Author Topic: Lost FOB, KIPASS replacement cost?  (Read 1560 times)

Offline fartymarty

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Re: Lost FOB, KIPASS replacement cost?
« Reply #15 on: September 08, 2019, 09:08:40 pm »
Quote from: Carmo Electronics wbsite
Send the following items to Carmo electronics:
-ECM/ECU-unit of your motorcycle (Immobilizer ring for Yamaha, dashboard for Ducati/Aprilia motorcycles)
-One or two new chipkeys (or we can order them for you)
-Copy of your original purchase papers

Within 10 days we will send everything back!

It figures that near the end (if not the end) of the C14s production life, that this service would become available.  ::)

Offline PH14

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Re: Lost FOB, KIPASS replacement cost?
« Reply #16 on: September 08, 2019, 09:57:12 pm »
Man of blues, You sir, have a right to believe and or think whatever you wish.  i, on the other hand, dont have to prove anything to you.

YHSublime, you and I lost our FOBs around the same time (looking at my original thread about my lost FOB http://www.zggtr.org/index.php?topic=23715.0  ). call or text Kevin at Carmousa it will take about 3 weeks and you will be riding again.


You may not think you have to prove anything, but it would be helpful on a forum to back up your claims, so others can benefit. You see, so far, no one has been able to do what you say they did. Verification would be a wonderful thing, and considering this is a forum where people actually share information and knowledge, when someone balks at providing confirmation of a claim such as yours, people tend to become even more skeptical.

Offline chile62

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Re: Lost FOB, KIPASS replacement cost?
« Reply #17 on: September 09, 2019, 06:10:02 am »
You may not think you have to prove anything, but it would be helpful on a forum to back up your claims, so others can benefit. You see, so far, no one has been able to do what you say they did. Verification would be a wonderful thing, and considering this is a forum where people actually share information and knowledge, when someone balks at providing confirmation of a claim such as yours, people tend to become even more skeptical.

I would love to help, but when a fellow forum member questions your integrity in a public forum, and basically demands proof of your actions and calls you a liar, that upsets me.


Offline VirginiaJim

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Re: Lost FOB, KIPASS replacement cost?
« Reply #18 on: September 09, 2019, 06:18:30 am »
Tone it down, fellas...
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Offline Conrad

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Re: Lost FOB, KIPASS replacement cost?
« Reply #19 on: September 09, 2019, 07:15:24 am »
I would love to help, but when a fellow forum member questions your integrity in a public forum, and basically demands proof of your actions and calls you a liar, that upsets me.

You have to understand something here. Most of us have been on this forum for a LONG time. People come and go but there are a lot of folks that have been here forever. Please check the post counts and you'll see what I mean.

We've seen it time and again. Someone looses their ONE working FOB and comes here for help. Up until now there was only one thing to do and that's to bend over and pay ~$1k to get their bike back on the road.

Now here you come, a guy with 14 posts, and tell us that there's another way to recover from a lost FOB but you won't say much else. Then when someone questions you about it (admittedly, not in the best way but that's how MOB can be), you go off.

What are we to think? What would you think in our positions?

You say that you don't have anything to prove? That's true, you don't. But if you'd like to get along with everyone here and get some help when you need it, then yes, you do have something to prove...
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Offline VirginiaJim

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Re: Lost FOB, KIPASS replacement cost?
« Reply #20 on: September 09, 2019, 10:37:14 am »
+1
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Offline PH14

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Re: Lost FOB, KIPASS replacement cost?
« Reply #21 on: September 09, 2019, 11:16:45 am »
+2

Offline PH14

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Re: Lost FOB, KIPASS replacement cost?
« Reply #22 on: September 09, 2019, 11:22:31 am »
I would love to help, but when a fellow forum member questions your integrity in a public forum, and basically demands proof of your actions and calls you a liar, that upsets me.

I understand what you are saying, but I for one, would really love to see a video of the system working. Are the keys used in place of the original stove key? If so, what keeps water out of the switch assembly?

Their site also mentions they want copies of your original purchase papers. Did you send those, and if so, did the papers include the code from Kawasaki that is used to program new fobs? That would be an important detail. IN all the years I have been on this forum, and others, (I have a 2009 bought new in 2010 and have been here since buying it.) I have never seen anyone get a new fob programed without the code.

Offline B.D.F.

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Re: Lost FOB, KIPASS replacement cost?
« Reply #23 on: September 09, 2019, 11:41:56 am »
I took a look and they are really throwing me with the 'red' key and the 'black' key. Especially since they are the exact same price as the active fob, $21.38 each. ?? ?? I believe Ducati has a red (master) and black (slave) keys but of course C-14 keys have no electronics in them in the first place so why two different types? They show all combinations with one red key and the rest black, just as it would work with a Ducati but that is not how the KiPass system works. They further explain that both the keys and fob have to be programmed, which again is odd. And they are calling it the 'KISS' system. ??

Anyway, it all sounds great if it works and is as it appears (a real, active fob for $21 as opposed to a 'credit card' type of fob).

Brian

Interesting, to say the least.

https://www.carmousa.com/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=4105

They even sell active fobs for $21????  (Says "0 in stock", however).

I wonder why it takes so long, though.
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Offline chile62

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Re: Lost FOB, KIPASS replacement cost?
« Reply #24 on: September 09, 2019, 12:48:00 pm »
Here's my experience.  (English is my second language, grammar, punctuation.are some of my weaknesses)

Some time in August of 2018 my keyfob (the only thing i had to start my Connie) fell off my desk and into the trash can next to it.
Started looking for used ECM/ECUs with a matching keyfob, in the process i found out that my 2012 requires a 2010 thru 2014 ecm (other years may not work correctly)
Searching around the web, i found Carmo.nl i contacted them and asked a bunch of questions, and they answered them all, very patiently. (I was thinking that it was too good to be true)
I had/have some health issues, had to put this aside for a while.
After a couple of months, i found CarmoUSA and contacted Kevin thru e-mail.  He sent me a picture of the computer that i needed to send them, and to my surprise it wasnt the main ECU but instead it was the black box that is attached to the ignition switch under the handle bars (stove key?).
After i drilled the key switch away from the top brace, i threw the switch and the black box attached to it into a box and along a few papers proving that it is my bike sent them to CarmoUSA.
About 2 weeks later i received an invoice for around 360 to 380 (they charged me about $40,00 to send it all back to me)
About a week after that, i had my switch and its computer back  put it on the bike and it cranked and ran right away.
Because i did not know that there are 2 different keys to the Connies, ( A key and B key) i did not specify to CarmoUSA which key i had they sent me the wrong key. ( if you do not know the differerence between the A and B keys, please research this,  "A" keys will not fit "B" switches and "B" keys will not fit "A" switches.
I took one of the keys that CarmoUSA sent back and cut off the metal part of the key and kept the plastic piece (with the transponder or key chip) and  epoxied it to the front side of the switch right under the plastic bezel.
To start my bike, i just put a key in the switch, push it in all the way, wait a second, when the key picture comes up on the screen i turn my key to the left, or center position, and start the engine. to turn it off i turn the key to the right, pull the key out, put it in my pocket and walk away. (while admiring my wonderful Connie.

Sorry my English sucks.

Ed

Offline chile62

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Re: Lost FOB, KIPASS replacement cost?
« Reply #25 on: September 09, 2019, 01:13:58 pm »
Quick video I made.  https://youtu.be/dcghuAh-w04

I think they send this computers overseas, where they are opened and the original chip that receives the code from the original keyfob and verifies it, is removed and replaced with a blank one.
the red and black keys are then "electronically married" to the new chip, the computer is then re-potted and sealed, and sent back.  No need to get KDS involved.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dcghuAh-w04&feature=youtu.be

« Last Edit: September 09, 2019, 02:38:38 pm by chile62 »

Offline chile62

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Re: Lost FOB, KIPASS replacement cost?
« Reply #26 on: September 09, 2019, 01:19:46 pm »
You have to understand something here. Most of us have been on this forum for a LONG time. People come and go but there are a lot of folks that have been here forever. Please check the post counts and you'll see what I mean.

We've seen it time and again. Someone looses their ONE working FOB and comes here for help. Up until now there was only one thing to do and that's to bend over and pay ~$1k to get their bike back on the road.

Now here you come, a guy with 14 posts, and tell us that there's another way to recover from a lost FOB but you won't say much else. Then when someone questions you about it (admittedly, not in the best way but that's how MOB can be), you go off.

What are we to think? What would you think in our positions?

You say that you don't have anything to prove? That's true, you don't. But if you'd like to get along with everyone here and get some help when you need it, then yes, you do have something to prove...

You are 100% right,  i tried to share my knowledge as best as i could above.  My less than ideal communications skills, will probably raise more questions, i will try to answer as best as I can.

Ed

Offline MAN OF BLUES

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Re: Lost FOB, KIPASS replacement cost?
« Reply #27 on: September 09, 2019, 03:32:49 pm »
OK
I've been dealing with Kipass issues for people since 2007.

please explain, exactly what you mean by
"You will need to send them your ignition switch with the black box that is attached to it, plus $380.00"

And also tell us all, exactly how this worked out...

I need some confirmation that you actually did this... I'm not believing it at all. Sorry, but I am skeptical about it in every way.

So please allow me to go back, and explain why I was a skeptic, I was not calling you a "liar", or belittling you in any manner; I wanted clarity and confirmation...

Now, with what you have posted here, and reading the website completely, and understanding "all" of the parts involved, anyone that has lost active fobs, and has no key, or passive fob either, is at the mercy of what I explained in my prior response, #3.

BDF brought up the same thing as I was mulling over, but for clarity I'll take a moment and say a few things about the difference of "making the bike run", and "making the bike run correctly, like it did from the factory"... i.e., with a normal FOB in pocket scenario.

The company you sent the money and parts to, is no different than a foreign one that popped up a while back, in Poland; I addressed the scenario they were "proposing" as the "cure" at that time. Other than trusting sending all that stuff overseas, with no sure outcome (which was verified by someone that did just that, and ended up without his parts, charged $$$, and months later ended up buying e-bay parts).

In both instances, it's clear that they crack open the chip reader on the ignition switch..(it really is only that, a reader...) and replace a module with one that will read a "coded chip", and paired them. This is where the Red Key Black Key, you got, and the box you ended up attaching the passive chip to...   as you ignition switch was already "paired" to the bikes Kipass ECU, it didn't require a KDS.
BUT, had that module been damaged, or you simply didn't have thee stove key, it would have been more involved;  When you got the RED key, you should have placed it against the "bump" on the ignition switch, and seen if the stove knob could be actuated.. likely it would, because the RED key had a chip also (kinda weird they sent you a key that was opposite hand, since you actually sent them YOUR knob key in the first place... ) I guess you could have cut the head off that key, and glued it to the bump, and you would have had the BLACK key (which I assume also has a chip), which worked, and would turn the lock, as your new spare...
End result is:
for the money you spent, you still have no "active FOB", nor can you program one.. all you are doing is using the passive immobilizer.. to start and run the bike. If you loose your key now, you will be back to square one again. Chipped keys are easy to replace, and only run $20 with a chip, or $4 without the chip, but then, if they aren't cut to match the rest of the bikes locks, luggage, fuel tank, seat... etc.. you are still s.o.l.  which was the case the original poster here came to us with..

The only way to make the bike "see" a real pocket fob, is to do what is noted in my #3 posting. period.

By the way, the fellow that felt all insulted, when I explained the whole "Poland company", ended up spending well over $1k+ in the end, as he lost his parts to the Polish repair company, paid them a bunch of $$$, still had no running bike, and ended up "buying all the locks and parts" matched, from e-bay..for like $800 more, and then went online in a facebook page, to call azz on the "unfriendly idiots" from the COG sites, that tried to tell him the simple stuff.  ::) ::) ::) ::)

I will say this tho, if you ever need a "new ECU, or Ignition switch", you will find what I have said, to be very painfully true.
Without an active FOB and a key... you can't program another active fob, which you still don't have.

You also have an "open ignition lock" exposed to the weather, when you remove your stove key... so the result may be, "yes the bike runs", I don't dispute that... but the conditions resultant are not in my opinion, equal to a fully functioning as delivered security system, that works as it was designed.  So, paying $400+, to make the bike run, vs $875 to make a secure bike, as designed, I would say is whatever you think it's worth, either way. I ride in the rain, all the time... I know what my choice would be.
Hopefully, the company the sent you the "fixed" switch and chipped keys, goes to the extent of using "various chip codes"... but in the back of my mind, I think they would just keep coding all those "re-furbs" with the same chipset... so you may not have a "unique" chip anymore....

I do thank you for sharing that all tho, it is a viable means, if needed, someday.

30 YEARS OF KAW.....

Offline MAN OF BLUES

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Re: Lost FOB, KIPASS replacement cost?
« Reply #28 on: September 09, 2019, 03:46:49 pm »
I almost forgot to ask this, but I still must;

Do you get "lost transponder" or "transponder battery" error codes on your dash now?

just asking.. I don't think you sent them the Kipass ECU, so I have to assume these errors will still be on dash.

30 YEARS OF KAW.....

Offline gPink

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Re: Lost FOB, KIPASS replacement cost?
« Reply #29 on: September 09, 2019, 04:17:54 pm »
I took a look and they are really throwing me with the 'red' key and the 'black' key. Especially since they are the exact same price as the active fob, $21.38 each. ?? ?? I believe Ducati has a red (master) and black (slave) keys but of course C-14 keys have no electronics in them in the first place so why two different types? They show all combinations with one red key and the rest black, just as it would work with a Ducati but that is not how the KiPass system works. They further explain that both the keys and fob have to be programmed, which again is odd. And they are calling it the 'KISS' system. ??

Anyway, it all sounds great if it works and is as it appears (a real, active fob for $21 as opposed to a 'credit card' type of fob).

Brian

If I recall, with the Duc, if you lose the red master you're screwed.
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