Author Topic: Rear Brake/ABS Pump issue  (Read 36625 times)

Offline BigEdPVD

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 25
  • Country: 00
Rear Brake/ABS Pump issue
« on: January 12, 2016, 11:59:59 pm »
So, after asking around on some of the other forums, I am wondering if anyone here has had their 2008-2009 rear ABS pump fail on them?  That seems to be the diagnosis for my bike.  Early signs were the rear brake lever sticking, it would seem the lever would get hung up when activating the brakes, giving no braking at all, then release quickly giving you a TON of brake at once.  I changed to a new pair of pads, and bled the system, and now I have no rear brakes at all.  Guys on the other forums are suggesting it's the rear ABS pump.  Just wondering if anyone here has had the same problem?
"You've seen it, you've HEARD it, and you're still asking questions?!?"
"Yeah, when do we go for a RIDE!?!?"

Offline VirginiaJim

  • Administrator
  • Elite Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 10674
  • Country: england
  • I've forgotten more than I'll ever know...
    • Kawasaki 1400GTR
Re: Rear Brake/ABS Pump issue
« Reply #1 on: January 13, 2016, 03:52:52 am »
Not sure I've heard of that but the first part of your description sounded like gravel trapped near the lever, but the brakes would stick on for that.  Can't say that I've heard of the ABS pump going bad.  I'd be looking at the master cylinder.  Let us know what you find out.
"LOCTITE®"  The original thread locker...  #11  08-C14 EA FC ABS 46 Monitoring with cutting edge technology (sold).  U.N.I.T is Back!  2016 Indian Roadmaster.

Offline maxtog

  • Elite Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 8019
  • Country: us
  • 2011 Silver
Re: Rear Brake/ABS Pump issue
« Reply #2 on: January 13, 2016, 05:36:25 am »
I have not seen a single report about ABS failure.  Ever.
Shoodaben (was Guhl) Mountain Runner ECU flash, Canyon Cages front/rear, Helibars risers, Phil's wedges, Grip Puppies, Sargent World seat-low & heated & pod, Muzzy lowering links, Soupy's stand, Nautilus air horn, Admore lightbar, Ronnie's highway pegs, front running lights, all LED, helmet locks, RAM Xgrip, Sena SMH10, Throttle Tamer, MRA X-Creen, PR4-GT, Scorpion EXO-T1200,  Tourmaster Flex II

Offline VirginiaJim

  • Administrator
  • Elite Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 10674
  • Country: england
  • I've forgotten more than I'll ever know...
    • Kawasaki 1400GTR
Re: Rear Brake/ABS Pump issue
« Reply #3 on: January 13, 2016, 05:55:52 am »
My advice would be to take it to a dealer that you trust and have them go over it.  Do you have an extended warranty on it?
"LOCTITE®"  The original thread locker...  #11  08-C14 EA FC ABS 46 Monitoring with cutting edge technology (sold).  U.N.I.T is Back!  2016 Indian Roadmaster.

Offline gPink

  • Arena
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5491
  • Country: us
  • MMVIII C XIV
Thank God for good men willing to do extreme violence.

Offline VirginiaJim

  • Administrator
  • Elite Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 10674
  • Country: england
  • I've forgotten more than I'll ever know...
    • Kawasaki 1400GTR
Re: Rear Brake/ABS Pump issue
« Reply #5 on: January 13, 2016, 06:15:09 am »
One forum is all I can handle..maybe two, but that's stretching it.
"LOCTITE®"  The original thread locker...  #11  08-C14 EA FC ABS 46 Monitoring with cutting edge technology (sold).  U.N.I.T is Back!  2016 Indian Roadmaster.

elp_jc

  • Guest
Re: Rear Brake/ABS Pump issue
« Reply #6 on: January 13, 2016, 03:20:05 pm »
There's no 'rear' ABS pump. There's only one pump in the system, even on cars. Pressure is regulated to the wheels via valves. If the system fails, brakes operate normally, just without the ABS function. Plus you'd get an ABS warning light as well, therefore ABS module failure doesn't seem to be your problem. However, it still could be the ABS module due to lack of maintenance (regular bleeding jobs), which wouldn't trigger a dash light if the electronics are working correctly. If you just bled the braking system for the first time, you'd not only have to possibly look at a new ABS module, but clean and rebuild all calipers and master cylinders as well. The braking symptoms you mentioned could be sticky caliper pistons. Whether properly serviced or not, your best bet is to let a dealer hook up the computer to test it. You need special equipment to clean an ABS module due to having to activate pump, all valves, etc. Or buy a new one. Plus I'd clean and/or rebuild all other braking components, including calipers and master cylinders. It's your life on the line. Good luck.

As a final thought, and whether it's your problem or not, hope this scares owners to spend the $5 needed for a small bottle to bleed their braking systems, as well as the half hour to do the job (or pay somebody if you're lazy ;)). It's a piece of cake. Absolutely no reason to neglect such a simple and cheap service, when brakes are the most important system in any vehicle. And the exhorbitant cost to fix such easily maintained components. Hope this helps.

Offline maxtog

  • Elite Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 8019
  • Country: us
  • 2011 Silver
Re: Rear Brake/ABS Pump issue
« Reply #7 on: January 13, 2016, 08:52:04 pm »
As a final thought, and whether it's your problem or not, hope this scares owners to spend the $5 needed for a small bottle to bleed their braking systems, as well as the half hour to do the job (or pay somebody if you're lazy ;)). It's a piece of cake. Absolutely no reason to neglect such a simple and cheap service, when brakes are the most important system in any vehicle. And the exhorbitant cost to fix such easily maintained components. Hope this helps.

You may yell at me now.... 4.5 years and I haven't done it yet...  BUT IT IS ON MY LIST!  Me b bad!
Shoodaben (was Guhl) Mountain Runner ECU flash, Canyon Cages front/rear, Helibars risers, Phil's wedges, Grip Puppies, Sargent World seat-low & heated & pod, Muzzy lowering links, Soupy's stand, Nautilus air horn, Admore lightbar, Ronnie's highway pegs, front running lights, all LED, helmet locks, RAM Xgrip, Sena SMH10, Throttle Tamer, MRA X-Creen, PR4-GT, Scorpion EXO-T1200,  Tourmaster Flex II

Offline connie14boy

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 556
Re: Rear Brake/ABS Pump issue
« Reply #8 on: January 13, 2016, 10:25:22 pm »
You may yell at me now.... 4.5 years and I haven't done it yet...  BUT IT IS ON MY LIST!  Me b bad!

To add to your list and according to the Kawasaki Accepted Principles of Essential Maintenance (KAPEM), have you:
Changed your clutch fluid?
Changed your coolant hoses?
Installed new spark plugs?
Checked valve train clearances?
Installed new rubber brake lines?
Synced the fuel injectors?
Read the entire factory manual?
Dusted under the seat?
Cleaned the lake?




 

Offline maxtog

  • Elite Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 8019
  • Country: us
  • 2011 Silver
Re: Rear Brake/ABS Pump issue
« Reply #9 on: January 14, 2016, 05:35:47 am »
To add to your list and according to the Kawasaki Accepted Principles of Essential Maintenance (KAPEM), have you:
Changed your clutch fluid?
Changed your coolant hoses?
Installed new spark plugs?
Checked valve train clearances?
Installed new rubber brake lines?
Synced the fuel injectors?
Read the entire factory manual?
Dusted under the seat?
Cleaned the lake?

Yikes
Shoodaben (was Guhl) Mountain Runner ECU flash, Canyon Cages front/rear, Helibars risers, Phil's wedges, Grip Puppies, Sargent World seat-low & heated & pod, Muzzy lowering links, Soupy's stand, Nautilus air horn, Admore lightbar, Ronnie's highway pegs, front running lights, all LED, helmet locks, RAM Xgrip, Sena SMH10, Throttle Tamer, MRA X-Creen, PR4-GT, Scorpion EXO-T1200,  Tourmaster Flex II

Offline stevewfl

  • Arena
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4268
  • Country: 00
Re: Rear Brake/ABS Pump issue
« Reply #10 on: January 16, 2016, 09:07:31 pm »
Steve in Sunny Florida had to replace his rear ABS pump (on an '09 if I'm not mistaken).  Ping him for all the low-down

edit:  this thread may help

http://forum.cog-online.org/index.php?topic=56118.0
“The World is a book, and those who do not travel read only a page.” St. Augustine

Offline Conrad

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5753
  • Country: us
Re: Rear Brake/ABS Pump issue
« Reply #11 on: January 17, 2016, 06:44:50 am »
You may yell at me now.... 4.5 years and I haven't done it yet...  BUT IT IS ON MY LIST!  Me b bad!

What are you waiting for Max?   :o
Northern Illinois   Silverdammit '08 C-14 ABS

"Don't bother me with facts, Son. I've already made up my mind." -Foghorn Leghorn

Offline maxtog

  • Elite Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 8019
  • Country: us
  • 2011 Silver
Re: Rear Brake/ABS Pump issue
« Reply #12 on: January 17, 2016, 07:05:53 am »
What are you waiting for Max?   :o

Time, energy, motivation, assistance.  Just the normal stuff.
Shoodaben (was Guhl) Mountain Runner ECU flash, Canyon Cages front/rear, Helibars risers, Phil's wedges, Grip Puppies, Sargent World seat-low & heated & pod, Muzzy lowering links, Soupy's stand, Nautilus air horn, Admore lightbar, Ronnie's highway pegs, front running lights, all LED, helmet locks, RAM Xgrip, Sena SMH10, Throttle Tamer, MRA X-Creen, PR4-GT, Scorpion EXO-T1200,  Tourmaster Flex II

Offline MAN OF BLUES

  • Arena
  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 2659
  • Country: 00
  • WHISKEY.Tango.Foxtrot.
Re: Rear Brake/ABS Pump issue
« Reply #13 on: January 17, 2016, 10:39:50 pm »
There's no 'rear' ABS pump. There's only one pump in the system, even on cars. Pressure is regulated to the wheels via valves. If the system fails, brakes operate normally, just without the ABS function. Plus you'd get an ABS warning light as well, therefore ABS module failure doesn't seem to be your problem. However, it still could be the ABS module due to lack of maintenance (regular bleeding jobs), which wouldn't trigger a dash light if the electronics are working correctly. If you just bled the braking system for the first time, you'd not only have to possibly look at a new ABS module, but clean and rebuild all calipers and master cylinders as well. The braking symptoms you mentioned could be sticky caliper pistons. Whether properly serviced or not, your best bet is to let a dealer hook up the computer to test it. You need special equipment to clean an ABS module due to having to activate pump, all valves, etc. Or buy a new one. Plus I'd clean and/or rebuild all other braking components, including calipers and master cylinders. It's your life on the line. Good luck.

As a final thought, and whether it's your problem or not, hope this scares owners to spend the $5 needed for a small bottle to bleed their braking systems, as well as the half hour to do the job (or pay somebody if you're lazy ;)). It's a piece of cake. Absolutely no reason to neglect such a simple and cheap service, when brakes are the most important system in any vehicle. And the exhorbitant cost to fix such easily maintained components. Hope this helps.

As usual, your expert opinion, based on time with this bike, is full of holes. I have Owned one of the first C14's to hit the USA, and it has ABS. I have changed the brake fluids 3 times since purchase 7/07, and will do another this coming spring. The ABS module is subject to failure, and a few documented cases on this issue have been aired here, and on the COG forum, over the years. A failure on the distribution valves in the module WILL cause solid brake pedal lockup on the rear brake, and such has been documented (when the bike is running). Servicing the fluids requires no power to the bike or to the ABS system, which when the bike is "off" the circuits are in the passive mode. When the ABS unit fails, normal braking will NOT occur, and the failure is not always evident to the onboard diagnostics, so warnings on the dash may not reveal it. The normal fluid changeout to prevent issues is not really all that simple, as when you do the job completely, it is easy to admit air into the system, but with due diligence the integrity can be restored.It is a bit more than "bleeding" the brakes, you need to completely flush the system, which means you will purge, and replace the fluids completely... i.e. running about a pint and a half, or more, thru to complete the action.
Same goes for the clutch...as it contaminates at an accelerated rate more so than the brakes.

I put together a deal with a Kaw dealer to cover our extended warranties at a great price reduction, specifically as a benefit to my family of COG, and have pressed it as a suggested purchase for 7 years now. replacing that pump unit is a pricey thing.
Coupled with regular service interval steps as outlined in the owners book that came with the bike, the checklist is pretty simple.
« Last Edit: January 18, 2016, 12:20:18 am by MAN OF BLUES »

30 YEARS OF KAW.....

Offline VirginiaJim

  • Administrator
  • Elite Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 10674
  • Country: england
  • I've forgotten more than I'll ever know...
    • Kawasaki 1400GTR
Re: Rear Brake/ABS Pump issue
« Reply #14 on: January 18, 2016, 04:41:12 am »
Rich, you really could have done without that first sentence...
"LOCTITE®"  The original thread locker...  #11  08-C14 EA FC ABS 46 Monitoring with cutting edge technology (sold).  U.N.I.T is Back!  2016 Indian Roadmaster.