Author Topic: If this doesn't make the point, I don't know what does  (Read 16096 times)


Offline Steve in Sunny Fla

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Re: If this doesn't make the point, I don't know what does
« Reply #1 on: January 20, 2015, 11:57:31 am »

Offline Deziner

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Re: If this doesn't make the point, I don't know what does
« Reply #2 on: January 20, 2015, 12:11:29 pm »
I can't see any reason honor students in America shouldn't be required to do the same thing with an M16.
God does not subtract from a man's life the number of hours spent riding a motorcycle

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Offline Tzigane

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Re: If this doesn't make the point, I don't know what does
« Reply #3 on: January 20, 2015, 03:01:08 pm »
I'm always amazed at people's fascination for killing machinery like guns and rifles.

It's more likely to be killed by a toddler with a gun than a terrorist in the US.  :o

Why on earth would you need (or even want) to own a device that is designed for the sole purpose of making another human dead? As soon as countries allow civilians to own rifles, people die. We know this to be true:P

Does "it feels really awesome" justify that?

I'm honestly baffled, an explanation would be welcomed!
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Offline gPink

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Re: If this doesn't make the point, I don't know what does
« Reply #4 on: January 20, 2015, 03:23:24 pm »
I will not be dominated nor will I be enslaved by any other individual or government.
Thank God for good men willing to do extreme violence.

Offline Deziner

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Re: If this doesn't make the point, I don't know what does
« Reply #5 on: January 20, 2015, 03:25:29 pm »
I'm always amazed at people's fascination for killing machinery like guns and rifles.

It's more likely to be killed by a toddler with a gun than a terrorist in the US.  :o

Why on earth would you need (or even want) to own a device that is designed for the sole purpose of making another human dead? As soon as countries allow civilians to own rifles, people die. We know this to be true:P

Does "it feels really awesome" justify that?

I'm honestly baffled, an explanation would be welcomed!

It's all a perception issue. I grew up around guns and learned from childhood how to shoot and how to safely handle a firearm. Virtually everyone in my small town did. We never had accidents involving firearms. I attribute that to the fact that we learned so early.

Riding a motorcycle is something not all people can wrap their heads around, and riding is inherently dangerous. So is driving an automobile. Trust me, far more people are injured in automobile and motorcycle accidents than are by firearms.

The firearm cannot be blamed for a lack of parental supervision or for any incident, for that matter. The firearm is an inanimate object. It cannot hurt you. The problem is the person handling it. Over 300,000,000 law abiding citizens with guns here in America shot NO-ONE last year. And the year before. And the year before that. And on, and on.....

Should we "outlaw" knives because they are used to decapitate innocent people? Diesel fuel and fertilizer because it can explode? Alcohol because of the people killed by drunk drivers? How about cars because of traffic fatalities? Where does it end?
God does not subtract from a man's life the number of hours spent riding a motorcycle

2008 C14, Muzzy exhaust, PCV, heated grips, Sergeant seat, PR4 GTs, Donovan headlight mod, Ronnies highway pegs, Cox rad guard, "The Big Rack", Grip Puppies, XM, many more made by me parts to come.....

Offline Deziner

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Re: If this doesn't make the point, I don't know what does
« Reply #6 on: January 20, 2015, 03:26:56 pm »
I will not be dominated nor will I be enslaved by any other individual or government.

An armed man is a citizen, an unarmed man is a subject.
God does not subtract from a man's life the number of hours spent riding a motorcycle

2008 C14, Muzzy exhaust, PCV, heated grips, Sergeant seat, PR4 GTs, Donovan headlight mod, Ronnies highway pegs, Cox rad guard, "The Big Rack", Grip Puppies, XM, many more made by me parts to come.....

Offline Steve in Sunny Fla

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Re: If this doesn't make the point, I don't know what does
« Reply #7 on: January 20, 2015, 05:45:44 pm »
I'm always amazed at people's fascination for killing machinery like guns and rifles.

It's more likely to be killed by a toddler with a gun than a terrorist in the US.  :o

Why on earth would you need (or even want) to own a device that is designed for the sole purpose of making another human dead? As soon as countries allow civilians to own rifles, people die. We know this to be true:P

Does "it feels really awesome" justify that?

I'm honestly baffled, an explanation would be welcomed!

   1) you've made the mistake of thinking all firearms are only used offensively;
   2) People die when guns are in the hands of the gov't at a much higher rate than when in the hands of civilians.
   3) people whose gov't have guns, and the people don't are subject to the whims of their leaders at any time. Do you know anything about history? Ever seen an armed society suffer an ethnic cleansing or genocide? Ever heard of some folks like Stalin, Hitler, Polpot? Many others too. What did they have in common? guns in the hands of the gov't., not the civilians
   4) There is a truth regarding history " those who don't know history are doomed to repeat it" can you understand how that works with an armed citizenry?
 
  Steve

jirod

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Re: If this doesn't make the point, I don't know what does
« Reply #8 on: January 20, 2015, 07:42:38 pm »

It's more likely to be killed by a toddler with a gun than a terrorist in the US.  :o


That is an inaccurate statement, especially after 9/10/2001.  Besides, threats other than terrorism exist all over this world. Count those in your statistics as well. And statistically speaking, I don't know many people who would prefer to become a statistic by being defenseless in the face of danger rather than having a chance to defend themselves.


Why on earth would you need (or even want) to own a device that is designed for the sole purpose of making another human dead? As soon as countries allow civilians to own rifles, people die. We know this to be true:P



The last thing law-abiding, sane gun owners want to do is to kill another human being. Besides the sports involving fire arms, some of them Olympic sports, law-abiding gun owners see guns as a means to stay alive in a dangerous situation should it present itself, not as an instrument to kill people. Your smaller neighbors to the South, the Swiss, are armed to their teeth but their crime rate is really low. Explain that.


Does "it feels really awesome" justify that?


This statement is really offensive to me. If what you meant to say is that gun owners are trying to overcome an inadequacy, well... you are right.  UNarmed, I am totally inadequate against a criminal that breaks into my home or office with a gun. And so are you. Admit it. Because of this, I protect myself and my loved ones by owning a gun and learning how to use it for personal defense.  Your bigger neighbors to the South the French, just learned this lesson the hard way.


I'm honestly baffled, an explanation would be welcomed!

Well, we can start with this:
http://thenewstalkers.com/forum/topics/12-reasons-why-you-should-own-a-gun-and-10-you-shouldn-t
http://www.ammoland.com/2011/08/fifteen-reasons-you-should-own-a-gun/#axzz3PPyRDjzi
and more tongue-in-cheek:
http://attrition.org/security/firearms/40_gun_control.html

Tzigane, I don't mean to be disrespectful or insulting, but reading your statements I can see you have drank the Kool-Aid (American slang; it's in Wikipedia) served by the European liberals. You asked for an explanation to gun ownership and I tried to provide it.  Visit Texas some time and you will see that there are no dead people on the streets. Our hospitals have more people with the flu than people with "lead poisoning". The reasons to own guns are there for you to explore if you have an open mind.  Whether you get one or not is still your choice, though.
« Last Edit: January 20, 2015, 10:28:44 pm by jirod »

Offline jim snyder

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Re: If this doesn't make the point, I don't know what does
« Reply #9 on: January 20, 2015, 07:42:55 pm »
I'm always amazed at people's fascination for killing machinery like guns and rifles.

It's more likely to be killed by a toddler with a gun than a terrorist in the US.  :o

Why on earth would you need (or even want) to own a device that is designed for the sole purpose of making another human dead? As soon as countries allow civilians to own rifles, people die. We know this to be true:P

Does "it feels really awesome" justify that?

I'm honestly baffled, an explanation would be welcomed!

Dear T,
   As someone who has been in law enforcement for the past 20 years let me give you some input here. Criminals do not care if the average man or woman is armed, as a matter of fact they prefer it that way. If a person has no way to protect themselves then they will be a victim at will for the criminals to exploit. Being armed is not about hoping you can kill someone, its about having the know how and ability to keep from getting killed by someone who truly has no respect for human life. If you study history you will find that any country or civilization that disarmed its citizenry usually ended up being destroyed. Anarchy is not something you want to live under. A government that disarms its citizens will eventually use guns against them. I instruct people in concealed handgun classes every year. I always tell every class the same thing, that I am teaching them a skill and giving them the ability to do something I hope they never have to use. I for one will not be one who puts my family members at risk of being robbed or attacked because I was too na├»ve to protect them. And if the current infestation in the white house gets his way we will have to protect ourselves from the wrath of Islamic terrorism which will come ashore here very soon.         
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Offline Rick Hall

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Re: If this doesn't make the point, I don't know what does
« Reply #10 on: January 20, 2015, 08:04:36 pm »
...
I'm honestly baffled, an explanation would be welcomed!

I can see how many people think this. The only news you hear about is accidents, or the mentally unstable with a firearm. Even USA news. It's easy to draw a negative conclusion.

The vast majority of firearm owners in USA use their firearms for recreation. We call it "poking paper holes". We have a safe area, set up some paper targets, and poke some holes. I have two friends near Groningen that will tell you this, they visit USA often.

And you must know, some of the most tragic deaths in recent history did not use guns at all. Treblinka, Ordruf, Berkenau, New York City (9-11), Tokyo subway deaths. A few that did involve guns were an island in Norway (or was it Sweden?), and most recently Paris. The latter two happened in EU, an area that arguably has the most restrictive firearm laws in the world.

The problem is not the firearm, they are just a tool that can be used if/when you need one. Or not at all. Removing firearms from society will solve nothing.

Rick


PS: Where's Silvera? She'd move this thread elsewhere in a heartbeat ;)
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Offline tweeter55

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Re: If this doesn't make the point, I don't know what does
« Reply #11 on: January 20, 2015, 08:09:42 pm »
She's probably out "Poking Holes"  :cannon: :shoot:
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Offline Tzigane

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Re: If this doesn't make the point, I don't know what does
« Reply #12 on: January 21, 2015, 01:33:57 am »
Thanks guys! I'll reply more elaborately when I have some more time. :)
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Offline gPink

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Re: If this doesn't make the point, I don't know what does
« Reply #13 on: January 21, 2015, 04:35:52 am »
In your reply please consider how gun control worked out for Europe in the late 1930s.

Thank God for good men willing to do extreme violence.

Offline Miss Silvera

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Re: If this doesn't make the point, I don't know what does
« Reply #14 on: January 21, 2015, 02:29:02 pm »
Yep...my internet has been down

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