The Future of th C14

[blue14]

That's because the H2SX isnt' a real sport touring bike [IMHO].

I have to agree with that.  I do think feedback is important, and we certainly SHOULD let Kawasaki know what we are thinking and desire.  But sales numbers will win every time.  Of course, I would love to know how sales compare to the FJR- if the FJR is increasing at the expense of the Concours, then that indicates Kawasaki is dropping the ball by not keeping up.  Releasing the H2SX is great from a power standpoint, and a lose in every single other category for this particular market segment- reliability, warranty, value, comfort, convenience, ride, storage, room, range, style, etc.  Honestly, I would never turn away more power, but the C14 is a beast (especially when flashed) and I really don't need any more power.

Max you are correct our feedback is hugely important to them.  Remember I ws asking them what might be coming for the Concours NOT how to help influence their  marketing decisions.  They currently do not sell an upgraded C14 and they are aware that the things it lacks are hurting sales.  How else can we hope to urge them to build what we would like othr than asking them to in writing??

Sending them emails costs you nothing and might get you the Concours you all have asked for here.  Its up to all of you.

[fartymarty]

First initially sales were around 4000 per year, today that has dropped to around 1000 per year.  Kawi was happy with 4000, not so much at 1000.

Are these world wide or U.S.A. numbers? They seem high (well, to me they do) for USA only.  If world wide numbers, then they will take a significant dip
without Europe.

Still at 1000 per year, they could get rid of a lot of parts inventory just by assembling them. As warrantys start expiring the need for new parts will diminish significantly
as those seeking repair will turn increasingly to the ebay/used parts market just to keep the repair prices inline with the decreasing value of their older bikes. No?

I don't see myself buying a new bike (unless before then, my current C14 suffers significant damage, and I don't.) before 2021-2022 after my warranty runs out. Then I will
be old enough that I may be ready for a Goldwing with a car tire. However I do hope that they decide to keep competing with Yamaha, and that the younger generations decide
that they want to cut back on all the finger swiping lifestyle and just go ride somewhere. With self driving vehicles increasing, I worry more for all of motorcycling than I do for just the Sport-Touring segment.

[olie]

You may be right but honestly, I do not think a 10,000 / year letter- writing campaign is worth much of anything in view of the sales numbers. What good does it do any manufacturer to be contacted and told what a great product they make, only to have them sit on the dealer's floors? Put simply: words are great but dollars convey a LOT more weight.

What would be most interesting would be to see the sales of Yamaha FJR's by comparison. That would yield a very good picture of how much more market Kawasaki could take I think.

Hey, I was planning on buying on in the next couple of years myself, assuming they did not mangle it into something too much different than it is now. So it is not my hope that they drop the line, merely my thought after reading your information. At some point, fatalistic is merely realistic.

Brian

the Trophy is gone for a while in Europe, non Euro4 compliant... I have my doubts Kawasaki will make the ZX14 to comply with Euro 5/6, leading to the H2SX as its replacement. Same for Yamaha if it will make the old FJR Euro5/6 compliant unless they have something NEW in the pipeline. If not, only BMW RT and K16... one will have to pay the piper.

[maxtog]

the Trophy is gone for a while in Europe, non Euro4 compliant... I have my doubts Kawasaki will make the ZX14 to comply with Euro 5/6, leading to the H2SX as its replacement.

Yeah, I was thinking the same thing.  Euro-4 was easy for the ZX (and WOULD be for the Concours) but I am not sure that Euro-5 would be doable.... although, admittedly, I don't know much about Euro-5.

[mikeyw64]

and not forgetting Euro 6

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_emission_standards



Hmm wonder if Euro 7 will make all electric vehicles compulsory ?

[B.D.F.]

Interesting you mention that- that is exactly how a lot of mass produced items fizzle out. In fact, the last three years, as I remember, of the KZ 1300 were earlier bikes assembled in two batches (again, as I remember) that had nothing to do with what 'model year' the bikes were stamped with.

Brian

<snip>

Still at 1000 per year, they could get rid of a lot of parts inventory just by assembling them. As warrantys start expiring the need for new parts will diminish significantly
as those seeking repair will turn increasingly to the ebay/used parts market just to keep the repair prices inline with the decreasing value of their older bikes. No?

<snip>

[B.D.F.]

A significant advantage Kawasaki may have is if they keep the ZX and Concours models running together (meaning the Concours will have to get the larger, current ZX engine and so forth) then they can spread R&D, development and all or almost all certification costs across two models. Yamaha, for example, is flapping out in the breeze by not having anything but an FJR use that engine.

Of course the above would only be an advantage if Kawasaki can make the sales of two (or more?) models using the basic -14 chassis sell more total units than Yamaha can sell FJRs. If not, then there is no advantage at all.

Clearly the sport touring market is small in sales, small in suppliers and models, and getting smaller yet. I personally do not really think of the BMW 16 series as a sport tourer but more of a pure tourer; that may be incorrect but IMO the last sport tourer BMW made was the K1300 GT. Which, by the way, is surprising that they dropped the GT as they continue to make the 1300S; the   same advantages would apply that I already mentioned regarding the two Kawasakis.

Brian

the Trophy is gone for a while in Europe, non Euro4 compliant... I have my doubts Kawasaki will make the ZX14 to comply with Euro 5/6, leading to the H2SX as its replacement. Same for Yamaha if it will make the old FJR Euro5/6 compliant unless they have something NEW in the pipeline. If not, only BMW RT and K16... one will have to pay the piper.

[maxtog]

A significant advantage Kawasaki may have is if they keep the ZX and Concours models running together (meaning the Concours will have to get the larger, current ZX engine and so forth) then they can spread R&D, development and all or almost all certification costs across two models. 

+1 exactly.  Just use the ZX-14R engine, slap on the existing C14 head, add the pre-existing associated Euro-4 addon and done.  It is bizarre.

[gPink]

Seems to me the biggest threat to motorcycling aside from sales is these damn EuroCrap regulations.

[maxtog]

Seems to me the biggest threat to motorcycling aside from sales is these damn EuroCrap regulations.

And the other will be when motorcycles are outlawed [or become unaffordable] because they aren't very compatible with being "self-driving" like cars will become.

[olie]

Yeah, I was thinking the same thing.  Euro-4 was easy for the ZX (and WOULD be for the Concours) but I am not sure that Euro-5 would be doable.... although, admittedly, I don't know much about Euro-5.

...just follow this link...

http://www.transportpolicy.net/standard/eu-motorcycles-emissions/?title=eu:_motorcycles:_emissions

[Bob Skinner]

I heard a lot of this same discussion back in 2006 when the C-10 was discontinued but kawasaki pulled the rabbit out of the hat with the C-14.
I'm hoping they can do it again.

Bob Skinner

[Conniesaki]

They're still makin' this sport tourer, for now anyway. Well, OK, ya gotta buy side cases and top case

[maxtog]

They're still makin' this sport tourer, for now anyway. Well, OK, ya gotta buy side cases and top case

  and somehow convert it to shaft drive, and move the pegs forward, and put on bigger fairings, and add heated grips, and rip out the windscreen to put in a powered one, and add a keyless ignitions, and add variable valve head, and replace the handlebars, and add a rack, and add a glovebox, and upsize the mirrors, and triple the warranty... hey, it becomes a faster Concours with better headlights... 

Hey, I think that is a ZRX in the background of the first pic!  (My previous bike)

[Conniesaki]

...

Hey, I think that is a ZRX in the background of the first pic!  (My previous bike)

It's my buddy's: