Author Topic: Lost FOB, KIPASS replacement cost?  (Read 4334 times)

Offline Freddy

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Re: Lost FOB, KIPASS replacement cost?
« Reply #45 on: September 09, 2019, 09:08:22 pm »
What I got was that they have butchered the ignition to install a different chip. I could be wrong - its probably my turn.  :P

They would need to install an antenna loop to read the keyhead too ... no?

Who cares?  He's got a great deal on the first ever solution to KIPASS & lost fob disaster.   :banana
The best substitute for brains is .............what?

Offline MAN OF BLUES

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Re: Lost FOB, KIPASS replacement cost?
« Reply #46 on: September 09, 2019, 09:17:17 pm »
What I got was that they have butchered the ignition to install a different chip. I could be wrong - its probably my turn.  :P

They would need to install an antenna loop to read the keyhead too ... no?

this complete situation, and cure, as cobbled up as it is, only provides Chili's bike to start, and run.

It does NOT offer the bike, to accept and record an active "pocket fob" in order for that to be possible, at least ONE active fob, must be placed in the zone to be sensed, and recorded, before a second "new active FOB" can be programmed..  there is no identity associated with a pocket fob, to access this.. only the "immobilzer functions" can be added.. so Freddy, I'm sorry, but I think you are off on the info. Not trying to be Debbie Downer here, it's just the fact.. an immobilizer chip, does not equal an active pocket fob.

and without a paired fob and ecu, one cannot be "added". an imoobilizer is programmed at a different stage of the FOB process.. without a FOB.. you just have immobilzer, and that will never be changed.

as I noted, it may work to get a ridable bike.. but it is not a representaion of the active fob/bike etc., as noted..

frankly, this bike as is, takes $2k off any selling price, in my honest opinion, or even more off, as anyone purchasing, is totally hosed.. totally hosed.. read that again, slowly.. and understand that statement.


I'm done with this convo, and actually done giving reliable, accurate, and concise helpfull assistance anymore.. this was the last straw.

Later.. best of luck... call me if you have my number.. I work cheap, comparatively.. but... toss the bike.


outta here. Tired of being the azzhole.

46 YEARS OF KAW.....  47 years of DEVO..

Offline Freddy

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Re: Lost FOB, KIPASS replacement cost?
« Reply #47 on: September 09, 2019, 09:21:39 pm »
Oh well, seeing as MOB's outta here it's not worth asking him a question on the ! active fob needed to add another one issue.  But for other interested parties, the process starts on page 26 of the KDS instruction manual, which was written for the early bikes that came with 2 active fobs.  The manual say you must have 'an already registered FOB must be used to be able to turn ON the vehicle to start the process.'  This includes the later passive immobiliser key fob thingy.  p/n 21175-0256 must already have been 'added' to the KIPASS ECU. 
The best substitute for brains is .............what?

Offline MAN OF BLUES

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Re: Lost FOB, KIPASS replacement cost?
« Reply #48 on: September 09, 2019, 09:28:47 pm »
Oh well, seeing as MOB's outta here it's not worth asking him a question on the ! active fob needed to add another one issue.

re read the "sequence" on programming.

you just aren't getting the picture yet.

If I could save somone a bunch of money, I would.. I made it a point when I got half price extended warranties years ago..   do you actually believe i would mislead someone?
WHY would I do that... after 15 years of giving everything I know, here... for free?


yah, bybye. done with this subject'

46 YEARS OF KAW.....  47 years of DEVO..

Offline MAN OF BLUES

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Re: Lost FOB, KIPASS replacement cost?
« Reply #49 on: September 09, 2019, 09:44:20 pm »
ASSuming the procedure is being done, by someone with braaaaaaanze.. and the ability of comprehension, to follow thru... I've played the reprogram game, and will admit, you may have to"re-educate" during the process... just mentioning.

sometimes it takes a couple "tries".

Last Kaw shop I was in, I asked for a job app.. they told me right off I was too old, but took my app..
I actually rode there on the C14, and asked the service manager how many valve adjusts he had done on them.. he looked at the floor.. done deal. evy body funny.. now you funny to..

Might go back and ask them for a job.. I dunno. :deadhorse: :chugbeer: :chugbeer: :1DeadBanana :1DeadBanana :hitfan: :hail:

46 YEARS OF KAW.....  47 years of DEVO..

Offline Michelle

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Re: Lost FOB, KIPASS replacement cost?
« Reply #50 on: September 09, 2019, 10:31:25 pm »
The manual say you must have 'an already registered FOB must be used to be able to turn ON the vehicle to start the process.'  This includes the later passive immobiliser key fob thingy.  p/n 21175-0256 must already have been 'added' to the KIPASS ECU.

Except that now old mate has his bike turned on without a registered fob - thus bypassing that requirement - so as far as I can tell, it should be possible to introduce a new active fob?
When they wrote the manual, I don't think they saw this situation as even possible.
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Offline Freddy

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Re: Lost FOB, KIPASS replacement cost?
« Reply #51 on: September 09, 2019, 10:47:54 pm »
Yes Daisy, that's my understanding too.  My comment was to indicate that as long as the ignition can be turned ON, as KDS states (whether by active, passive, cloned or 'fabricated chip in red & black keys') you can do anything/everything else.

MOB, you really need to do yourself a favour and get ya hands on KDS before you set yourself up as the foremost authority on KDS.  I will provide the software for you.  I don't claim that mantle nor does Michelle (Daisy on another forum we frequent) but we both have KDS and know how to use it. 

Ride safe.   :chugbeer:
The best substitute for brains is .............what?

Offline maxtog

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Re: Lost FOB, KIPASS replacement cost?
« Reply #52 on: September 10, 2019, 05:37:58 am »
Speculation:  It seems unlikely that the system would be designed that if the active fob were lost it would be impossible to add a new active fob by starting the process with only a passive fob (or even the active fob with a dead active transmitter).  The bike has shipped with only a single active fob for 10 years now.  The normal operation premise is that the active fob is taken with the user and the passive fob is the backup, typically stored at home; the most likely lost/damaged fob would be the active one.
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Offline Freddy

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Re: Lost FOB, KIPASS replacement cost?
« Reply #53 on: September 10, 2019, 06:04:37 am »
That speculation is, in fact, how it works.  Chile62, however, has found someone who can 'transplant' something somewhere to fool the KIPASS ECU into recognising a passive fob.  Full points to him & them!
The best substitute for brains is .............what?

Offline Conrad

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Re: Lost FOB, KIPASS replacement cost?
« Reply #54 on: September 10, 2019, 07:09:03 am »
this complete situation, and cure, as cobbled up as it is, only provides Chili's bike to start, and run.

It does NOT offer the bike, to accept and record an active "pocket fob" in order for that to be possible, at least ONE active fob, must be placed in the zone to be sensed, and recorded, before a second "new active FOB" can be programmed..  there is no identity associated with a pocket fob, to access this.. only the "immobilzer functions" can be added.. so Freddy, I'm sorry, but I think you are off on the info. Not trying to be Debbie Downer here, it's just the fact.. an immobilizer chip, does not equal an active pocket fob.

and without a paired fob and ecu, one cannot be "added". an imoobilizer is programmed at a different stage of the FOB process.. without a FOB.. you just have immobilzer, and that will never be changed.

as I noted, it may work to get a ridable bike.. but it is not a representaion of the active fob/bike etc., as noted..

frankly, this bike as is, takes $2k off any selling price, in my honest opinion, or even more off, as anyone purchasing, is totally hosed.. totally hosed.. read that again, slowly.. and understand that statement.


I'm done with this convo, and actually done giving reliable, accurate, and concise helpfull assistance anymore.. this was the last straw.

Later.. best of luck... call me if you have my number.. I work cheap, comparatively.. but... toss the bike.


outta here. Tired of being the azzhole.

Damn, you're tired of being the asshole? There's a solution to that, stop being an asshole. 
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Offline MrPepsi

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Re: Lost FOB, KIPASS replacement cost?
« Reply #55 on: September 10, 2019, 09:18:58 am »
It seems every thread nowadays degrades into someone calling someone else names and people storming off all pissed off. Why can't we all just have civilized conversations anymore?

Who cares if they understand YOUR point of view, they have their own, and they're entitled to it too.
You can only inform them to a point. If they don't absorb the info, you really don't need to tell them 15 more times.
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Offline Rubber_Snake

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Re: Lost FOB, KIPASS replacement cost?
« Reply #56 on: September 10, 2019, 09:25:54 am »
Not to throw gasoline on this little fire, but...

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Kawasaki-GTR-1400-Concours-14-KIPASS-hands-free-FOB-keys-programming/323687902211?hash=item4b5d4d6c03:g:8FEAAOSwIz5cXzCD

This must be that “service” from Poland.  An eBayer with a 90% rating is severely suspect.  Reviews of their service are hit and miss AND I couldn’t find evidence of a GTR being programmed.  Their $555.00 claim:


FOR KAWASAKI GTR 1400 / 1400GTR / CONCOURS 14

The price includes: 1 hands free key FOB (OEM Kawasaki) + 1 spare passive key
programmed and ready to start your bike!

you would have to send us 3 units: ECU, KIPASS and ignition lock,
we will do reprogramming service without cutting neither ECU nor KIPASS plastic case (!)
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Offline B.D.F.

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Re: Lost FOB, KIPASS replacement cost?
« Reply #57 on: September 10, 2019, 11:26:02 am »
As long as you can get into the KiPass system using either method available (passive RFID in the ign. sw. housing or active RF fob that connects with the KiPass ECU under the rider's saddle) then you can alter / add fobs to the system using KDS.

The RFID is a back- door, simplified way into KiPass and it would seem this service chili has found can access that. They <may> be altering the circuitry in the ign. switch housing itself, thereby allowing any RFID chip they want to activate the system.

The red and black keys would not seem to really mean anything, they are simply another device that carries and RFID identifier and so are the same as the inactive part of the original KiPass system. In fact chili said that he had to hold the key that came back with the modified system close to the front of the ign. switch housing, where the RFID scanner is located, to start the bike. Other vehicles use this in different ways but KiPass only has one RFID identifier so there is no 'master' or slave keys. I think the page showing that is a left- over from the other pages that deal with other manufacturer's bikes.

Anyway, it does seem that there is a way to crowbar the system that is substantially less expensive than buying a new KiPass ECU that comes with new fobs. The downside is that it can only be used in emergency mode; if one wanted to use the system as designed, one would still have to purchase a new RF fob (~$300) and have the KiPass ECU coded to recognize it (by a dealer or someone with KDS software).

Brian

Yes Daisy, that's my understanding too.  My comment was to indicate that as long as the ignition can be turned ON, as KDS states (whether by active, passive, cloned or 'fabricated chip in red & black keys') you can do anything/everything else.

MOB, you really need to do yourself a favour and get ya hands on KDS before you set yourself up as the foremost authority on KDS.  I will provide the software for you.  I don't claim that mantle nor does Michelle (Daisy on another forum we frequent) but we both have KDS and know how to use it. 

Ride safe.   :chugbeer:
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Offline maxtog

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Re: Lost FOB, KIPASS replacement cost?
« Reply #58 on: September 10, 2019, 03:27:34 pm »
This must be that “service” from Poland.  An eBayer with a 90% rating is severely suspect.  Reviews of their service are hit and miss AND I couldn’t find evidence of a GTR being programmed.

Shows a flag of Poland on the item, then says "Based in Ireland" on the user... but, whatever.

Not a chance in hell I would send the brains and guts of my $15K bike overseas with $580 to an unknown 90% Ebayer!  No USA phone number.  "No returns".  No references.  No web site.  Can't even find a review of the vendor that says "Kawasaki" or "Concours" or "GTR" in the description.  Wow, talk about risk!!
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Offline gPink

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Re: Lost FOB, KIPASS replacement cost?
« Reply #59 on: September 10, 2019, 04:10:50 pm »
It seems every thread nowadays degrades into someone calling someone else names and people storming off all pissed off. Why can't we all just have civilized conversations anymore?

Who cares if they understand YOUR point of view, they have their own, and they're entitled to it too.
You can only inform them to a point. If they don't absorb the info, you really don't need to tell them 15 more times.

That's funny.....
Thank God for good men willing to do extreme violence.