Author Topic: C14 gets tagged  (Read 540 times)

Offline VirginiaJim

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C14 gets tagged
« on: December 06, 2018, 04:22:32 pm »
Looks like the rider was shaken but not stirred...look around the 2:15 time frame in.







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Offline MAN OF BLUES

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Re: C14 gets tagged
« Reply #1 on: December 06, 2018, 04:32:20 pm »
Looks like the rider was shaken but not stirred...look around the 2:15 time frame in.


http://youtu.be/FJ1pdBLc1rM


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Offline MAN OF BLUES

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Re: C14 gets tagged
« Reply #2 on: December 06, 2018, 05:02:09 pm »
like to know how that turned out, at firsst, I thought the cage driver said "later dude", but it seemed they were going to the right lane down stream, hopefully to say "i'm sorry...", and exchange insurance.... I woulda forced a bodily fluid transfer at that point..

just kidding.... not.

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Offline maxtog

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Re: C14 gets tagged
« Reply #3 on: December 06, 2018, 08:04:57 pm »
Technically it is absolutely not the C14's drivers fault, and the car driver would be 100% liable.  But the motorcyclist was also doing two things incredibly stupid/unsafe/non-defensive- first, pulling into the blind spot of another driver, and during slowing traffic when people are most likely to change lanes with no notice, and swinging to the far left of that lane.   Secondly, if you start at the very beginning, you can see he did a continuous DOUBLE lane change.

I would NEVER do what he did.  I try to always drive with the assumption that nobody can see me.  Thankfully, it looks like he probably had no major injuries.
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Offline B.D.F.

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Re: C14 gets tagged
« Reply #4 on: December 06, 2018, 08:20:09 pm »
That is an excellent 'teaching' video IMO- the guy on the bike was wrong, or at least 'more wronger' than the car (though I would assign him 100% of the fault) because 1) he drifted quickly into the lane in the car's blind spot and 2) he was clearly further behind the car, at least from the front end of both vehicle's point of view.

But it is a great lesson NOT to allow yourself to get into that kind of a situation in the first place. Especially when on a bike- bike riders tend to suffer more, often a LOT more, from a would would just be some bodywork on a cage or truck.

Brian

Edited to add: Max and I posted at the same time; interesting how the two of us, or any number of people, can look a the same thing and see either two different causes, two different outcomes or both. I betcha' this shows up all the time in courts.....

Looks like the rider was shaken but not stirred...look around the 2:15 time frame in.


http://youtu.be/FJ1pdBLc1rM
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Offline maxtog

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Re: C14 gets tagged
« Reply #5 on: December 07, 2018, 02:40:44 pm »
Edited to add: Max and I posted at the same time; interesting how the two of us, or any number of people, can look a the same thing and see either two different causes, two different outcomes or both. I betcha' this shows up all the time in courts.....

Actually, it seems like we both described the same things- how stupid the motorcyclist's actions were.  The only place we differ is in the legality of liability.  I am quite sure the car is at [legal] fault.  Although the motorcyclist did all the wrong things, he WAS fully in the lane before the car initiated any lane change.  Had the car driver looked (with checking blind spots) IMMEDIATELY before changing lanes, he would have seen the lane was occupied.  I suppose one could make a case that the motorcyclist was reckless enough that a "normal" person who DID check properly still wouldn't have seen the bike.  Hmmm...
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Offline B.D.F.

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Re: C14 gets tagged
« Reply #6 on: December 07, 2018, 03:49:05 pm »
Yep, agreed- it was foolish and risky on the biker's part.

As to the legal side, I would say there is certainly room for wind-age there but as I am taking it 1) the bike was considerably behind the car, meaning it was not in the driver's vision given a normal check before changing lanes (rear-view mirrors and of course, a look out the side windows). 2) The bike was still moving sideways as the auto started to also move sideways in changing lanes. So technically the bike was in that lane before the car but I am saying the bike was still [in the act of] moving into that lane so it was kind of a simultaneous event; in that case, the fault goes to the driver most rearward entering the new lane. Maybe in real life it would be something like a 70/30% split of fault. ??

But as I said, an excellent example of what NOT to do even though it may have been legal and even the other driver's fault. That does not help the bones knit or the wounds to close. I would never allow myself to get into that situation in any vehicle but of course I am much more sensitive to it when on a bike just because a 'fender- brush' usually does not buff out....

The local Interstate highway splits off (two lanes on the left) onto a local highway, with two lanes on the right going straight through. It is unfortunately too common that drivers find themselves in the 3rd or 4th lane of an Interstate highway actually ON what amounts to an exit (the lanes peel away) and try to cross one or more (I have seen them attempt and usually succeed all four!) lanes just to 'stay' on the same highway. And of course they often slam into cars to the side of them or 'cross the bow' of other cars- my brother T-boned an auto doing this very thing a few years ago on that curve / split. I never, ever allow myself to travel on that highway with anyone directly to my left or even slightly in front and left of me entering that curve / split and over the years, I have had perhaps 3 or 4 cars cut across in front of me, close enough that I have had to apply brakes. But I would be 100% in the right, and the other driver would be 100% at fault in such a collision but somehow I doubt that would be much comfort in the hospital room afterwards....

Brian

Brian

Actually, it seems like we both described the same things- how stupid the motorcyclist's actions were.  The only place we differ is in the legality of liability.  I am quite sure the car is at [legal] fault.  Although the motorcyclist did all the wrong things, he WAS fully in the lane before the car initiated any lane change.  Had the car driver looked (with checking blind spots) IMMEDIATELY before changing lanes, he would have seen the lane was occupied.  I suppose one could make a case that the motorcyclist was reckless enough that a "normal" person who DID check properly still wouldn't have seen the bike.  Hmmm...
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Offline maxtog

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Re: C14 gets tagged
« Reply #7 on: December 07, 2018, 04:36:56 pm »
Maybe in real life it would be something like a 70/30% split of fault. ??

Yes, that is exactly the argument I do open the door for- a possibility of shared fault if you can demonstrate the bike was acting with extraordinary disregard.

Quote
But as I said, an excellent example of what NOT to do even though it may have been legal

Yes, exactly my point also.  You can be "right" and yet dead/injured/ruined/damaged/inconvenienced.  Not a good outcome.

Defensive driving means AVOIDING and PREVENTING accidents, *especially* when it is someone else's improper, bad, illegal, irresponsible, inappropriate, poor, aggressive, distracted, whatever, driving.  It is a mindset of predicting what others might do, might be thinking, could happen, and avoiding bad situations... as well as communicating well with other drivers, being aware, thinking, practicing, etc.
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Offline MAN OF BLUES

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Re: C14 gets tagged
« Reply #8 on: December 07, 2018, 05:14:54 pm »
the use of a "turn signal" when actuated as the wheels of the auto are being re directed, is not in any way a release of the driver from liability of anything occurring in a lane change... signal.... look.... and then change lanes, not turn on signal and change lanes at that moment... granted the bike rider was being dumb..and luckily he had fast reactions... but blind spotting himself, is never a good thing... I'm always looking to see if I can see a drivers eyes in their rearview mirror, when Im doing "maneuvers" such as this.

every state has rulings on turn signal distances, prior to a "movement", see it all the time watching how many people get pulled over for Improper lane change/turn, etc., on Live PD, and end up in jail for the silly concealed weapon/mega dope/open container/nobody ever has a drivers license/ bad day at the office psycho thing...


bad moves on both, car driver did not signal in advance of change, within a reasonable distance traveled.  the vid shows it... hard to contest it didn't occur.

But then again, watching it... biker boy never used a signal at all during his lane change... and his brake light coincides with the second flash on the cars turn signal, like 20 feet from the time it first flashed...

we can all agree, he was lucky... bet the guy filming this was glad he didn't run the dude over...

Having "driven thru" a 3 lane "crash" last season, between the spinning cars,  at 70 mph, and debris flying, cars both spinning across 3 lanes... and everything appeared in slow motion as it occured... amazing just how fast the mind can send signals to every muscle, and make it seem so unreal, that I could navigate between all that, from left to right, back again, and back to the right side of the road without incident, while in my rearview I watched at least a dozen more cars crash spectacularly, and shut the road down... I can say things like this make you kiss the ground, the wife, the bike, and go cool out sitting in a park for an hour... reflecting on how you could have been ... dead.
One guy in a car, that drove the berm around it all, after his crash, came up to me while I was taking pics on my phone cam, and rolled his window down, and told me "you are ONE LUCKY MUTHA******...I watched you not get killed....."

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Offline maxtog

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Re: C14 gets tagged
« Reply #9 on: December 07, 2018, 10:15:11 pm »
But then again, watching it... biker boy never used a signal at all during his lane change...

The biker had his left turn signal on all the time; it was on the entire double lane change and when he was hit.
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Offline MAN OF BLUES

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Re: C14 gets tagged
« Reply #10 on: December 08, 2018, 03:11:45 pm »
The biker had his left turn signal on all the time; it was on the entire double lane change and when he was hit.

sorry,
I watched this on my small laptop screen, doing start/stop/ etc., I had to go full screen to actually see his signal flashing, yep it was on the whole time.

my bad eyes...
never mind... ;)

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Offline maxtog

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Re: C14 gets tagged
« Reply #11 on: December 08, 2018, 08:53:29 pm »
I had to go full screen to actually see his signal flashing, yep it was on the whole time.

Which also shows how insignificant the turn signals can be during the day.  I originally had to play it several times before I was sure he was doing a continuous double-lane change.  Still not sure why the hell he would position himself so far left into the lane at the end.  It was just stupid piled on stupid with a stupid cherry on top.
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Offline B.D.F.

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Re: C14 gets tagged
« Reply #12 on: December 08, 2018, 09:22:23 pm »
And that is without even mentioning the part that was stupid.

But it seems we all agree on that- many relatively small mistakes piled up to create this unfortunate situation. Fortunately, just a little thought and sense and it would have been, and probably HAS been avoided, countless times.

Brian


<snip>

It was just stupid piled on stupid with a stupid cherry on top.
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Offline maxtog

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Re: C14 gets tagged
« Reply #13 on: December 08, 2018, 09:46:52 pm »
But it seems we all agree on that- many relatively small mistakes piled up to create this unfortunate situation. Fortunately, just a little thought and sense and it would have been, and probably HAS been avoided, countless times.

Yeah, we ALL make stupid mistakes on occasion.  And I think that mostly what saves us is not doing MULTIPLE stupid things all chained together, or perhaps just a bit of luck.  That is when it is nice when part of that chain are OTHERS who are defensive drivers.

If I think about it too much, though, I am not sure I could ever get on a motorcycle again...
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