Author Topic: 14 Feb 2018 FL school shooting  (Read 21706 times)

Offline B.D.F.

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Re: 14 Feb 2018 FL school shooting
« Reply #135 on: February 27, 2018, 07:03:34 am »
Standard issue US military magazines are 30 round. Different AR's are sold with different magazines, often MAGPUL plastic magazines of 20 round capacity.

As you pointed out, magazines are available in many different capacities. But the 30 round is most common, by far.

At this time, there is no US federal limit on magazine size anyone can possess or use.

There are also 'oddball' magazines, often rotary, that can and do have much more capacity. But I do not know of any '50' round magazines and I do not believe there are any '60's either. That said, I am not aware of ANY nefarious uses of any AR with the 'oddball' magazines, all that I have see from photographs have been the ubiquitous 30 round, metal, <probably> standard issue magazines.

Our associate (in this conversation) is simply throwing numbers out in his ignorance, believing accuracy not important so '50' and '60' sounds better as a 'sound- bite' than 20 or 30. My point was that there is absolutely no reason to engage him / her on this topic and start doing math with other firearms magazines nor compare what other firearm magazines may hold, how long it takes to change them and so forth. Put simply, this gentleperson is throwing out snippets he / she has picked up from [often also badly informed] news outlets, and he / she is no longer discussing anything, merely taking potshots (pun intended).

But, as always, it IS a free country and all are of course free to go down any verbal path, the gentleperson specified also of course. Carry on.

I do believe the original topic was the tragic high school shooting in Florida on 14 Feb. 2018

Brian

The AR-15 is issued with a 5, 10, 15, 20, or 30 round magazine.  To my knowledge, 30 is the largest legally sold or can be posessed magazine ANYWHERE in the USA.  If you live in the ridiculous states of CA, NY, MD, MA, and CT a few others, it is 10.  NJ and CO, it is 15.

So, yeah, 'sup with this "50-60 round magazine" stuff, Sanmo??
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Offline sanmo

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Re: 14 Feb 2018 FL school shooting
« Reply #136 on: February 27, 2018, 07:15:16 am »
sanmo...which of the following statements do you find most applicable..

A stranger is an enemy until proven to b a friend.

A stranger is a friend until proven to be an enemy.

Statement 2 for sure. You have to be in the first category to advocate concealed carry or open carry of guns. I'm assuming this psych profile is related to the gun debate.
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Offline sanmo

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Re: 14 Feb 2018 FL school shooting
« Reply #137 on: February 27, 2018, 07:20:39 am »
Standard issue US military magazines are 30 round. Different AR's are sold with different magazines, often MAGPUL plastic magazines of 20 round capacity.

blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, 1000x.....
Brian

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Offline mikeyw64

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Re: 14 Feb 2018 FL school shooting
« Reply #138 on: February 27, 2018, 07:25:06 am »
I see the Deputy on duty has broken his silence

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-43202800



I do believe the original topic was the tragic high school shooting in Florida on 14 Feb. 2018

Brian
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Offline mikeyw64

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Re: 14 Feb 2018 FL school shooting
« Reply #139 on: February 27, 2018, 07:28:11 am »
Some interesting alternatives that I haven't seen discussed here such as "not naming the shooter" and "having 2 doors in every classroom"


http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-43118865
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Offline B.D.F.

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Re: 14 Feb 2018 FL school shooting
« Reply #140 on: February 27, 2018, 07:44:18 am »
There was one of these instances where the local officials refused to use the name of the perpetrator, with the thought of not providing him any kind of gratification. In the big picture, turning these people into pariahs, socially, which they SHOULD already be but somehow do not seem to quite 'make it' would be one of the most beneficial things for everyone IMO.

The 'big picture' is that if a society finds some particular behavior reprehensible then very little of it will actually happen because no individual wants to be 'that' person. This is apparently common in Japan for example, where person hygiene, grooming and general care (especially not being over weight) is considered unacceptable actually works to prevent people from doing or becoming those things.

But it just does not seem that the people who perpetrate these types of horrible social incidents ever get quite to the level of 'horrible human'. And I have no idea why this is. ??

And it does not seem to be an unusual situation in the western world either.

All of that to say that I think it would be of huge benefit and might actually go a long way to eliminate the root of the problem (if no one wanted to be 'that person' who did that horrible thing) but have no idea of how to get an entire society to behave / think that way.

Brian

Some interesting alternatives that I haven't seen discussed here such as "not naming the shooter" and "having 2 doors in every classroom"


http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-43118865
Homo Sapiens Sapiens and just a tad of Neanderthal but it usually does not show....  My Private mail is blocked; it is not you, it is me, just like that dating partner said all those years ago. Please send an e-mail if you want to contact me privately.

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Offline mikeyw64

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Re: 14 Feb 2018 FL school shooting
« Reply #141 on: February 27, 2018, 07:48:34 am »
Maybe  policy of not naming for a month then go for a full blown name & shame?


I thought the 2 doors idea had merit.

Ok wouldn't prevent but might help mitigate

There was one of these instances where the local officials refused to use the name of the perpetrator, with the thought of not providing him any kind of gratification. In the big picture, turning these people into pariahs, socially, which they SHOULD already be but somehow do not seem to quite 'make it' would be one of the most beneficial things for everyone IMO.

The 'big picture' is that if a society finds some particular behavior reprehensible then very little of it will actually happen because no individual wants to be 'that' person. This is apparently common in Japan for example, where person hygiene, grooming and general care (especially not being over weight) is considered unacceptable actually works to prevent people from doing or becoming those things.

But it just does not seem that the people who perpetrate these types of horrible social incidents ever get quite to the level of 'horrible human'. And I have no idea why this is. ??

And it does not seem to be an unusual situation in the western world either.

All of that to say that I think it would be of huge benefit and might actually go a long way to eliminate the root of the problem (if no one wanted to be 'that person' who did that horrible thing) but have no idea of how to get an entire society to behave / think that way.

Brian
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Offline B.D.F.

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Re: 14 Feb 2018 FL school shooting
« Reply #142 on: February 27, 2018, 08:13:54 am »
Me too, I think both ideas have merit, especially the not naming the perpetrator one. I just do not know how to go about it- free press and all, someone will always print the name and all the other agencies will pick up on that.

And I think it would go a long way toward prevention.

Brian

Maybe  policy of not naming for a month then go for a full blown name & shame?


I thought the 2 doors idea had merit.

Ok wouldn't prevent but might help mitigate
Homo Sapiens Sapiens and just a tad of Neanderthal but it usually does not show....  My Private mail is blocked; it is not you, it is me, just like that dating partner said all those years ago. Please send an e-mail if you want to contact me privately.

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Offline turbojoe78

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Re: 14 Feb 2018 FL school shooting
« Reply #143 on: February 27, 2018, 08:31:01 am »
sanmo...which of the following statements do you find most applicable..

A stranger is an enemy until proven to b a friend.

A stranger is a friend until proven to be an enemy.
Statement 2 for sure. You have to be in the first category to advocate concealed carry or open carry of guns. I'm assuming this psych profile is related to the gun debate.

sanmo,  you have absolutely no idea how we who advocate for concealed carry think.  When Gary posted that question to you I wondered how you would answer.  I answered the same as you ... yes, statement #2 is how I look at things.

I bet that most of us on this forum who are CC permit holders, and most in general would answer the same.

You really have no idea at all how we think!
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Offline gPink

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Re: 14 Feb 2018 FL school shooting
« Reply #144 on: February 27, 2018, 08:33:55 am »
 :)
Thank God for good men willing to do extreme violence.

Offline sanmo

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Re: 14 Feb 2018 FL school shooting
« Reply #145 on: February 27, 2018, 09:40:01 am »
sanmo,  you have absolutely no idea how we who advocate for concealed carry think.  When Gary posted that question to you I wondered how you would answer.  I answered the same as you ... yes, statement #2 is how I look at things.

I bet that most of us on this forum who are CC permit holders, and most in general would answer the same.

You really have no idea at all how we think!

I'm glad we think alike in that matter and in our choice of bikes. To help educate me, why do you have a CC permit and presumably carry a gun?
(Will do my best to check in frequently so that this conversation is not too disjointed)
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Offline Conniesaki

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Re: 14 Feb 2018 FL school shooting
« Reply #146 on: February 27, 2018, 10:10:53 am »
Knowing everybody is on edge from the Parkland shootings, what (if anything) should be done with the owner of this?


Offline Rhino

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Re: 14 Feb 2018 FL school shooting
« Reply #147 on: February 27, 2018, 12:58:32 pm »
Knowing everybody is on edge from the Parkland shootings, what (if anything) should be done with the owner of this?




Discombobulation at the very least!

Offline MAN OF BLUES

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Re: 14 Feb 2018 FL school shooting
« Reply #148 on: February 27, 2018, 02:48:04 pm »
Standard issue US military magazines are 30 round. Different AR's are sold with different magazines, often MAGPUL plastic magazines of 20 round capacity.

As you pointed out, magazines are available in many different capacities. But the 30 round is most common, by far.

At this time, there is no US federal limit on magazine size anyone can possess or use.

There are also 'oddball' magazines, often rotary, that can and do have much more capacity. But I do not know of any '50' round magazines and I do not believe there are any '60's either. That said, I am not aware of ANY nefarious uses of any AR with the 'oddball' magazines, all that I have see from photographs have been the ubiquitous 30 round, metal, <probably> standard issue magazines.

Our associate (in this conversation) is simply throwing numbers out in his ignorance, believing accuracy not important so '50' and '60' sounds better as a 'sound- bite' than 20 or 30. My point was that there is absolutely no reason to engage him / her on this topic and start doing math with other firearms magazines nor compare what other firearm magazines may hold, how long it takes to change them and so forth. Put simply, this gentleperson is throwing out snippets he / she has picked up from [often also badly informed] news outlets, and he / she is no longer discussing anything, merely taking potshots (pun intended).

But, as always, it IS a free country and all are of course free to go down any verbal path, the gentleperson specified also of course. Carry on.

I do believe the original topic was the tragic high school shooting in Florida on 14 Feb. 2018

Brian


stock up on these....

https://www.classicfirearms.com/ar15-m16-100rd-dual-drum-mag-gen-2-tan



AR style...
also available for the Mini 14  ;)

temporarily out of stock... wonder why?
https://www.classicfirearms.com/mini-14-100rd-dual-drum-mag-for-all-ruger-mini-14-rifles

and of course the "old standby"

https://www.classicfirearms.com/75-rd-rear-loading-ak47-drum-mag-korean

oh, they have been used in nefarious events.... like Aurora... but the mag jammed....
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2012_Aurora_shooting

I guess the folks that survived were lucky that it did...

Charles Whitman comes to mind, when I think about interesting cases...


« Last Edit: February 27, 2018, 03:32:26 pm by MAN OF BLUES »

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Offline B.D.F.

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Re: 14 Feb 2018 FL school shooting
« Reply #149 on: February 27, 2018, 03:15:12 pm »
I know they are available, but I was pointing out that 1) that is not the norm., either on the range or in a mass shooting and 2) have you ever seen any drum type magazine used in a mass shooting?

My comments were directed toward the idea that the 'usual' or 'standard' or 'often found' magazine for an AR-15 holds "50" or "60" rounds, and I disputed that. The large 'commonly used' magazine for an AR-15 is 30 rounds though 20 and 10 round magazines are quite common, especially for things such as shooting off a bench where that long, 30 round magazine really gets in the way.

I would say the same thing about most Glocks: they certainly are 34 round magazines available for them but 1) it is not common. 2) it would make the 'handgun' too large to be useful as a handgun under any normal, rational circumstances, and 3) again I am not aware of anyone using such optional, clearly ridiculously large magazines for either a mass shooting or the usually gang- bangers tinking away at each other on a Friday night. So to argue about "those 34 round Glocks" or "50 or 60 round AR-15's" seems silly to me.

One can probably buy pants (trousers) in size 60 also but that is NOT the norm. though we (Americans) are certainly doing all we can do to work our way up to that.....

Brian


stock up on these....

https://www.classicfirearms.com/ar15-m16-100rd-dual-drum-mag-gen-2-tan



AR style...
also available for the Mini 14  ;)

temporarily out of stock... wonder why?
https://www.classicfirearms.com/mini-14-100rd-dual-drum-mag-for-all-ruger-mini-14-rifles

and of course the "old standby"

https://www.classicfirearms.com/75-rd-rear-loading-ak47-drum-mag-korean
Homo Sapiens Sapiens and just a tad of Neanderthal but it usually does not show....  My Private mail is blocked; it is not you, it is me, just like that dating partner said all those years ago. Please send an e-mail if you want to contact me privately.

KiPass keeping you up at night? Fuel gauge warning burning your retinas? Get unlimited peace and harmony here: www.incontrolne.com