pictures and the lines coming out of them and what they do/where they go (in stock form)?

2) Can you make a drawing of how you did it originally so we can understand it conceptually?

3) Can you make a drawing of how you THINK you could have done it?  This question/issue appears to have confused others too, so I don't feel quite so dumb.

4) Is your ole lady free this weekend?  I figured I already asked for a ton, might as well go for the whole deal. Besides, if you draw all this up, you'll be busy anyway?

Here's the picture of the ABS module

2012 "root beer" C14 - unlinked brakes, reflash, LED headlights, Walmart orange city lights, LOUD horn, Laam seat, radar detector for ahem, reasons.
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Offline RandyN

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Re: Linked Brakes Fixed
« Reply #7 on: May 07, 2013, 12:09:37 pm »
My drawing skills suck but here you go. Instead of the fluid pressure going through the ABS block it is going through the new line in between the two existing metal lines that will now be joined under the seat. If you remove you seat and tank (about a 15 minute job for most) you will be able to understand how the lines will run. If you look at the second photo, "hoses plugged", you will see in the lower right corner a metal plate with a bunch of ground wires connected to it. Originally the flexible rubber brake lines joined with the metal lines right there and were held down by that metal plate and a piece of rubber. 

Offline PlaynInPeoria

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Re: Linked Brakes Fixed
« Reply #8 on: May 07, 2013, 12:37:22 pm »
More questions of course.

1) Your high end fancy CAD CAM drawing actually does the trick pretty good, it gets the point across and makes it WAY more clear, so thanks for that. But is the 2nd picture (modified setup) the way you actually did it? Or the way you said you discovered that it could be done?

2) I think you mentioned this but I don't understand.  You said you plugged the 2 lines that go to/from the caliper and the master cylinder AT THE ABS box but the system threw an error?  But you plugged the lines at the end of the rubber hoses and it's fine?  If I am understanding this correctly (always a risk with my limited intelligence), I can't see why adding the foot long dead end rubber lines would make a difference, as opposed to just plugging them at the ABS module?

This is AWESOME. I can't wait to tear into mine.  New tires going on, a Guhl reflash and this and I will be READY, baby.
2012 "root beer" C14 - unlinked brakes, reflash, LED headlights, Walmart orange city lights, LOUD horn, Laam seat, radar detector for ahem, reasons.
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Offline RandyN

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Re: Linked Brakes Fixed
« Reply #9 on: May 07, 2013, 12:58:29 pm »
Your right. At first I just plugged it at the block as in the photo "block plugged" that is when I got the "ABS error" flashing on display. I then put the rubber lines back in place and terminated them as in the photo "hoses plugged" and all is well. So the second photo "hoses plugged" is the way I ended up. I think the reason it works this way is that when you apply front brake, the system tries to send some pressure to the rear and if it is plugged at the block the pressure has nowhere to go. With the rubber hoses on there I'm guessing that it allows some expansion of the line and movement of the fluid and the system thinks it is applying rear brake action.

Offline northsouth

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Re: Linked Brakes Fixed
« Reply #10 on: May 08, 2013, 08:13:40 pm »
RandyN, you da' man! Thanks very much for your research and hard work. Will be copying your setup asap- Good-bye crappy linked brakes! Hello safe and fun riding!

Offline maxtog

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Re: Linked Brakes Fixed
« Reply #11 on: May 08, 2013, 08:54:17 pm »
Good-bye crappy linked brakes! Hello safe and fun riding!

I think you mean "Good-bye crappy linked brakes and also useful rear ABS"
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Offline stevewfl

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Re: Linked Brakes Fixed
« Reply #12 on: May 08, 2013, 10:20:37 pm »
I think you mean "Good-bye crappy linked brakes and also useful rear ABS"

^^^that
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Offline Kinetic1

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Re: Linked Brakes Fixed
« Reply #13 on: May 09, 2013, 03:33:45 am »
I'm with you guys, I really would rather not give up the ABS. I've learned to deal with the crappy linked brakes enough that it doesn't merrit digging into it anymore.
That being said I'm still pretty sure if you cut the blue wire it would stop the linking dealio. You may have to wire in a resistor or something so it doesn't throw a light but I still think it will work.....maybe. If I get really ambitious I will try to pull the wire out of the harness plug and see what happens.
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Offline RandyN

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Re: Linked Brakes Fixed
« Reply #14 on: May 09, 2013, 05:22:27 am »
I'm with you guys, I really would rather not give up the ABS. I've learned to deal with the crappy linked brakes enough that it doesn't merrit digging into it anymore.
That being said I'm still pretty sure if you cut the blue wire it would stop the linking dealio. You may have to wire in a resistor or something so it doesn't throw a light but I still think it will work.....maybe. If I get really ambitious I will try to pull the wire out of the harness plug and see what happens.

I'm with you on that! If someone were to figure it out the way to clip a wire and unlink the brakes I would undo my "fix". I like having ABS on the rear, but it isn't a necessity. Front wheel lockup and the crash that could result from it is one of the things that makes me slow WAY down on wet roads.