Author Topic: Fuel injection retrofit  (Read 15567 times)

Offline gPink

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Re: Fuel injection retrofit
« Reply #165 on: September 12, 2018, 06:23:10 pm »
Got my wide band sensor and controller. Tuning will proceed faster now. ]



Running as a closed loop system?
Thank God for good men willing to do extreme violence.

Offline gpineau

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Re: Fuel injection retrofit
« Reply #166 on: September 12, 2018, 07:12:56 pm »
No, well, sort of. I am closing the loop myself.

http://gpineau.com/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=2&p=32#p32
1 Connie, 2 Magnas, 1 Yamaha Vstar 950 Touring.
https://motostuff.shutterfly.com/pictures

Offline gpineau

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Re: Fuel injection retrofit
« Reply #167 on: October 11, 2018, 05:07:53 pm »
Sorry no progress and no updates for the past month. It's been hectic. Hailstorm trashed my roof about the time I got called home that my mother's health was failing. She passed away and I am travelling back home again to close her affairs.  I haven't even thought about it and don't know when I am getting back on this project. It may be in the spring.
1 Connie, 2 Magnas, 1 Yamaha Vstar 950 Touring.
https://motostuff.shutterfly.com/pictures

Offline gPink

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Re: Fuel injection retrofit
« Reply #168 on: October 11, 2018, 05:43:18 pm »
Very sorry for your loss. Loosing Mom was tough for me too. Don't forget us when you're of a mind to get back to it.
Thank God for good men willing to do extreme violence.

Offline qman

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Re: Fuel injection retrofit
« Reply #169 on: October 13, 2018, 08:53:54 am »
Prayers are with you and your family at this time of loss.

Offline connie_rider

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Re: Fuel injection retrofit
« Reply #170 on: October 15, 2018, 01:10:21 pm »
Sorry to hear the news.
Prayers for you and your family.

Ride safe, Ted

Offline gpineau

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Re: Fuel injection retrofit
« Reply #171 on: November 01, 2018, 04:26:22 pm »
Things have returned to normal. I settled moms affairs and got a new roof put on.

http://gpineau.com/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=2&p=38#p38


1 Connie, 2 Magnas, 1 Yamaha Vstar 950 Touring.
https://motostuff.shutterfly.com/pictures

Offline gpineau

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Re: Fuel injection retrofit
« Reply #172 on: November 03, 2018, 07:57:26 am »
Temperature during warm-up is very sensitive. I made a new video that  may be a little more clear.

http://gpineau.com/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=2&p=38#p42
1 Connie, 2 Magnas, 1 Yamaha Vstar 950 Touring.
https://motostuff.shutterfly.com/pictures

Offline gpineau

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Re: Fuel injection retrofit
« Reply #173 on: November 04, 2018, 08:30:04 am »
I found this video very informative in explaining why we run slightly rich. 
https://youtu.be/gPWI8QTRg9g

https://youtu.be/8IuYRVgMlDg
1 Connie, 2 Magnas, 1 Yamaha Vstar 950 Touring.
https://motostuff.shutterfly.com/pictures

Offline MAN OF BLUES

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Re: Fuel injection retrofit
« Reply #174 on: November 07, 2018, 04:34:14 pm »
is this subject going to be applied to a ZG/GTR Concours, or will it continue in an adjunct, after 12 pages?

maybe relocate it, as some of it is interesting, but not currently related to the Concours.. yet.

 :deadhorse: :deadhorse: :deadhorse: :deadhorse: :deadhorse: :deadhorse: :deadhorse: :deadhorse: :nuts: :banghead: :deadhorse: :salute:

http://www.zggtr.org/index.php?board=11.0

30 YEARS OF KAW.....

Offline gpineau

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Re: Fuel injection retrofit
« Reply #175 on: November 08, 2018, 09:18:58 am »
My Connie is next on my list of things to do after this Magna is highway worthy. .

1 Connie, 2 Magnas, 1 Yamaha Vstar 950 Touring.
https://motostuff.shutterfly.com/pictures

Offline gpineau

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Re: Fuel injection retrofit
« Reply #176 on: December 18, 2018, 11:49:38 pm »
Updates.

A couple months ago, I tried to use the wires coming from the alternator to see if I could extract a usable signal from the mess of pulses. The alternator is 3 phase so the frequency is 18/3 per rev.  Possible to get 6 pulses per rev from the alternator?
 ++++++
I measured the bolt pattern on the starter clutch and had a machine shop cut me a trigger wheel. I really dread installing it because of the mess I am going to make when i remove the side cover. I got the wheel in the mail today. Bolts right onto the starter clutch. Next job is to find out where I can mount the sensor.
++++++
 I need correct crank timing information to the ECU. At the moment I am only providing one of the coil signals to the ECU and fooling the ECU into think it is a 2 cylinder machine so it will run. I think the MAP signal is noisy because as each intake valve opens there is a pulse of vacuum that enters the plenum then tapers off until the next intake valve opens. I think the noise could be smoothed out if the ECU would sample the MAP sensor at the same time on every revolution. And in order to do that it needs more precise crank position information which the trigger wheel will provide.
++++++
 Today I was about to crack open the side cover to install my newly purchased trigger wheel and I thought I would give it one more try. But this time rather than measure from phase to phase I measured one phase to chassis ground and wow! I got a nice clean square wave output . I used the coil signal as sync and counted the pulses between and I get a rock steady 6 square waves between coil firings.

I thought I had it licked. The alternator was putting out a very nice square wave signal, 6 pulses per rev. But I discovered at high rpm some pulsed just up and disappeared. Poof, gone! Come to find out the alternator regulator is not a regulator at all. It is brute force short the output to ground if the voltage gets too large. .

So... to feed the ecu more information I have removed the alternator flywheel and added "teeth" to it by drilling holes every 10 degrees. I skipped one tooth so it will have a timing mark to determine TDC of cylinder 1. So there are 35 teeth and one missing tooth. Added a VR sensor to the outside of the alternator cover to sense the "teeth" .The reason for going through this trouble to get better crank position information to the ECU is.. It allows the ECU to filter out spurious variations in sensor readings by sampling them at known points in the rotation and always at the same time on each rotation. It certainly made a difference in the way this engine is running now. This is working much better and think I am actually have a chance of tuning this on the road.

 I am anxious  to get a chance to ride. I am in the process of adding a bluetooth communications to the ECU so I can log data with my cell phone while riding on the road.

Meanwhile I have a 1999 Connie waiting for attention. I am running several ideas through my mind.

http://gpineau.com/phpbb/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=2&start=30#p46

https://youtu.be/GvVWf3nls4A

https://youtu.be/oN94ygs3Bio

1 Connie, 2 Magnas, 1 Yamaha Vstar 950 Touring.
https://motostuff.shutterfly.com/pictures

Offline connie_rider

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Re: Fuel injection retrofit
« Reply #177 on: December 19, 2018, 11:32:29 am »
Still following this. Admit some went way over my capabilities.
Wondering why you built a trigger wheel and mounted where you did rather than building one where the original ignition pick-up is located?

This has grown in scope a lot over what was originally thought as an inexpensive project.
I understand that as I get myself into similar situations..
It goes from I'll do this EZ project, to I won't let this thing beat me and then "continue" to solve problems as they come up.

Keep tinkering...
I want to see this finished and then done to a Connie.
Should be a bit simpler as you've already done a lot of trial and error.

Ride safe, Ted

Offline gpineau

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Re: Fuel injection retrofit
« Reply #178 on: December 19, 2018, 11:56:03 am »
The trigger wheel pictured above is mounted to the starter clutch about a quarter inch away from the original spark trigger teeth. I had every intent of using it but I dreaded the installation of it.

 I have had the side cover off before when I was working on the starter. It is messy. You must drain the oil and when done you need to re-gasket the side cover and it would have been difficult to find a place for the sensor.  Since I had a spare flywheel I took a shot at putting teeth on it and behold it worked.

If I do another magna I will use the alternator winding's.  to use the alternator winding you must first replace the shunt regulator with a series regulator to prevent the pulses from disappearing at high rpm.  But you can use the 6 pulses from the alternator along with a single spark trigger to accurately divide the crank rotation into 6, 60 degree segments.

Yes this has grown in scope.  But in all I am still under the predicted year in development. It has turned into a long learning process. But the first time is always more involved. I could repeat this in another bike it a quarter the time and cost.

connie_rider You have been an avid reader and supporter from the beginning and you will be the first to know when I take M EFI retrofitted Connie for a test drive.

The Magna being a V4 caused a lot of extra work in designing the manifolds and injector mounts and plumbing.  Doing this on a Connie is going to be a lot simpler.  I am thinking the Connie retrofit will be under 500. If someone wants to replicate this on a Magna it is going to run between 6 and 7 hundred.
1 Connie, 2 Magnas, 1 Yamaha Vstar 950 Touring.
https://motostuff.shutterfly.com/pictures

Offline gpineau

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Re: Fuel injection retrofit
« Reply #179 on: December 24, 2018, 08:38:29 am »

Installed a bluetooth adapter on the ECU so I can do logging and tuning from my cellphone while riding .

It took me over a week to get the bluetooth working on my ECU. I burned up the first USB-serial adapter. Maybe it was DOA but I couldn't tell if it was dead or the Bluetooth dongle was dead but they wouldn't talk to each other.  So I ordered a couple more bluetooth dongles and a different brand of USB- serial adapters.  The bluetooth arrived but the USB parts are still in the mail so I tried the alternative method of wiring them up to a aurdrino .  Worked great this time and now I have 3 Bluetooth dongles that are set up for Speeduino.

So next warm day I am going to get this bike out of the garage and take it for a ride.

https://youtu.be/_t49LNSpihU
1 Connie, 2 Magnas, 1 Yamaha Vstar 950 Touring.
https://motostuff.shutterfly.com/pictures