15K Valves: How bad were they?

[C1xRider]

Crap! I have 7 of the 8 shims I need in my stockpile!
Anyone willing to swap me their #20 (2.20 mm) for just about anything else. Or even 2 for 1

This is exactly why I was considering the option of opening it up to measure, then put it back together while I ride it and wait for parts I might need.

It would be a gamble, but if there's nothing horribly out of spec, then procrastinating on it wouldn't make me feel so bad.  If there was, I'd know I needed to get the shims, and get right on it.

It would be a bit of extra work, but with my hoist, and air tools, wouldn't take long (famous last words...).

[c14addict]

Don't you have to take the cams out to see what size shim to buy? Lot of work to do it twice. The worse part is getting at them.

[IRULE]

Not a tech here, what would I feel or hear if my valve need to be adjust?  How about the performance?  Thanks.

[lather]

Don't you have to take the cams out to see what size shim to buy? Lot of work to do it twice. The worse part is getting at them.

Yes. But for me this is the second valve check and I kept a record of what shims are in there so I know aht I need.

[lather]

Not a tech here, what would I feel or hear if my valve need to be adjust?  How about the performance?  Thanks.

You probably won't feel anything but I have heard that if the valves are in spec you should hear them "ticking" on a cold start up and the ticking should almost go away when the engine is warm.
But I would think it would be hard to detect just one or two missing ticks among 16.

[C1xRider]

Don't you have to take the cams out to see what size shim to buy? Lot of work to do it twice. The worse part is getting at them.

Hmm, I thought they were marked on the side of the shims somehow.  If not, that sucks!   

I was thinking I could simply check the gap, and if any were off, look at the numbers of the installed shims to make the map of what's there.

If I have to pull the cams and measure each one, then I'll have to line up a local source for the shims before I start.  One of the drawbacks to doing things mail order these days, lack of instant gratification. 

[C1xRider]

You probably won't feel anything but I have heard that if the valves are in spec you should hear them "ticking" on a cold start up and the ticking should almost go away when the engine is warm.
But I would think it would be hard to detect just one or two missing ticks among 16.

Really hard, but you may detect one or two still ticking after the rest go quiet.  However, since I think they get tighter as the valve seats wear, I'm not sure what good that information would do you.  Plus, there's so much noise coming from the my engine, I doubt you could hear anything.

[lather]

Really hard, but you may detect one or two still ticking after the rest go quiet.  However, since I think they get tighter as the valve seats wear, I'm not sure what good that information would do you.  Plus, there's so much noise coming from the my engine, I doubt you could hear anything.

The shims are marked but they are under the buckets and the buckets are under the CAMS.

Yes, if most go quiet but a couple are still ticking they are probably too loose. If you hear no ticking or just a few ticking on cold startup then all or some are probably too tight.

[C1xRider]

The shims are marked but they are under the buckets and the buckets are under the CAMS.

Bummer.  So it's all or nothing (other than satisfying curiosity if they are way off or not).  I was wondering if the markings would be obscured by the buckets.

Thanks for the info Lather.    Did you find your last shim yet?

[lather]

Bummer.  So it's all or nothing (other than satisfying curiosity if they are way off or not).  I was wondering if the markings would be obscured by the buckets.

Thanks for the info Lather.    Did you find your last shim yet?

Yes, Shoe here has some and is sending via mail.

[MAN OF BLUES]

Crap! I have 7 of the 8 shims I need in my stockpile!
Anyone willing to swap me their #20 (2.20 mm) for just about anything else. Or even 2 for 1

UPDATE: I got a call from Shoe, he is sending a couple of shims. Thanks Shoe!

I'll repeat this again, as I have a few times already, and I hope this sinks in for those still awaiting the time when they do this adjust....

While you are pulling the buckets to see what shims are in each position the first go around, and have a map of the clearances in hand, as you Mic' each shim (just to be sure) MIC THE BUCKET ALSO AND RECORD THOSE READINGS IN THE MAP
then, when you realize you need "a shim or two" and can't get one, you can go back thru your map, and see which buckets you can swap ALSO to get closer, or even be able to get a correct stackup in the trouble spots..... the stackup on the bucket and shim combo will allow a much more diverse set of swaps using the existing parts you have, and many times you will actually reduce the shim purchases substantially. I found variations in Bucket dimensions of .002", which is very substantial...in reality it is the difference in the full range of the spec allowable/noted between tight and loose...I set ALL mine to the top end limit, and there should be no fear in doing this. It's logical, and allows the most duration between "torture" sessions.

going thru this job, with the time and care only you can do (as the shops will not take the time to do this) gives the options of documenting every shim and bucket dimension, subsequent inspections down the road only require checking the clearance that exists, and running your calculations again, with all that data recorded, to see exactly which shims you will need to obtain, and allow bucket/cup swaps to reduce the efforts also.....

see the chart i made on mine, and note the cup/bucket movements also (and the measurments on them)


http://rides.webshots.com/photo/2896805850015463693biYSzi

you took the time to pull it apart, take the time to measure EVERYTHING.

[IRULE]

I AM NOT DOING THIS.  NO WAY, HELL NO!  NO THANKS. 

[C1xRider]

I AM NOT DOING THIS.  NO WAY, HELL NO!  NO THANKS. 

Aww, come on now, if you just add a few more lines with arrows to that chart, it's perfectly clear.   

Thanks MOB, for the excellent feedback and information!   

[MAN OF BLUES]

did that really scare you guys off?
tough crowd.....

[IRULE]

I can do some maintenances, but not like this. I am scare!

[MAN OF BLUES]

Aww, come on now, if you just add a few more lines with arrows to that chart, it's perfectly clear.    

Thanks MOB, for the excellent feedback and information!   

oh, you mean like this:



heheheheheh I cleaned the sheet up and made a final copy, but the first sheet was a bit busy.... but I knew what i was doing.... my bike runs fine......bless Haroldo

[IRULE]

Oh my gosh!  No thanks.

[C1xRider]

oh, you mean like this:



heheheheheh I cleaned the sheet up and made a final copy, but the first sheet was a bit busy.... but I knew what i was doing.... my bike runs fine......bless Haroldo

 

That's more like it!  I knew that first one was too clean to be the original.

[lather]

with the inch to metric conversions I have a hard enough time keeping focused on 32 measurements  much less 48.

[Pokey]

I am pretty mechanically inclined IMHO......and I will not be doing this myself. Of course I will wait until I have around 20k on mine,  I'm not having it done at 15k.