Author Topic: LED or Other Headlight Bulbs?  (Read 1208 times)

Offline B.D.F.

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Re: LED or Other Headlight Bulbs?
« Reply #20 on: October 17, 2020, 12:38:05 pm »
Yeah, they are called 'tell tales' and they are there to show the rider that the headlights are actually on and working. There is no other reason for them and they are not a functional part of the headlight, outside of being an alert of course. That said, I find most or all C-14 riders do not know they are there and so I guess they are not working to alert anyone of anything anyway. They do work with HIDs in place but I would not personally avoid a lamp that did not produce them anyway- it is easy enough to check headlight function whenever pulling up toward glass or even a constant surface such as a garage door.

Something that was mentioned years ago (I think it was Brian?), there is a ground pattern that the original bulbs and the HID bulbs would throw that slightly proceeded on both sides of the bike. You can see it distinctly in lower right of this photo:

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Offline just gone

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Re: LED or Other Headlight Bulbs?
« Reply #21 on: October 17, 2020, 01:19:22 pm »
Yeah, they are called 'tell tales' and they are there to show the rider that the headlights are actually on and working. There is no other reason for them and they are not a functional part of the headlight, outside of being an alert of course. That said, I find most or all C-14 riders do not know they are there and so I guess they are not working to alert anyone of anything anyway. They do work with HIDs in place but I would not personally avoid a lamp that did not produce them anyway- it is easy enough to check headlight function whenever pulling up toward glass or even a constant surface such as a garage door.


Thanks Brian, I didn't know they actually had a name and purpose, but I mostly mentioned them to point out the focus differences of even the good LEDs.

So Brian, after you get a C14 and get the most important farkles transferred over...are you going to finish the projector headlight project?
Bye the buy the by..all those progress photos are missing from that thread, in case Andrea is looking for something to do.  ;D

Offline B.D.F.

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Re: LED or Other Headlight Bulbs?
« Reply #22 on: October 17, 2020, 01:47:57 pm »
The projector project is actually finished other than permanently attaching the lens (it is stuck there but not weatherproof). And yep, they would go into the new bike (new or used but new to me) should I get one.

I got Photobucketed when Photobucket went to a fee based plan and is holding lots 'o people's photos hostage until we pay up. I moved to Imgur but of course all the links buried in old posts do not know that :-)

Andrea looking for something to do.... yeah, she wants me to tell you she is really enjoying your poll and asked me to start a poll of my own about whether or not I should get a bike when the house is half- finished and we are sleeping in the dining room. Well, she thinks it is a dining room but really it is the downstairs bedroom. I maintain that the house is pretty close and besides, it is much easier walking around on the second floor without all those pesky walls getting in the way- you can just kind of bee- line it to wherever you want to go. It actually makes me think the first floor is a little lacking what with all this plaster, tiles, appliances and accoutrements in general. I mean really, a 4" pipe in the floor works fine as a toilet provided one is careful, right? Sure it takes a couple of minutes to remove and then reapply the tape (the toilet is also the trap so there is nothing to prevent the.... er, aroma from wafting out of the pipe when the fixture is not in place). When did we all get so lazy anyway? It is not like you have to go outside or anything!

P.S. To any Limeys or any English speakers who were educated in English by Limeys: In the US, we keep the first floor on the first floor. You know, the first floor one steps onto when entering the house. The English apparently have moved the first- floor to the second floor for reasons unknown. I do not know if the next floor above is the third floor or the second floor in the UK. And I have no idea what they call the first floor..... maybe the pre- first floor? The first floor B.C.? The upper basement?

Thanks Brian, I didn't know they actually had a name and purpose, but I mostly mentioned them to point out the focus differences of even the good LEDs.

So Brian, after you get a C14 and get the most important farkles transferred over...are you going to finish the projector headlight project?
Bye the buy the by..all those progress photos are missing from that thread, in case Andrea is looking for something to do.  ;D
Homo Sapiens Sapiens and just a tad of Neanderthal but it usually does not show....  My Private mail is blocked; it is not you, it is me, just like that dating partner said all those years ago. Please send an e-mail if you want to contact me privately.

KiPass keeping you up at night? Fuel gauge warning burning your retinas? Get unlimited peace and harmony here: www.incontrolne.com

Offline maxtog

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Re: LED or Other Headlight Bulbs?
« Reply #23 on: October 17, 2020, 04:26:26 pm »
Yeah, they are called 'tell tales' and they are there to show the rider that the headlights are actually on and working. There is no other reason for them and they are not a functional part of the headlight, outside of being an alert of course.

I have always noticed them, but never thought they were intentional.  I guessed they were just an artifact, or irregularity in the reflector.

The projector project is actually finished other than permanently attaching the lens (it is stuck there but not weatherproof). And yep, they would go into the new bike (new or used but new to me) should I get one.

I was wondering whatever happened with that.  A projector is a more ideal solution.  Compact, effective, more control.  Especially nice if coupled with the advantages of an LED light source (although I know yours was an HID project) for low power, low heat, and long lifespan.

Quote
I got Photobucketed when Photobucket went to a fee based plan and is holding lots 'o people's photos hostage until we pay up. I moved to Imgur but of course all the links buried in old posts do not know that :-)

Which is why you should upload photos to the forum, rather than posting vulnerable links which will, inevitably, break :)
Shoodaben (was Guhl) Mountain Runner ECU flash, Canyon Cages front/rear, Helibars risers, Phil's wedges, Grip Puppies, Sargent World seat-low & heated & pod, Muzzy lowering links, Soupy's stand, Nautilus air horn, Admore lightbar, Ronnie's highway pegs, front running lights, all LED, helmet locks, RAM Xgrip, Sena SMH10, Throttle Tamer, MRA X-Creen, BearingUp Shifter, PR4-GT, Scorpion EXO-T1200,etc

Offline B.D.F.

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Re: LED or Other Headlight Bulbs?
« Reply #24 on: October 17, 2020, 07:19:57 pm »
I do not believe LEDs are the best choice for low power, low heat and long lifespan; HIDs outperform LEDs in all those areas. There is some perception that LEDs are very efficient but that is not true when compared with HIDs coupled with the ideas that they are simpler as well as more rugged. In fact, LEDs require a rather elaborate power supply, give off a lot of heat (lowering efficiency) and when used at high temperature, solid state devices tend to be both short lived and and much more prone to a higher failure rate. At this point in time, I believe HIDs used in a one or two headlight configuration originally designed for tungsten lamps are superior to LEDs.

LEDs in housings and lenses made for them originally are a different story. Once the power supply is built, it is relatively simple to power more LEDs with the same unit. Doing that allows each LED to be used at less than max. output, extending the lifespan and returning them or getting much closer to the original robustness of solid state components. And it becomes easy to design much smaller individual units (light source, reflector, lens and housing) and simply use more of them to achieve whatever is desired for light output. In fact I saw a Zero (electric motorcycle) for the first time and that is exactly what they do- use smaller LED light packages and just gang them to get the intensity, and to some degree the pattern that is wanted. It also makes using high beams easy as they are instant on, unlike HIDs which take two seconds to come to 75% power, making individual high and low beams impractical and forcing the designed to either use a tungsten high beam or use a dual pattern lamp housing which effectively blocks nearly half the light when using low beams only.

Yeah, my projector light housing is resting quietly. I had really forgotten about it until again looking at C-14's. The thought of farkeling up a new C-14 is a bit daunting as I think about all the junk I changed or added to my '08 and will want ALL of it on a new bike. And another problem riding a new bike home for any distance- lots of comfort and convenience on my C-14 that allow me to ride a long way. Not sure how far I can ride a stock bike, although I could have some parts shipped to the place where the new bike is purchased and install them there, such as the saddle, tall windshield, pegs and similar. But that creates the problem of shipping all the brand new debris (the parts) back as well. What horrible first- world problems, eh?  :-\ ;) ;D

I generally do not like to upload photos to specific web sites such as a forum because it may prevent me from having the ability to control such photos in the future. As times change, it is nice to be able to go back and remove or alter a photo, especially in these 'moving target' and ever tightening P.C. situations. A photo that was amusing at one time may not be in the future, and a photo of an item perfectly normal now may become controversial or worse in the future. So I tend to like photo sharing sites where I can edit the photos in the future and also control access to them, at least that is the theory.

I have always noticed them, but never thought they were intentional.  I guessed they were just an artifact, or irregularity in the reflector.

I was wondering whatever happened with that.  A projector is a more ideal solution.  Compact, effective, more control.  Especially nice if coupled with the advantages of an LED light source (although I know yours was an HID project) for low power, low heat, and long lifespan.

Which is why you should upload photos to the forum, rather than posting vulnerable links which will, inevitably, break :)
Homo Sapiens Sapiens and just a tad of Neanderthal but it usually does not show....  My Private mail is blocked; it is not you, it is me, just like that dating partner said all those years ago. Please send an e-mail if you want to contact me privately.

KiPass keeping you up at night? Fuel gauge warning burning your retinas? Get unlimited peace and harmony here: www.incontrolne.com

Offline maxtog

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Re: LED or Other Headlight Bulbs?
« Reply #25 on: October 17, 2020, 09:23:27 pm »
I do not believe LEDs are the best choice for low power [...] LEDs in housings and lenses made for them originally are a different story.

That is what I was referring to- a projector LED headlight.

Quote
Yeah, my projector light housing is resting quietly. I had really forgotten about it until again looking at C-14's. The thought of farkeling up a new C-14 is a bit daunting as I think about all the junk I changed or added to my '08 and will want ALL of it on a new bike.

Go for it!

Quote
And another problem riding a new bike home for any distance- lots of comfort and convenience on my C-14 that allow me to ride a long way.

You can do it- it is just one way :)  Seat you can take with you.  I mean, you have to get riding gear and helmet there anyway.  My main concern would be temps- it is approaching the time you would need heated clothing (if not already).

Quote
But that creates the problem of shipping all the brand new debris (the parts) back as well. What horrible first- world problems, eh?  :-\ ;) ;D

Strap it on!  Bungie time!
Shoodaben (was Guhl) Mountain Runner ECU flash, Canyon Cages front/rear, Helibars risers, Phil's wedges, Grip Puppies, Sargent World seat-low & heated & pod, Muzzy lowering links, Soupy's stand, Nautilus air horn, Admore lightbar, Ronnie's highway pegs, front running lights, all LED, helmet locks, RAM Xgrip, Sena SMH10, Throttle Tamer, MRA X-Creen, BearingUp Shifter, PR4-GT, Scorpion EXO-T1200,etc

Offline olie

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Re: LED or Other Headlight Bulbs?
« Reply #26 on: October 18, 2020, 05:36:30 pm »
First approved light replacement using LED in Germany ... for now only H7 ....
https://www.motorradonline.de/ratgeber/osram-night-breaker-nachruestung-legal-led-h7-lampen/
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Offline Boomer

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Re: LED or Other Headlight Bulbs?
« Reply #27 on: October 19, 2020, 04:26:08 am »
P.S. To any Limeys or any English speakers who were educated in English by Limeys: In the US, we keep the first floor on the first floor. You know, the first floor one steps onto when entering the house. The English apparently have moved the first- floor to the second floor for reasons unknown. I do not know if the next floor above is the third floor or the second floor in the UK. And I have no idea what they call the first floor..... maybe the pre- first floor? The first floor B.C.? The upper basement?
We call the one at Ground level, the Ground floor, the one above it the 1st floor, then 2nd floor, etc.
If you live in a house in which the "Ground floor" is raised off the ground, then chances are you are not in the UK, or your house is in a high flood risk area.
In the USA, most of your houses are on posts or stilts, so are raised off the ground with a crawlspace underneath most of them. If building with wood this makes sense, but if building with brick it doesn't. In the UK, wood houses are rare, brick is common.
I guess it all comes down to the locally available building materials and how you build. :-)

W.r.t. LED vs HID, I prefer the LEDs.

The biggest problem with HID in H4 form is that it requires a physical movement of the bulb, normally via a solenoid, to switch from low to high beam and in my experience this is what breaks first.

LEDs have zero moving parts, so long as you don't go for the 3GigaWatt 10Million Lumens versions that require fans to cool them.
The H4 LED in my C10 has lasted 5 years/40k miles/2 crashes so far and still works perfectly.
Yes, it does have an external box, but it's smaller than the HID ballast box it replaced and gives off less heat than the HID ballast box.
Cooling is passive with a large heatsink but there is plenty of room for that on the C10.
The one fitted to my C10 is nearly identical to this but being older has the external box as well.
https://www.superbrightleds.com/moreinfo/miniature-and-subminiature-bulbs/h4-led-fanless-headlight-conversion-kit-with-compact-heat-sink-4000-lumensset/3929/8565/

My C14 still has the OEM bulbs as I find that the light pattern is excellent and the brightness is more than adequate for my use.
I do have 2 LED 10W spots mounted on top of the mirrors that only come on with high beam.
I bought a set of LEDs for it but have never gotten round to fitting them.  :rotflmao:
George "Boomer" Garratt
Wickford, UK


Offline B.D.F.

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Re: LED or Other Headlight Bulbs?
« Reply #28 on: October 19, 2020, 02:21:36 pm »
Yep, that makes sense- our houses are not built on stilts but concrete foundations buried in the ground past the frost line and rising at least 8" above ground level, where the actual house construction starts. What is under a house is pretty dependent on what part of the country it is in- we have full basements or 'cellars' in the northeast but much of the south builds directly on the ground in what we call slab building. The southwest often does use short vertical wooden struts to build on but these again sit on concrete piers.

Yep, you are right about the bi-xenon lights failing- I have had two of them fail on me. Fortunately they tend to fail in the default, low beam position so at least they are not horrible for oncoming traffic. On a motorcycle I always carry a spare bulb, a regular halogen bulb in the event a headlight fails a long way from home, in the middle of the night, etc.

I find not installing farkles on bikes really keeps them fresh and nice looking and working. I have a set of crash bars, brand new, sitting in the shipping box for better than 10 years now and they of course look brand new. The bike not so much but we do have to make sacrifices. The next set I would like to think I will really install but who knows.


In the USA, most of your houses are on posts or stilts, so are raised off the ground with a crawlspace underneath most of them. If building with wood this makes sense, but if building with brick it doesn't. In the UK, wood houses are rare, brick is common.
I guess it all comes down to the locally available building materials and how you build. :-)

W.r.t. LED vs HID, I prefer the LEDs.

The biggest problem with HID in H4 form is that it requires a physical movement of the bulb, normally via a solenoid, to switch from low to high beam and in my experience this is what breaks first.



My C14 still has the OEM bulbs as I find that the light pattern is excellent and the brightness is more than adequate for my use.
I do have 2 LED 10W spots mounted on top of the mirrors that only come on with high beam.
I bought a set of LEDs for it but have never gotten round to fitting them.  :rotflmao:
Homo Sapiens Sapiens and just a tad of Neanderthal but it usually does not show....  My Private mail is blocked; it is not you, it is me, just like that dating partner said all those years ago. Please send an e-mail if you want to contact me privately.

KiPass keeping you up at night? Fuel gauge warning burning your retinas? Get unlimited peace and harmony here: www.incontrolne.com

Offline maxtog

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Re: LED or Other Headlight Bulbs?
« Reply #29 on: October 19, 2020, 02:57:56 pm »
I have a set of crash bars, brand new, sitting in the shipping box for better than 10 years now and they of course look brand new.

If it is a full set (front/rear) of 2nd gen Canyons, those will probably fetch a very decent price now, if you don't use them on your new bike (which you should).  If they are 1st gen, much less value and you can't use them on anything recent you buy at this point.
Shoodaben (was Guhl) Mountain Runner ECU flash, Canyon Cages front/rear, Helibars risers, Phil's wedges, Grip Puppies, Sargent World seat-low & heated & pod, Muzzy lowering links, Soupy's stand, Nautilus air horn, Admore lightbar, Ronnie's highway pegs, front running lights, all LED, helmet locks, RAM Xgrip, Sena SMH10, Throttle Tamer, MRA X-Creen, BearingUp Shifter, PR4-GT, Scorpion EXO-T1200,etc

Offline jwolffie

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Re: LED or Other Headlight Bulbs?
« Reply #30 on: November 01, 2020, 11:23:59 am »
I installed this projector kit: https://www.theretrofitsource.com/motocycle-stage-ii-dual-CRK-CYC-2?quantity=1
It did require me to remove the headlight assembly from the bike and bake it in the oven to remove the front lens to install it. The light output is insane. I added angel eyes for better visibility in daylight, they are switch back so they are white unless I use the turn signals then they flash amber. They do have a very flat cut off so I also added some LED fog lights mounted where the reflectors are on the front wheel so they turn as I corner. I used oven cleaner to remove the chrome from the stock reflectors and painter everything flat black inside of the stock housing. The lights come with a harness that lets everything run off of the battery. I have been running them for 4 years now and here is what I have noticed. The up side is more visibility to oncoming traffic, and much brighter and very white focused light (4300K). With my black bike the police LASAR is very ineffective now, anything over 50 yards and they cant lock in on me so between that and my radar detector no tickets in a long time. The down side is the light dipping issue that is somewhat solved with the fog lights, and the complexity of the system. If a light goes out is it the ballast, igniter, bulb, or harness? It takes a lot of swapping sides to figure it out. I am trying to remove some of the complexity so recently tried using LED bulbs instead of the HID bulbs but I don't like the color output and they are dimmer. I am getting ready to try some Hella 55 watt halogen bulbs in the projectors next to see how that works.
sorry about all of the bugs on my headlights, I just finished a long ride.
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Full Delkevic no cat, Ivan's Flash, Projector headlights, Dunlop Q3+
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Offline jwolffie

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Re: LED or Other Headlight Bulbs?
« Reply #31 on: November 01, 2020, 02:19:13 pm »
more photos
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Offline connie_rider

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Re: LED or Other Headlight Bulbs?
« Reply #32 on: November 01, 2020, 02:44:08 pm »
It sure looks good.

Ride safe, Ted